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Ukrainian Aircraft down in Iran

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Ukrainian Aircraft down in Iran

Old 8th Jan 2020, 10:52
  #61 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by brentford77 View Post
I think that is not unprecedented. For some strange reason, they do not appear to trust the Trump administration. My guess is that they will retain control of the analysis and data retrieval with the assistance of experts from a country more friendly to them. My money is on Germany.
Trust Boeing, FAA, Trump ?
I wouldn’t be surprised if the analysis isn’t done by BEA in France. Weren’t they the chosen impartial experts chosen by Ethiopia ?
David
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 10:56
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RTM Boy View Post
Missiles are mobile - just consider MH17.
They don't need to be, there is an Iranian commando base just 4 miles NE of the last ADS-B transmitted data position

Last edited by MFC_Fly; 8th Jan 2020 at 11:11.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 10:58
  #63 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by The AvgasDinosaur View Post
Trust Boeing, FAA, Trump ?
I wouldn’t be surprised if the analysis isn’t done by BEA in France. Weren’t they the chosen impartial experts chosen by Ethiopia ?
David
Agreed. My money's on France. The Iran - France relatonship has soured a little over Nuke sanctions in recent times but historically is reasonably friendly. The boxes will probably go there for analysis.
I'm not reading anything sinister in to Iran's refusal to hand them over to Boeing ther than current tensions.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:02
  #64 (permalink)  
 
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Thanks to the avherald site:
(blue markings are mine)
Apparently the aircraft tried to turn around?.




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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:11
  #65 (permalink)  
 
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The remaining flying surfaces indicate shrapnel damage, this would not have occurred from a catastrophic engine failure under any circumstances.

A shoot down.

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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:27
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by kyden View Post
9 crew, according to Avherald and other various news sources. I don't have enough posts yet to share link, but article was just posted within the last 30 mins.
An airline official is quoted as saying 'Given the complexity of the flight there was a reinforced crew on this flight'.

Can anybody explain/elaborate on this?
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:34
  #67 (permalink)  
 
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Hi there guys, signed up to share this information with you. We also located site of the crash and direction, which aligns with the photos in the media already. It does appear they were on a heading back to the airport.

Crash site: 35°33'42.71"N 51° 6'11.98"E

Cant post images as this is a new account so I put them on imgur:

imgur.com/a/cUjWqyj

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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:35
  #68 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by donotdespisethesnake View Post
Was the first flight of the day? .
No. https://www.tehran-airport.com/departures.php
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:37
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by iggie View Post
An airline official is quoted as saying 'Given the complexity of the flight there was a reinforced crew on this flight'.

Can anybody explain/elaborate on this?
If the aircraft had a long time on the ground between flights then you might well have two sets of cockpit crew to manage the duty time. We used to do this sometimes with certain night rotations.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:38
  #70 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by iggie View Post
An airline official is quoted as saying 'Given the complexity of the flight there was a reinforced crew on this flight'.

Can anybody explain/elaborate on this?
In case of Tehran, it probably means, that they do not change crews in Tehran, but fly in and out with the same crew, and the crew is big enough to do that legally, some of the crew being off duty for one leg or parts of it.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 11:48
  #71 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by get_over_it View Post
I wonder if the Canadians were diplomats?
An article in the Globe and Mail says, "Many of the Canadians on board were believed to be Iranian-Canadian students returning to school after the holidays. Flying Ukrainian International Airlines, via the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv, is one of the cheapest routes from Tehran to Toronto." I've read a comment elsewhere that "the Tehran-Kiev-Toronto route is a popular low-cost connection for family visits for the big population of Canadians of Iranian ancestry living in Toronto".
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 12:37
  #72 (permalink)  
 
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One should not conclude missile or uncontained engine debris just from photos of holes in the fuselage etc. Violent breakup events also produce holes like in the photos. In order to assess such differences you need to examine the hole surfaces both macroscopically and as a pattern. Just from photos like above is not enough.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 12:42
  #73 (permalink)  
 
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Looking for any higher resolution images on Google, i found this one, showing the large fuselage side actually covered in rocks and pebbles rather than small holes...

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Old 8th Jan 2020, 12:56
  #74 (permalink)  
 
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Curious as to why somone was filming this particular flight on their mobile phone early in the morning unless they were expecting something to happen to it......... ..... and then continuing to follow when it was almost out of sight behind trees....
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 12:58
  #75 (permalink)  
 
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That's an interesting photo, lots of stones but also an inward hole below one of the windows. Of course that might have been caused for a variety of reasons.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 13:02
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by The Bartender View Post
Looking for any higher resolution images on Google, i found this one, showing the large fuselage side actually covered in rocks and pebbles rather than small holes...
Many thanks, this pretty much changes all the speculation. As I mentioned before, it would have been highly unlikely for authorities to have given the pres access to the wreckage if they had someting to hide.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 13:06
  #77 (permalink)  
 
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These holes remind me something already seen....no conspirators here at all..but little holes are rising some questions!!
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 13:35
  #78 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by A. Muse View Post
Curious as to why somone was filming this particular flight on their mobile phone early in the morning unless they were expecting something to happen to it......... ..... and then continuing to follow when it was almost out of sight behind trees....
Everybody's got a smartphone these days - why would you think it was sinister that somebody recorded video of the crash?

Remember Air France flight 4590? That was 20 years ago - somebody caught that on film...
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 13:39
  #79 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by The Bartender View Post
Looking for any higher resolution images on Google, i found this one, showing the large fuselage side actually covered in rocks and pebbles rather than small holes...
... and some posting remind you why PRUNE can be great.
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Old 8th Jan 2020, 13:42
  #80 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by A. Muse View Post
Curious as to why somone was filming this particular flight on their mobile phone early in the morning unless they were expecting something to happen to it......... ..... and then continuing to follow when it was almost out of sight behind trees....
[Pax] I wondered that too. Presumably a loud noise got their attention first and by the time they realised it was odd and got the camera working the sequence had progressed. Can't see why anyone would take a pot shot so close to a national airport.
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