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BA422 smoke incident Valencia

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BA422 smoke incident Valencia

Old 6th Aug 2019, 20:20
  #61 (permalink)  
 
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Smoke & Fumes - BALPA nailed it in 2005....

Toxic Oil Smoke & Fumes.

BALPA London conference 21st April 2005: https://www.anstageslicht.de/fileadm...005_WINDER.pdf


How embarrassing...
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Old 6th Aug 2019, 22:19
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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Passenger Masks

Does anyone know of any type of breathing mask that a passenger could purchase and pack in their carry-on for when the cabin fills with smoke?
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Old 6th Aug 2019, 23:31
  #63 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Niallo View Post
Does anyone know of any type of breathing mask that a passenger could purchase and pack in their carry-on for when the cabin fills with smoke?
https://www.frontline-safety.co.uk/d...hood-soft-pack
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 00:28
  #64 (permalink)  
 
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I wonder what airport security would have to say on discovering a smoke hood in your bag? Somehow I feel that they would become suspicious...
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 07:26
  #65 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Niallo View Post
Does anyone know of any type of breathing mask that a passenger could purchase and pack in their carry-on for when the cabin fills with smoke?
I've not got time ATM to check the current regs but just be aware that if the smokehood uses chemical methods to generate breathing air (as many do) it's carriage on the aircraft may breach dangerous goods regulations..

Before anybody says " ah but what about " there are exemptions from those rules for certain items carried on board for crew use.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 07:28
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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My friend was on the plane with his family. From a passengers perspective it sounded terrifying. Whether or not the pilots did the right thing I’m far from qualified to say but he said the cabin crew abandoned ship first leaving the passengers to work it out for themselves which sounds disgraceful. He says an off duty BA cabin crew member travelling with their family took over the evacuation in the absence of the crew who got off first(not the flight deck crew, just the cabin crew).

I appreciate the plane was full of smoke and things happened fast but according to him this is 100% what happened, if so this sounds completely unacceptable.
I'm sure it was terrifying, but with respect to your friend I don't believe that's what happened - perhaps from his perspective it appeared that way in the, presumably, apparently rather chaotic scenes of the evacuation.

Oh, and I hope he didn't take his bags with him.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 11:44
  #67 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Shackeng View Post
The Swissair MD11 crash in '98 gives a clue.
The Swissair MD11 wasn't 10 minutes from touchdown?
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 11:53
  #68 (permalink)  
 
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If the operating Cabin Crew left the aircraft prior to the passengers then those operating Cabin Crew ought to be sacked for dereliction of their duty.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 12:15
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by esscee View Post
If the operating Cabin Crew left the aircraft prior to the passengers then those operating Cabin Crew ought to be sacked for dereliction of their duty.
A quick Google search for images of the event taken from inside the aircraft shows that at least one door appeared to be manned by a uniformed Cabin Crew member during the evacuation, so maybe that "if", and the comment upthread that led to it needs to be put on hold for now or at least treated with a bit of scepticism.

Last edited by wiggy; 7th Aug 2019 at 12:45.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 12:35
  #70 (permalink)  
 
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I understood that some CC have to go ahead to be at the bottom of the slide? So you'd expect some of the CC to leap out first?
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 12:42
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Originally Posted by PaxBritannica View Post
I understood that some CC have to go ahead to be at the bottom of the slide?
That is not the SOP at BA - I suppose it might be elsewhere.

The CC may however, and if time permits, nominate/ask for volunteers from amongst the passengers to help at the bottom of the slide.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 12:49
  #72 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wiggy View Post
That is not the teaching at BA - it may be elsewhere.

The CC may however, and if time permits, nominate/ask for volunteers from amongst the passengers to help at the bottom of the slide.
Makes sense given how many slides there are, I suppose. But blimey - I've been down one of those slides (it was training, and there WAS a professional at the bottom) - and I think I'd have broken an ankle if someone hadn't gotten a hand to me.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 12:54
  #73 (permalink)  
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I haven’t seen any reference to any specific odours associated with the fumes/smokes in any of the passengers reports.

Last edited by tubby linton; 7th Aug 2019 at 16:35.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 12:58
  #74 (permalink)  
 
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What is the FO role in an EVAC at BA?
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 14:41
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The generic answer would be that their prime role would be that of contributing to the actioning of the evac checklist on the flight deck, as required/detailed in Fleet SOPs. After that contribute to assisting in clearing the cabin as required/if possible.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 15:02
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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Setting the record straight

hi all

I was on the flight and can help your questions:

1. We were already descending with crew strapped in when the smoke started to fill the cabin. I was in row 11 and there was one flight attendant on her own strapped in to the right facing row 10. When the smoke came in she got on the internal phone and told us she thought it was the A/C.

2. The thickness and speed of the loss of visibility were frightening. The “smoke” was not hot and it wasn’t like bonfire smoke. It smelt horrible enough for people to put their jumpers over their faces but we didn’t ever feel like we didn’t have oxygen. We were afraid that this would change and that the smoke would take over and we wouldn’t be able to breathe. The flight attendant was telling us to try to get our faces down low and we were shouting the message back to others. Because we didn’t have any announcements over the communication system with any explanation of what was going on people were afraid. The only info we had was from the flight attendant who was on the phone. She was visibly afraid but she was also on her own and trying to calm the guy facing her who was having a meltdown. The smoke was very thick but before we knew it we were on the ground. I don’t know what the smoke was but although it smelt horrible it didn’t leave our clothes or bags with a smell afterwards.

3. We landed and people jumped up and shouted “please open the doors”. The flight attendant near to me was trying to get her mask/suit out and on as quickly as possible. She did get it over her head but then for some reason threw it off. She couldn’t open the door straight away - after two or three minutes a light next to the door went on and a beep sounded and then she opened the door. My husband was by the opposite side emergency exit and he couldn’t open the door so he gave up. Once the slide inflated after the flight attendant opened her door we just instinctively jumped down onto it.

3. I was fourth out of the plane and the three people in front did not have their bags with them. It was the ones who piled our after who were carrying their luggage. People had time to grab their bags because the doors weren’t opened immediately and they were queuing to get off. By this time no one was choking, the doors were open and they just felt like it wasn’t an emergency ! I can clarify that I didn’t hear instructions from anyone telling people not to take their bags but I was off that plane like a shot !

4. I saw one or two fire engines and one fireman. I initially stood at the bottom along the slide to catch people but they flew past me so fast I couldn’t catch anyone ! The fireman came and took over !

5. We were directed straight to buses. And driven to the terminal. The cabin crew came down the slides after the last passengers. I spoke to them as they came off the slides. They were really shaken. I saw them come into the terminal nearly three hours later and they’d been out at the plane the whole time. When we were bussed back out to pick up our hand luggage hours later the pilot was till on the plane. The crew were very shaken and said that they had never gone through this in a real situation before and couldn’t believe that people Took bags down the slides. I asked why there wasn’t more instruction and they said that people are meant to follow what they’re told during the safety briefing.

6. The ground staff were ill equipped for the situation. We were brought into the terminal and had to explain why we didn’t have our passports. We all sat on an empty baggage carousel for three hours. The liaison lady came in from home and just kept saying that they were securing the plane so we could get our bags. We were brought boxes of water when we complained that we were hot and thirsty and deydrated. We should have been taken to an empty departure lounge with seats and been looked after properly really. When the flight attendants came through they were shocked to see us all there and they stopped to talk to me. One flight attendant called the pilot on his mobile and arranged for the turn around person to come into the terminal and help us. He arrived five minutes later and took us back to the plane 5 at a time to get our luggage. When we asked about the hold luggage they didn’t know how long it would be. Someone told us to go to customer services to leave our names but there was a mile long queue of people who were trying to get home given their flights were cancelled. My husband and I just left with our kids. We got our bags back by filing a missing luggage report. An exhausted courier arrived at 10pm the next night having delivered a lot of bags !

7. It’s taken two days to get a proper email from BA with a contact line for help over the trauma.

I hope that helps and maybe with this info someone can tell me what they think the smoke was
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 15:10
  #77 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wiggy View Post
That is not the SOP at BA - I suppose it might be elsewhere.

The CC may however, and if time permits, nominate/ask for volunteers from amongst the passengers to help at the bottom of the slide.
Thank you for clarification re BA SOP.

Per my post above, at USAirways the F/A would remain at the top of the slide "helping(!)" the psgrs on to it. Three helpers would be tapped on the shoulder and told to assist at the bottom. (If they wandered away then new designees would be voluntold to assist at the bottom.) I also know this to be the case at DL. It only makes sense for the professionals to be at the top of the slide, making sure the psgrs don't bottle out and refuse to slide.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 15:45
  #78 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tubby linton View Post
...odours associated with the fumes/smokes from any of the passengers.
Prolly 'cos the passengers weren't on fire.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 15:51
  #79 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tubby linton View Post
I haven’t seen any reference to any odours associated with the fumes/smokes from any of the passengers.
The smoke was described as "acrid" in reports from the BBC and several of the dailies, as per my previous post.
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Old 7th Aug 2019, 16:43
  #80 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
The smoke was described as "acrid" in reports from the BBC and several of the dailies, as per my previous post.
You would be hard pushed to find any smoke that isn’t acrid. I was thinking more along the lines of the smelly sock/wet dog aroma
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