Pegasus accident in SAW; just reported
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According to Mode-S data transmitted by the aircraft the aircraft landed long and hot, 1500 meters before the runway threshold the aircraft was descending through 950 feet MSL (corrected for local pressure, actual Mode-S reading 1500 feet)/661 feet AGL at 194 knots over ground, touched down about abeam taxiways T/F (about 1950 meters/6400 feet past the threshold, about 1000 meters/3300 feet before the runway end) at about 130 knots over ground, overran the end of the runway at about 63 knots over ground veering slightly to the left (last transponder transmission), hit the localizer antenna runway 06, went over an airport road and a cliff and impacted the airport perimeter wall.
If that is true, this was a criminal negligence case,
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Not attacking you. Chill. Just wondering about their decision making.
On first contact with the tower he called established ILS 06 and was told wind 300/11 kts so basically fully cross. He was then cleared to land and given a wind 270/25 knots which he seems to have missed. I have known tower controllers prompt with a query like, can you accept? The actual tailwind component is not absolutely reliably displayed on the 737 for various reasons. You can have the pilot non flying call it out from the FMC but there are caveats as to its accuracy. So the tower wind is the deciding factor. If you don't process the information and then fail to go-around when you miss the touchdown zone (which I see as just as big an issue as the tailwind) then this is what happens.
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The Trabzon incident was caused by the Captain overriding the FO whom had elected to go around due to vis being below the required minima. The aircraft landed deep with one reverser locked out and slewed off to the left. The crew tried to cover the mess up by claiming the trust levers advanced, which is possible if the aircraft lands in TOGA mode..which i did, real issue is the decision to continue to land.
If Pegasus have done this 3 times; where are the regulators with their oversight of their operation?
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Yet again!!!
Another 737-800 fuselage breaking up in exactly the same places!
As predicted and warned by the Boeing whistleblowers in 2010... see video on YouTube ‘People and Power - On a wing and a prayer’.
How has Boeing got away with this time after time?
Another 737-800 fuselage breaking up in exactly the same places!
As predicted and warned by the Boeing whistleblowers in 2010... see video on YouTube ‘People and Power - On a wing and a prayer’.
How has Boeing got away with this time after time?
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On first contact with the tower he called established ILS 06 and was told wind 300/11 kts so basically fully cross. He was then cleared to land and given a wind 270/25 knots which he seems to have missed. I have known tower controllers prompt with a query like, can you accept? The actual tailwind component is not absolutely reliably displayed on the 737 for various reasons. You can have the pilot non flying call it out from the FMC but there are caveats as to its accuracy. So the tower wind is the deciding factor. If you don't process the information and then fail to go-around when you miss the touchdown zone (which I see as just as big an issue as the tailwind) then this is what happens.
radiosutch, #49, cabin breakup; there appears to some association, but this must not be used to assume 'cause'. Humans tend to find patterns everywhere we look.
However, this concern is worth pursuing because aircraft breakup and possibility of fire on the ground are high risk situations.
Similar thoughts arise from perceptions of the 737's likelihood of an overrun; see previous Pprune thread.
The high levels of safety in the industry reduce opportunity for large data bases for conventional analysis, thus perceptions become increasingly relevant.
Also, in this media rich world, public perception could be an influencing factor - see other threads re 'I wouldn't fly that aircraft'.
For the professionals, the better action is to consider the validated information about the contributing factors in this accident, learn from them, and apply lessons learnt in future operations.
Fuselages don't breakup if the aircraft stops on the runway after a normal landing.
However, this concern is worth pursuing because aircraft breakup and possibility of fire on the ground are high risk situations.
Similar thoughts arise from perceptions of the 737's likelihood of an overrun; see previous Pprune thread.
The high levels of safety in the industry reduce opportunity for large data bases for conventional analysis, thus perceptions become increasingly relevant.
Also, in this media rich world, public perception could be an influencing factor - see other threads re 'I wouldn't fly that aircraft'.
For the professionals, the better action is to consider the validated information about the contributing factors in this accident, learn from them, and apply lessons learnt in future operations.
Fuselages don't breakup if the aircraft stops on the runway after a normal landing.
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I assume the aircraft got airborne again as the incline at the 24 end is extremely steep, I would also assume that when it contacted terra firma again the tail contacted first hence the rear end split, I also assume that hitting the perimeter wall split the nose section... apologies for all the assumptions
Goastdancer, #58, your thoughts are without justification or regulatory requirement. Designs aim to keep the aircraft intact, passengers retained in their 16g seats, and to minimise risk of fire.
Designing structural breaks, with fuel cross-feed or fuel feed to APU, hydraulics, electrics defies logical thought.
Designing structural breaks, with fuel cross-feed or fuel feed to APU, hydraulics, electrics defies logical thought.
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It’s a low and normal speed for 1/2 way down that massive runway. Not as you run off the end. The low speed as they over run the runway absolutely doesn’t indicate a normal landing and roll out. In fact the total obvious. This low and normal speed should have taken place much earlier on.
i think at that point they probably weren’t doing anything other than standing on the brakes and shouting. They weren’t going to out turn the cliff. Not at that speed. The pooch was well and truly screwed before that moment.
i think at that point they probably weren’t doing anything other than standing on the brakes and shouting. They weren’t going to out turn the cliff. Not at that speed. The pooch was well and truly screwed before that moment.
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On first contact with the tower he called established ILS 06 and was told wind 300/11 kts so basically fully cross. He was then cleared to land and given a wind 270/25 knots which he seems to have missed. I have known tower controllers prompt with a query like, can you accept? The actual tailwind component is not absolutely reliably displayed on the 737 for various reasons. You can have the pilot non flying call it out from the FMC but there are caveats as to its accuracy. So the tower wind is the deciding factor. If you don't process the information and then fail to go-around when you miss the touchdown zone (which I see as just as big an issue as the tailwind) then this is what happens.
There is a good paper on this tha covers FMC wind component calculation: Safety aspects of tailwind operationsSafety aspects of tailwind operations Safety aspects of tailwind operations G.W.H. van Es and A.K. Karwal
Video here... It's just me or it seems pretty low and normal speed...?
Those folks driving up the motorway must have had a shock too. See them slowing down & bunching up after the event.
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