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Pax Jet in water at NAS Jacksonville, all OK

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Pax Jet in water at NAS Jacksonville, all OK

Old 4th May 2019, 03:08
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Pax Jet in water at NAS Jacksonville, all OK

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Old 4th May 2019, 03:24
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Rwy 08/26 strip is 10,000’ long, 150’ wide

Rwy 14/32 strip is 7701’ long, 150’ wide
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Old 4th May 2019, 03:28
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Originated at Gitmo.
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Old 4th May 2019, 03:30
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Miami Air Charter 737 from NAS Guantanamo in Cuba to NAS Jacksonville 940PM EDT. All aboard survived. Normal redeployment flight. Lots of CBs in area but I have no idea if this was a factor.

Last edited by Lake1952; 4th May 2019 at 12:21.
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Old 4th May 2019, 03:32
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Miami Air. Possible military charter 737-800
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Old 4th May 2019, 03:49
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Originally Posted by Akali Dal View Post
Rwy 08/26 strip is 10,000’ long, 150’ wide

Rwy 14/32 strip is 7701’ long, 150’ wide
That's Jacksonville International/KJAK. They went into Jacksonville NAS/KNIP. A 9003 foot 10/28 with a 1000 overrun before you go into the river, Looks like it had been raining for a while before they arrived. METARs running 2 to 3 miles in heavy rain and thunderstorm around the accident time if the news report time is right.
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Old 4th May 2019, 05:22
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How many 738s has Miami Air got? Wikipedia says it could be 4 or 6. I saw two in Nadi on Thursday night which are on charter to FJ.
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Old 4th May 2019, 05:31
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Gear still attached? Appears fairly level in the water. Lost the nose I assume plowing through the approach lights, grass obviously didn’t slow them down much!

How long did they land (or float) I wonder...


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Old 4th May 2019, 06:42
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738 + <10000ft/3000m runway + wet slippery stuff + (possibly) 8-gusting-16 tailwind (290°) = bring your "A" game, or rethink the situation before committing.

Of course, we don't know what actual information crew received on BA or winds.

METARs for 3 minutes after accident and 20 minutes before accident (per Aviation Herald):

KNIP 040145Z 29008G16KT 3SM +TSRA BR SCT008 BKN015CB OVC032 24/22 A2999 RMK AO2 TSB04 FRQ LTGIC OHD TS OHD MOV E T1 SET P0063 T02440222 $=
KNIP 040122Z 35004KT 5SM +TSRA BR SCT008 BKN018CB OVC030 24/22 A2998 RMK AO2 TSB04 FRQ LTGIC OHD TS OHD MOV E T1 SET P0010 T02440222 $=
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:03
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Passenger Cheryl Bormann told CNN's Don Lemon the plane flew through lightning and thunderstorms on the way to Jacksonville.
"As we went down, we had a really hard landing," the defense attorney said. "And then the plane bounced and screeched and bounced some more. It lifted to the right and then it lifted to the left. And it then it sort of swerved, and then it came to a complete like crash stop."

Source: CNN Article "(apparently I can't post links yet)
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:08
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You can disregard the gusts as far as approach planning is concerned, but this event demonstrates why a gusty tailwind with a wet runway is a problem. The actual wind on touchdown is also hard to be certain about given the way the computer calculates the wind triangle as has been discussed a few times. Going around into a thunderstorm ahead raises other issues. Not getting into the situation in the first place is the best solution, but easier to say after the event.
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:43
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Originally Posted by Water pilot View Post
I get 'Sorry, this content is not available in your region' from the link. Here is an alternative article link that may work for you.

Last edited by kiwibrit; 4th May 2019 at 07:44. Reason: typo
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:15
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FR24 showing a late decision to change runway to 10? https://www.flightradar24.com/data/a...732ma#2062a337

Perhaps the approach path was better from the west, but they didn't factor in the gusts for a tailwind on final?
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Old 4th May 2019, 08:59
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Tailwind, wet runway and not an especially long one at that. Tailwinds are never the best idea unless you have miles of tarmac and decent conditions, so that has to be a questionable plan. This kind of issue has caught out a few in the past though and I wonder what their fuel situ was; did that apply pressure to get in?
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Old 4th May 2019, 11:38
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Originally Posted by lederhosen View Post
You can disregard the gusts as far as approach planning is concerned, but this event demonstrates why a gusty tailwind with a wet runway is a problem. The actual wind on touchdown is also hard to be certain about given the way the computer calculates the wind triangle as has been discussed a few times. Going around into a thunderstorm ahead raises other issues. Not getting into the situation in the first place is the best solution, but easier to say after the event.
Why would you disregard the gusts in approach planning? I certainly don’t!
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Old 4th May 2019, 11:40
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Thunderstorm within 3 miles of landing runway or approach corridor means find another option of divert. Why this concept is so ignored eludes me. If you do choose to ignore it you are playing roulette. Do you feel lucky?
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Old 4th May 2019, 12:11
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Disregard as a limitation e.g. max tailwind 10 knots or for some 737s 15 knots.
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Old 4th May 2019, 12:20
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Originally Posted by lederhosen View Post
Disregard as a limitation e.g. max tailwind 10 knots or for some 737s 15 knots.
In my experience, 15 knots is an airfield specific limitation written within part C. 10 knots as a general limitation. Twc, storm soaked runway and TS everywhere scares the bejesus out of me. Easy to say as a bystander however I’m pretty sure i would’ve bugged out
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Old 4th May 2019, 12:22
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Originally Posted by Sailvi767 View Post
Thunderstorm within 3 miles of landing runway or approach corridor means find another option of divert. Why this concept is so ignored eludes me. If you do choose to ignore it you are playing roulette. Do you feel lucky?
Bingo. And just because the aircraft in front of you got in with no issues doesn't mean you will.
I don't know about other companies but, mine has some pretty black and white Sops about arrivals and departures with approaching storms. It horrifies me seeing some (big name) carriers who ignore the potential dangers and play Russian Roulette with the lives of 100s of people. Most of the nasty weather from a cell can move through in 15 mins or less. Just wait FFS

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Old 4th May 2019, 12:29
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When I flew the 737 we had some with 10 knots and some with 15 knots limitation in the OM. In this case the metar winds seem to have been light and variable most of the time with a strong westerly component only as the storm passed through, which was unfortunately just at the time they tried to land. With hindsight a few minutes holding would probably have made all the difference.
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