A380 upsets A380
Thread Starter
A380 upsets A380
Passengers have described the terrifying moment a vortex sent their Qantas flight into a 10-second “nosedive”.
Hundreds of horrified travelers held hands *believing they were about to die as the aircraft suddenly dropped over the Pacific Ocean on Sunday.
The dramatic ordeal afflicting passengers on the QF94 from Los Angeles to Melbourne is understood to have been caused by the vortex, or “wake turbulence” caused by another aircraft which took off just two minutes earlier.
QF94 passenger Janelle Wilson told The Australian the “three-quarters-full” plane suddenly entered a “free fall nosedive … a direct decline towards the ocean” for about 10 seconds.
“It was between 1½ and two hours after we left LA and all of a sudden the plane went through a violent turbulence and then completely up-ended and we were nose*diving,” Wilson told newspaper yesterday.
“We were all lifted from our seats immediately and we were in a free fall. It was that feeling like when you are at the top of a rollercoaster and you’ve just gone over the edge of the peak and you start heading down.
“It was an absolute sense of losing your stomach and that we were nosediving. The lady sitting next to me and I screamed and held hands and just waited but thought with absolute certainty that we were going to crash. It was terrifying.”
Thankfully nobody on-board the aircraft, with a seat capacity of 484, was injured.
Vortexes can be caused when flights are too close together. (US Air Force)
The QF12 flight took off from Los Angeles at 11:27pm Sunday night (US time), 57 minutes behind schedule. While the QF94 service, which departed at 11:29pm, 49 minutes late, landed safely but 30 minutes late in Melbourne at 8am on Tuesday.
According to flight safety experts at SKYbrary wake vortexes cause severe turbulence which is generated by the passage of another aircraft in flight. Basically, there is not sufficient separation between the flights.
However, a Qantas spokeswoman told The Australian, there had been no breach of separation standards because the two A380 aircraft were understood to be apart by 20 nautical miles and 1000 feet in *altitude.
There have been several incidents wake vortexes causing serious injuries and even deaths after pilots have lost control of the aircraft.
“A cross-track encounter en route is likely to lead to only one or two sharp ‘jolts’ as the vortices are crossed,” the SKYbrary site states. “In either en route case, injuries to unsecured occupants can result, both passengers and cabin crew.
“Since most operators ensure that passengers are secured during intermediate and final approach and during initial climb after take off, it is cabin crew who will be most at risk of injury if they are not yet secured during the later stages of an approach.”
In 1993, the crew of a domestic passenger charter flight in California failed to leave sufficient separation between their aircraft and the Boeing 757 and lost control or their aircraft which crashed killing all occupants and destroying the aircraft in the impact and post-crash fire.
More recently, in 2008 an Air Canada Airbus A319 en route over the north western USA encountered unexpected sudden wake vortex turbulence from an in trail Boeing 747-400.
Pilots then responded with potentially hazardous flight control inputs which led to disturbance to the aircraft trajectory.
An unintended descent of 1,397 feet followed, Because cabin service in progress and sea belt signs were left off, it led to cabin service carts hitting the cabin ceiling and several passenger injuries, some serious.
Wake turbulence was also *blamed for the near-stall of a Qantas 747 flight from Melbourne, about 68 miles from Hong Kong, in April last year.
Last year, Germany’s Federal Bureau of Aircraft Accident Investigation called for an urgent review of aircraft separation standards after a near disaster when a *private jet was hit by wake turbulence from a Sydney-bound *Emirates A380 above the Arabian Sea.
This article originally appeared on news.com.au.
Hundreds of horrified travelers held hands *believing they were about to die as the aircraft suddenly dropped over the Pacific Ocean on Sunday.
The dramatic ordeal afflicting passengers on the QF94 from Los Angeles to Melbourne is understood to have been caused by the vortex, or “wake turbulence” caused by another aircraft which took off just two minutes earlier.
QF94 passenger Janelle Wilson told The Australian the “three-quarters-full” plane suddenly entered a “free fall nosedive … a direct decline towards the ocean” for about 10 seconds.
“It was between 1½ and two hours after we left LA and all of a sudden the plane went through a violent turbulence and then completely up-ended and we were nose*diving,” Wilson told newspaper yesterday.
“We were all lifted from our seats immediately and we were in a free fall. It was that feeling like when you are at the top of a rollercoaster and you’ve just gone over the edge of the peak and you start heading down.
“It was an absolute sense of losing your stomach and that we were nosediving. The lady sitting next to me and I screamed and held hands and just waited but thought with absolute certainty that we were going to crash. It was terrifying.”
Thankfully nobody on-board the aircraft, with a seat capacity of 484, was injured.
Vortexes can be caused when flights are too close together. (US Air Force)The QF12 flight took off from Los Angeles at 11:27pm Sunday night (US time), 57 minutes behind schedule. While the QF94 service, which departed at 11:29pm, 49 minutes late, landed safely but 30 minutes late in Melbourne at 8am on Tuesday.
According to flight safety experts at SKYbrary wake vortexes cause severe turbulence which is generated by the passage of another aircraft in flight. Basically, there is not sufficient separation between the flights.
However, a Qantas spokeswoman told The Australian, there had been no breach of separation standards because the two A380 aircraft were understood to be apart by 20 nautical miles and 1000 feet in *altitude.
There have been several incidents wake vortexes causing serious injuries and even deaths after pilots have lost control of the aircraft.
“A cross-track encounter en route is likely to lead to only one or two sharp ‘jolts’ as the vortices are crossed,” the SKYbrary site states. “In either en route case, injuries to unsecured occupants can result, both passengers and cabin crew.
“Since most operators ensure that passengers are secured during intermediate and final approach and during initial climb after take off, it is cabin crew who will be most at risk of injury if they are not yet secured during the later stages of an approach.”
In 1993, the crew of a domestic passenger charter flight in California failed to leave sufficient separation between their aircraft and the Boeing 757 and lost control or their aircraft which crashed killing all occupants and destroying the aircraft in the impact and post-crash fire.
More recently, in 2008 an Air Canada Airbus A319 en route over the north western USA encountered unexpected sudden wake vortex turbulence from an in trail Boeing 747-400.
Pilots then responded with potentially hazardous flight control inputs which led to disturbance to the aircraft trajectory.
An unintended descent of 1,397 feet followed, Because cabin service in progress and sea belt signs were left off, it led to cabin service carts hitting the cabin ceiling and several passenger injuries, some serious.
Wake turbulence was also *blamed for the near-stall of a Qantas 747 flight from Melbourne, about 68 miles from Hong Kong, in April last year.
Last year, Germany’s Federal Bureau of Aircraft Accident Investigation called for an urgent review of aircraft separation standards after a near disaster when a *private jet was hit by wake turbulence from a Sydney-bound *Emirates A380 above the Arabian Sea.
This article originally appeared on news.com.au.
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,507
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It will be interesting, for many agencies, to hear what the proximity was in the incident. There will no doubt be new data to learn. From the times of takeoff I assume this was in darkness and the startle factor must have been severe; worse than the BA 747 all engine flame out in volcanic ash. At least in the daytime you might spot the other beast sitting ahead of you and think about the risk, but at night it would not be so obvious. Trying to catch the coffee cup sliding and elevating off the cockpit table could have been challenging. All those electronics and liquid are not cosy bedfellows.
The subsequent captain's PA would also have been interesting and a little challenging.
The subsequent captain's PA would also have been interesting and a little challenging.
I had a family member on board who had just received their meal. They held the meal down briefly , the crew stopped serving for a few seconds. There was no screaming or scenes from flying high at all. A total media beat up but would you expect anything else from a Murdoch newspaper?
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: A little south of the "Black Sheep" brewery
Posts: 435
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
All that has really happened is that Janelle Wilson has advertised to the world that she is an idiot. One could add that the reporter is also clueless, but then that goes without saying with that sort of occupation, doesn't it?
Vortexes can be caused when flights are too close together.
(US Air Force)
Spare me!
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
If you apply the Rorschach Test to the vortices picture in the newspaper report, it could be two long-haired lovers (from Liverpool?) holding hands. Looking closely, the right-hand one could even be looking out of the picture and winking. Come on, all armchair psychiatrists; it's more fun than wake turbulence.
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,507
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
it could be two long-haired lovers (from Liverpool?) holding hands. Looking closely, the right-hand one could even be looking out of the picture and winking. Come on, all armchair psychiatrists; it's more fun than wake turbulence.
Did you ever see a Punch & Judy show? Could be. It could also be Harry Corbet with his fingers twiddling Sooty & Sweep. From your Liverpool comments I suspect you might be old enough to remember.
Did you ever see a Punch & Judy show? Could be. It could also be Harry Corbet with his fingers twiddling Sooty & Sweep. From your Liverpool comments I suspect you might be old enough to remember.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: San Jose
Posts: 727
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I had a family member on board who had just received their meal. They held the meal down briefly , the crew stopped serving for a few seconds. There was no screaming or scenes from flying high at all. A total media beat up but would you expect anything else from a Murdoch newspaper?
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: France
Age: 62
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If you apply the Rorschach Test to the vortices picture in the newspaper report, it could be two long-haired lovers (from Liverpool?) holding hands. Looking closely, the right-hand one could even be looking out of the picture and winking. Come on, all armchair psychiatrists; it's more fun than wake turbulence.
The ultimate religion I invite you to discover at venganza.org/
It's all about flying !
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Nirvana..HAHA..just kidding but,if you can tell me where it is!
Posts: 350
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Doesn't take much imagination to work out where the wake will be,especially if you have been following behind,for the past few hours..In this case,must have been reason why the threat wasn't considered a possibility.
Always a good topic for line training..
Always a good topic for line training..
From an SLF point of view, I am amazed that it is not standard practice for the trailing airplane on an almost identical route to be at a higher flight level in order to avoid this potential outcome. How simple is that?
