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last 727 Pax Flight

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last 727 Pax Flight

Old 17th Jan 2019, 14:06
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pattern_is_full View Post

Some airlines actually eventually had plates bolted across the flap-handle quadrant to prevent selecting flaps 40.
.
TWA installed that block.
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 16:21
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cattlerepairman View Post
One of my favourite 727 videos: VFR into Engadin airport, Switzerland. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=js4WQd7XSs8

Flaps AND speed brakes :-)
Geez. That is like a Space Shuttle approach. Glideslope of about 20 degrees, from 50,000 feet down to runway in 4 minutes.
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 16:57
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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There are at least 3 VIP 727s flying and one that has recently been purchased by 2excel for passenger charter (N724YS). Another one, HZ-AB3 has been standing at Lasham airfield for a while, not sure of the status.
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 17:10
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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There are around 75 727s still active around the world of which, surprisingly, there are only a dozen or so of the 70-odd 727REs.
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 18:26
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Always used to enjoy when on my regular holidays in the early 1980's at EYW Key West watching the screaming and smoking 727-100's of Eastern and National coming in over the old town with that wing 50% more all hanging out and down with flaps 40.
The LDA at EYW was around 4500' but they would usually stop in about 1500' - not sure if they used the NLG brakes too

The 727-100 was an impressive beast - so pleased I managed to get my first ride on one - the Wardair 727

Is there anything today that has the oomph performance and comparison of the 727-100 ?
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 18:31
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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Seen at Lasham in September along with a few other examples, not all in one piece unfortunately..
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 19:51
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pattern_is_full View Post

Some airlines actually eventually had plates bolted across the flap-handle quadrant to prevent selecting flaps 40.
.
It was part of the Stage 3 noise compliance. The noise certification is an average of a takeoff and landing. The normal engined 727s exceeded the standards for takeoff but by reducing the amount of sheet metal in the breeze they would come in below the limit for landing and by enough margin to balance out the TO noise.
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 19:55
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by rog747 View Post
Always used to enjoy when on my regular holidays in the early 1980's at EYW Key West watching the screaming and smoking 727-100's of Eastern and National coming in over the old town with that wing 50% more all hanging out and down with flaps 40.
The LDA at EYW was around 4500' but they would usually stop in about 1500' - not sure if they used the NLG brakes too

The 727-100 was an impressive beast - so pleased I managed to get my first ride on one - the Wardair 727

Is there anything today that has the oomph performance and comparison of the 727-100 ?
Did the 100s have NLG Brakes?

We had some 200adv with NLG Brakes. These brakes never ever became activ.
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 20:47
  #49 (permalink)  
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Had a jump seat ride into Burlington Vt. many, many years ago in a United -100 series 727.

Gin clear CAVU day, the crew got the field and declared visual some way south over lake Champlain.

The skipper joined on a tight right base (runway 15 I think it was at the time) the wings were rolled level on the centreline at 500’, the wheels “caressed” the ground for the most graceful, smooth touchdown. The calmest, slickest, most unhurried example of sheer finesse that I still recall, in awe, to this day.

After much joshing (“are we down yet?” etc.) from the F/O and the F/E, The old boy just dismissed his obvious skill by giving all the credit to what he described as “Mr. Boeing’s finest” I suspect though, Mr. Boeing’s finest wasn’t the easiest of mounts.

Magnificent aeroplane. Was definitely on my bucket list. I’d love to have flown it.
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 20:54
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by gearlever View Post
Did the 100s have NLG Brakes?

We had some 200adv with NLG Brakes. These brakes never ever became activ.
I think they were an option vs standard equipment so they show up sporadically in fleets. We got a couple of -100s from the Northeast merger and they had NLG brakes, IIRC. And you had to get on the brakes pretty hard for them to kick in...something like 50% pedal travel ? It's been a very long time so don't bet any money on my recall at this point.

And speekbrakes with flaps extended ?
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Old 17th Jan 2019, 21:07
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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The 727 was the first jet that I flew. It was nice most of the time. It was possible to grease it in but also I have had my worst landings in that airplane too. Normally that happened after a very stable approch in perfect weather. I never understood what I did wrong. Some captains told me to push the yoke forward during the flare. That worked fine some of the time but not always. The next one was the 747. I fell in love with that one immediately. It was always consistent.
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 00:12
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SeenItAll View Post
Geez. That is like a Space Shuttle approach. Glideslope of about 20 degrees, from 50,000 feet down to runway in 4 minutes.
I haven't watched the video, but I doubt there was any variation of the 727 that could go above FL 420.
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 00:15
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by svhar View Post
The 727 was the first jet that I flew. It was nice most of the time. It was possible to grease it in but also I have had my worst landings in that airplane too. Normally that happened after a very stable approch in perfect weather. I never understood what I did wrong. Some captains told me to push the yoke forward during the flare. That worked fine some of the time but not always. The next one was the 747. I fell in love with that one immediately. It was always consistent.
Once you were in ground effect, you retarded the throttles and relaxed the back pressure. You didn't push forward.
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 01:59
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by aterpster View Post
Once you were in ground effect, you retarded the throttles and relaxed the back pressure. You didn't push forward.

Varient specific.
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 02:13
  #55 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by rog747 View Post
Always used to enjoy when on my regular holidays in the early 1980's at EYW Key West watching the screaming and smoking 727-100's of Eastern and National coming in over the old town with that wing 50% more all hanging out and down with flaps 40.
The LDA at EYW was around 4500' but they would usually stop in about 1500' - not sure if they used the NLG brakes too

The 727-100 was an impressive beast - so pleased I managed to get my first ride on one - the Wardair 727

Is there anything today that has the oomph performance and comparison of the 727-100 ?
i live right next to the cemetery. I’m glad they’re not coming here anymore.
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 02:16
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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I was an ATC flow controller in Australia many years ago and provided there was not much turbulence the 727-200s of Ansett (now gone) and TAA (now Qantas) would do 350 kts to 20 nm to touchdown for an ILS or visual approach and beat anything else in the sky. Hats off to those flight crews and the 727!

Last edited by Bravo Romeo Alpha; 18th Jan 2019 at 02:17. Reason: spelling
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 02:29
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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When I was a kid in Pueblo, CO, United did 727 pilot training out of the local airport. We had a new house on the very east end of town, and you could literally see the airport out the back window on a nice day. I'd often sit out back on a large dirt pile and just watch them do countless touch-and-go landings.

Most memorable flight I ever had on a 727 was Seattle to Salt Lake about 30 years ago. We were behind schedule, and I was concerned about making my connection in Salt Lake - as we started our takeoff roll the center engine surged. I was sitting near the front of the aircraft, but it was still so loud only my seat belt kept me in my seat (I've heard several engine surges during flight testing in the years since, but none were anywhere near that loud inside the aircraft). After the initial shock from the bang, my next thought was 'damn, I'll never make my connection now' but they continued on with the takeoff as if nothing had happened . When I was getting off after we landed in Salt Lake, I was in a rush but I still took a minute to ask the pilot standing in the flight deck door about continuing the takeoff after the surge. He immediately started into an explanation of what a surge was but I quickly cut him off - 'I work jet engines and I know what a surge is - I was just surprised you continued the takeoff after the surge'. 'Oh, well if we'd aborted I just would have turned around and tried again - so we just retarded the throttle, made sure it recovered, then advanced it and continued...'
I know well that the 727 center inlet was prone to separation that could cause a surge, and that the JT8D engine was unlikely to suffer damage from a surge. I'm also sure the pilot in question had experienced his fair share of JT8D surges, but I was never quite as comfortable flying on a 727 after that...
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 05:47
  #58 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 4runner View Post


i live right next to the cemetery. I’m glad they’re not coming here anymore.
AAAW - were you living in Key West back then too? do you recall any airlines bringing the 727-200 into EYW or was the runway too short?

Out of interest what big jets go in there now?

Not been to Key West on hols for over 20 years as it is now so expensive but I'm planning a trip this year to maybe have a slow drive down the Keys.

My last flights back in the day MIA-EYW-MIA were on rather ghastly very small turboprops (Banderante?)

Had some wonderful vintage prop flights on PBA airways on their DC3's and Martin 404's
walking out to one of these at EYW leaving at sunset in warm balmy air and swaying palm trees to fly back to MIA for a Laker or Air Florida DC-10 to Gatwick
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 08:00
  #59 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tdracer View Post
...as we started our takeoff roll the center engine surged. I know well that the 727 center inlet was prone to separation that could cause a surge...
tdracer,

Now that you mention it, I do have a vague recall of something in our manuals about the #2 engine, the possibility of surge and x-winds on T/O. I think it was to spool it up with the others but not advance it to T/O power until rolling at some speed ? All my 727 manuals are buried in the storage locker...and I'm lazy.

West Coast ? aterpster ?
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 10:22
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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De Havilland designed and manufactured a British tri-jet named (unsurprisingly) the Trident. During the design stage a plan was floated to collaborate on the project with Boeing, who had also come up with the 3-tail-mounted engines 130-seater concept. But the British government interfered, requiring DH to scale the aircraft down to meet the state-owned domestic airline's requirements so the two manufacturers went their separate ways. Result: Trident sales - 117, B727 sales - 1832.

The T-bird prototype flew a year before the 727. It was a delight to fly, with cruise M0.84 or more (gas-guzzling was OK in the days of cheap fuel). During descent it was permissible to select limited reverse on the pod engines (but not below 2000 ft AGL) so impressive plummets while decelerating were available if required.

Take-off performance wasn't so sparkling - the aircraft was affectionately known as the 'ground gripper'.

In its favour, the Trident was the first airliner in the world to be certified for autoland in low visibilities.
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