Ryanair pilot strike
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Ryanair tries to prevent a strike in the Netherlands by going to court, while the Dutch pilots still hadn't decide to strike or not.
Their answer, strike on friday...
https://www.vnv.nl/news/vrijdag-10-a...r-in-nederland
Their answer, strike on friday...
https://www.vnv.nl/news/vrijdag-10-a...r-in-nederland
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Like a lot of employers these days, MOL is learning,albeit slowly, these facts.
= Treat your employees like sh*t, they will turn on you.
= The employees are a companys greatest asset.
Pilots aren't known to stick together, however at the moment there must be huge dissatisfaction within the ranks to get this type of collective response. He didn't take his chances to negotiate earlier on, now he is going to pay.. Serves him right.
= Treat your employees like sh*t, they will turn on you.
= The employees are a companys greatest asset.
Pilots aren't known to stick together, however at the moment there must be huge dissatisfaction within the ranks to get this type of collective response. He didn't take his chances to negotiate earlier on, now he is going to pay.. Serves him right.
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Strike approved by the judge in the Netherlands.
see attached link (Dutch only)
https://www.nu.nl/economie/5405948/r...t-vrijdag.html
In short strike approved, next time the Dutch union needs to announce the strike 72 hours in advance.
see attached link (Dutch only)
https://www.nu.nl/economie/5405948/r...t-vrijdag.html
In short strike approved, next time the Dutch union needs to announce the strike 72 hours in advance.
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This is total BS
There is a global structural shortage of aircrew, which will only continue to get worse as older pilots retire, and other opportunities for the rest continue to grow.
Boeing have predicted this situation for well over 10 years and there have already been failures of regional airlines in the USA due to shortage of crew. In this case ultimately crew are fine because new jobs are created as competitors move in to fill the void - just look what happened at MON and AB
The simple choice for Ryanair is to either addapt to the changing labor situation, or otherwise find out the hard way that the previous business model is no longer sustainable in the current market.
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The simple choice for Ryanair is to either addapt to the changing labor situation, or otherwise find out the hard way that the previous business model is no longer sustainable in the current market.
The fundamental flaw in Ryanair's thinking is that:
- Pilots own their log book hours
- Pilots own their endorsements
- Aviation is globalised.
Over in the USA is a highly unionised, well paid airline, who also operates in the Low Fare sector. Their CEO and company sinew is different.
"A company is stronger if bounded by love than fear-Herb Kelleher"
Ryan air will need to change to meet the new paradigm. If they don't they will realise the truism that it is hard to operate an airline without operating revenue.
Little Napoloen (Alan Joyce) in the antipodes, famously remarked cicra 2004 at a Sydney hotel press conference speaking of the Jetstar pilot model: "We will work them hard for 5 to 7 years and then replace them"
Many airlines have tried to replicate the Southwest structure, however cherry picking bits of it, whilst maintaining the adversarial model has yielded very little.
You cannot fake sincerity, but the worse it gets for industrial bullies like Mr O'Leary and eventually 'downunder' too (Alan Joyce) they will try!
Last edited by Rated De; 9th Aug 2018 at 21:31. Reason: typo
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412 times zero= zero.
Wonder how long it takes to permeate to the board?
Pass the popcorn, the industry needs a purge like this!
Wonder how long it takes to permeate to the board?
- Does the IAA require RPT schedules to be maintained as per AOC requirements? Below what threshold are RYR required to explain?
- Do airport operators have a contractual remedy for their loss of revenue? That is if airlines don't use the gate, pay landing fees etc the 'business model' of airports will implode..funny that.
Pass the popcorn, the industry needs a purge like this!
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EU 261 compensation = 250 EUR per passenger!
Given about 75k passengers impacted I make that just shy of 19m EUR potential exposure, just for tomorrows strikes. That's a dead loss, in addition to costs of refunds or rebooking.
Of course FR are trying to weasel out of it, but the media and various regulators are already on to it and are vigerously encouraging people to claim. I believe the Spanish regulator even had people handing out claim forms at the airport.
The longer this dispute goes on, the more publicity EU261 will recieve, so awareness will spread of the right to claim, and how to do this sucsefully. Once this cat is out the bag its not going back, having a permanent ongoing impact on FR costs and losses, due to increased levels of claims for regular delays and cancellations besides strikes.
So the idea that FR can 'ride out' prolonged mass strikes is preposterous.
Avoiding EU 261 requires 2 weeks notice of cancellation and most EU countries only require a few days notice or less for strikes. Think about that.
Given about 75k passengers impacted I make that just shy of 19m EUR potential exposure, just for tomorrows strikes. That's a dead loss, in addition to costs of refunds or rebooking.
Of course FR are trying to weasel out of it, but the media and various regulators are already on to it and are vigerously encouraging people to claim. I believe the Spanish regulator even had people handing out claim forms at the airport.
The longer this dispute goes on, the more publicity EU261 will recieve, so awareness will spread of the right to claim, and how to do this sucsefully. Once this cat is out the bag its not going back, having a permanent ongoing impact on FR costs and losses, due to increased levels of claims for regular delays and cancellations besides strikes.
So the idea that FR can 'ride out' prolonged mass strikes is preposterous.
Avoiding EU 261 requires 2 weeks notice of cancellation and most EU countries only require a few days notice or less for strikes. Think about that.
Last edited by Sonikt; 10th Aug 2018 at 03:56.
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Good luck and well done to those making a stand, personally I think other airlines are in similar situations with overall staffing issues. Where I currently operate the training staff have been getting it hard for years and there are strengthening undertones in those ranks that are now migrating outwards to line crews and management.
Why? It’s the same as Ryanair, incredibly poor middle management unable to voice concerns to high profile directors who are interested in nothing more than headline profits. Pair this with inept crewing practices, poor rostering and the perfect storm brews.
Well done the boys and girls of Ryanair, you are the first but not the last.
Why? It’s the same as Ryanair, incredibly poor middle management unable to voice concerns to high profile directors who are interested in nothing more than headline profits. Pair this with inept crewing practices, poor rostering and the perfect storm brews.
Well done the boys and girls of Ryanair, you are the first but not the last.
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Again, I add my support to the pilots in Ryanair that are finally doing some to stop the rapacious tactics Ryanair has used for so long. How noticeable it is too that UK pilots are not part of this strike. It says nothing about the depth of feeling and commitment to change by the pilots and everything about the law in the UK that makes strike action by employees so difficult, thanks to changes made in 1980s by the government of the time. I hope that BALPA and UK pilots can work through the legal mine field and strike too, to change things for the better.
The entire sinew of Ryanair is predicated on unlimited supply of labour. The process or recruitment, management and disposal of staff, has at its genesis an 'assumption' that what leaves is simply replaced. (and cheaply) With minimal sunk costs in the labour unit itself (think pilot training, pensions and even uniforms) the loss for the company was minimised. If one considers the EU itself, there are nations here where the demographics helped them sustain this practice.
The fundamental flaw in Ryanair's thinking is that:
Over in the USA is a highly unionised, well paid airline, who also operates in the Low Fare sector. Their CEO and company sinew is different.
"A company is stronger if bounded by love than fear-Herb Kelleher"
Ryan air will need to change to meet the new paradigm. If they don't they will realise the truism that it is hard to operate an airline without operating revenue.
Little Napoloen (Alan Joyce) in the antipodes, famously remarked cicra 2004 at a Sydney hotel press conference speaking of the Jetstar pilot model: "We will work them hard for 5 to 7 years and then replace them"
Many airlines have tried to replicate the Southwest structure, however cherry picking bits of it, whilst maintaining the adversarial model has yielded very little.
You cannot fake sincerity, but the worse it gets for industrial bullies like Mr O'Leary and eventually 'downunder' too (Alan Joyce) they will try!
The fundamental flaw in Ryanair's thinking is that:
- Pilots own their log book hours
- Pilots own their endorsements
- Aviation is globalised.
Over in the USA is a highly unionised, well paid airline, who also operates in the Low Fare sector. Their CEO and company sinew is different.
"A company is stronger if bounded by love than fear-Herb Kelleher"
Ryan air will need to change to meet the new paradigm. If they don't they will realise the truism that it is hard to operate an airline without operating revenue.
Little Napoloen (Alan Joyce) in the antipodes, famously remarked cicra 2004 at a Sydney hotel press conference speaking of the Jetstar pilot model: "We will work them hard for 5 to 7 years and then replace them"
Many airlines have tried to replicate the Southwest structure, however cherry picking bits of it, whilst maintaining the adversarial model has yielded very little.
You cannot fake sincerity, but the worse it gets for industrial bullies like Mr O'Leary and eventually 'downunder' too (Alan Joyce) they will try!
I still remember the look of fear in the manager's eyes when we proposed some of these measures. It was too difficult, too difficult to justify to those above them and they ran for the hills, with all the problems still intact. O'Leary's is no different.
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Hey Guys/Girls. As an aviator and someone with global flying and work experience, perhaps I can make a presumptuous suggestion or propose an idea. Why doesn’t a US pilot union get involved in European labor issues? I’ve worked overseas without a union, in the US without a union and in the US with ALPA and Teamsters. I can say, with very few exceptions and through experience that having a union to back you up and represent our interests is many legs up on being caught “high and dry”. Has anyone proposed even speaking to a pilots union that could Represent European pilots as a WHOLE, instead of being divided, conquered and screwed by management? As long as no one from Thpain is involved...
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Hey Guys/Girls. As an aviator and someone with global flying and work experience, perhaps I can make a presumptuous suggestion or propose an idea. Why doesn’t a US pilot union get involved in European labor issues? I’ve worked overseas without a union, in the US without a union and in the US with ALPA and Teamsters. I can say, with very few exceptions and through experience that having a union to back you up and represent our interests is many legs up on being caught “high and dry”. Has anyone proposed even speaking to a pilots union that could Represent European pilots as a WHOLE, instead of being divided, conquered and screwed by management? As long as no one from Thpain is involved...
As noted above it is indeed interesting that MOL rejected a single negotiating committee and now has to deal with 10 variations of something he doesn't seem to understand. Good luck and stamina to all pilots involved (and to cabin crews as well!). We should all petition our pilot reps to put enough resources in this fight (even if the share of Ryanair pilot members is still small) as a change in work practices at Ryanair will undoubtedly benefit all European pilots.
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Ironically no doubt this will harden union positions on the very central issue of base transfers; because there is no gain in negotiating decent terms in one area, if these rights can effectively be stripped simply by transferring staff to another country, where perhaps the local labor laws are weaker
Last edited by Sonikt; 10th Aug 2018 at 14:51.
