Air traffic control Strikes France and Barcelona
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It's a pity to see so many comments by people that can't seem to understand whats at stake. These workers are not striking just to have a day off. I would suggest those who think that way look below the first layer of propaganda spread by media and some airlines and see what the underlying reasons are.
I have been consistently affected by French & Spanish ATC strikes over the years but I still take my hat off to them.
I have been consistently affected by French & Spanish ATC strikes over the years but I still take my hat off to them.
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Why would you give companies more arguments for automated airplanes, I have no idea. What is the point of strikes, if you can change an employer and weed out the most corrupt, less effective ones that way?
By doing that, you actually hit where it hurts, while by striking you hit those who have no relation to the company.
pilots could, as you said, grow a backbone, but realise - it is a free market, and the more of an unpredictable expense you become to the company, the more they will think about removing that random variable from their business equation.
By doing that, you actually hit where it hurts, while by striking you hit those who have no relation to the company.
pilots could, as you said, grow a backbone, but realise - it is a free market, and the more of an unpredictable expense you become to the company, the more they will think about removing that random variable from their business equation.
I find it funny how the big airlines are constantly complaining about the rising crew costs yet every year their profits are increasing.
I find it funny how the big airlines are constantly complaining about the rising crew costs yet every year their profits are increasing.
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Why would you give companies more arguments for automated airplanes, I have no idea. What is the point of strikes, if you can change an employer and weed out the most corrupt, less effective ones that way?
By doing that, you actually hit where it hurts, while by striking you hit those who have no relation to the company.
pilots could, as you said, grow a backbone, but realise - it is a free market, and the more of an unpredictable expense you become to the company, the more they will think about removing that random variable from their business equation.
By doing that, you actually hit where it hurts, while by striking you hit those who have no relation to the company.
pilots could, as you said, grow a backbone, but realise - it is a free market, and the more of an unpredictable expense you become to the company, the more they will think about removing that random variable from their business equation.
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Safety cuts (not just cutting back but no support for long periods of time as mentioned above), huge reductions in pensions & a retirement age that is being moved from 55 to 70. Wage cuts, not just marking time, but being told next month you will get a pay packet half of what it was last month, and many more living standards that are just being changed that will hugely affect a person's way of living overnight. I'm not one to advocate strike action normally, but what the French, Spanish and Italians are being subjected to without vote is awful. Yes things needed a change, but not as drastic as they are happening.
Bring on the automated aircraft, they are still going nowhere without ATC.
Bring on the automated aircraft, they are still going nowhere without ATC.
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Bring on the automated aircraft, they are still going nowhere without ATC.
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Yep, hats off to them for carefully screwing another nation's (=Spain) traffic and airlines with the constant LFMM strikes instead of their own airports and operators. Bravo!
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Yep, hats off to them for carefully screwing another nation's (=Spain) traffic and airlines with the constant LFMM strikes instead of their own airports and operators. Bravo!
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Personally and behalf of my passengers I am tired of the air traffic controls strikes. Delay slots and cancelled flights, in the end many passengers blame the airlines.
Its time for both parties to resolve their differences and sit down and find a solution, enough already. Have you been affected?
Its time for both parties to resolve their differences and sit down and find a solution, enough already. Have you been affected?
The Barcelona ACC guys have gone from working a 5-days-on, 3-days-off schedule to being forced into a 6-on, 2-off schedule. This is because of short staffing. The staffing is short because the users whine about user fees all the time... and the users are the airlines.
So, really, when the passengers blame the airlines, they're correct. If the airlines paid a bit higher ATM/ATC fees, the ATM providers could hire more people, and the controllers would be happy, and they wouldn't go on strike.
And "they should sit down and work out their differences" is silly. They TRIED sitting down and working it out. That didn't work. Going on strike is what you do next when sitting down and talking it out doesn't work.
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For Marseilles the strike is a result of the mandatory cost reductions imposed by the Eur Commission ( the so called RP2 and PR3 mandatory cost reductions ) in ATM costs and route charges due pressures of the airlines groups..
Consequences were reduction in staff and delaying modernization programs, only 2 of the 5 Centers in France have been modernized so far ( ERATO system) , staff numbers have decreased ( -6%) while traffic is up 8% last 2 years.
As a side note, the strike in Marseilles is from a small union ( but important in Aix-Marseilles center) but causing large disruptions.
In Spain it is very similar . Cost reductions leading to reduction/shortage staff, plus the bulling of the controllers by their employers. Lot of differences en up in court at the moment and the relations management--controllers is terrible there. .
As to the low cost airlines cancelling flights, I understand from insiders that this is a good way to hide their won staff shortages and blame others. Strikes ( or Weather / Cbs in summer) are the usual culprits.
A good example :
Toulouse is in Bordeaux FIR , aflight to/from UK will be not affected by a strike in Marseilles.
Last point , the ATC strikes , unlike the Train SNCF one , have little to do with Macron reforms , the "RP" cost reductions were long before him. , .
Consequences were reduction in staff and delaying modernization programs, only 2 of the 5 Centers in France have been modernized so far ( ERATO system) , staff numbers have decreased ( -6%) while traffic is up 8% last 2 years.
As a side note, the strike in Marseilles is from a small union ( but important in Aix-Marseilles center) but causing large disruptions.
In Spain it is very similar . Cost reductions leading to reduction/shortage staff, plus the bulling of the controllers by their employers. Lot of differences en up in court at the moment and the relations management--controllers is terrible there. .
As to the low cost airlines cancelling flights, I understand from insiders that this is a good way to hide their won staff shortages and blame others. Strikes ( or Weather / Cbs in summer) are the usual culprits.
A good example :
we received a text from a certain Irish airline to say that our return flight from Toulouse is cancelled next Sunday due to the ATC strike
Last point , the ATC strikes , unlike the Train SNCF one , have little to do with Macron reforms , the "RP" cost reductions were long before him. , .
For Marseilles the strike is a result of the mandatory cost reductions imposed by the Eur Commission ( the so called RP2 and PR3 mandatory cost reductions ) in ATM costs and route charges due pressures of the airlines groups..
Consequences were reduction in staff and delaying modernization programs, only 2 of the 5 Centers in France have been modernized so far ( ERATO system) , staff numbers have decreased ( -6%) while traffic is up 8% last 2 years.
As a side note, the strike in Marseilles is from a small union ( but important in Aix-Marseilles center) but causing large disruptions.
In Spain it is very similar . Cost reductions leading to reduction/shortage staff, plus the bulling of the controllers by their employers. Lot of differences en up in court at the moment and the relations management--controllers is terrible there. .
As to the low cost airlines cancelling flights, I understand from insiders that this is a good way to hide their won staff shortages and blame others. Strikes ( or Weather / Cbs in summer) are the usual culprits.
A good example :
Quote:
we received a text from a certain Irish airline to say that our return flight from Toulouse is cancelled next Sunday due to the ATC strike
Toulouse is in Bordeaux FIR , aflight to/from UK will be not affected by a strike in Marseilles.
Last point , the ATC strikes , unlike the Train SNCF one , have little to do with Macron reforms , the "RP" cost reductions were long before him. , .
Consequences were reduction in staff and delaying modernization programs, only 2 of the 5 Centers in France have been modernized so far ( ERATO system) , staff numbers have decreased ( -6%) while traffic is up 8% last 2 years.
As a side note, the strike in Marseilles is from a small union ( but important in Aix-Marseilles center) but causing large disruptions.
In Spain it is very similar . Cost reductions leading to reduction/shortage staff, plus the bulling of the controllers by their employers. Lot of differences en up in court at the moment and the relations management--controllers is terrible there. .
As to the low cost airlines cancelling flights, I understand from insiders that this is a good way to hide their won staff shortages and blame others. Strikes ( or Weather / Cbs in summer) are the usual culprits.
A good example :
Quote:
we received a text from a certain Irish airline to say that our return flight from Toulouse is cancelled next Sunday due to the ATC strike
Toulouse is in Bordeaux FIR , aflight to/from UK will be not affected by a strike in Marseilles.
Last point , the ATC strikes , unlike the Train SNCF one , have little to do with Macron reforms , the "RP" cost reductions were long before him. , .
Regarding the mention of the Toulouse cancellation, I submitted a claim for compensation which was agreed and the following explanation was offered:
"We sincerely regret the cancellation of your flight xxxx on the 10/06/2018 which was due to an unexpected airport facility issue."
I think that confirms what we both suspect, which is that they are using the strikes to sort out their own mess.
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I think they would evoke more public sympathy if it wasn't always oh so conveniently on a weekend ... "So my holiday gets ruined, so they can spend the weekend round the braai with their friends - bully for them"
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Same as, sort of....
The daughter and son-in-law due to fly back to the UK tomorrow, from Nice to Bristol..
As we're a two hour drive to Nice, we'd really like to know whether their flight is one of the ' hundreds of flights cancelled ' according to UK newspapers before we set off.
Can't seem to find anything on the Easy website, other than a generic warning, so anyone who can provide a link would be much appreciated.
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we'd really like to know whether their flight is one of the ' hundreds of flights cancelled ' according to UK newspapers before we set off.
ATC does not cancel flights, just causing delays ,as not all the sectors are opened. there is also a minimum service mandatory for ATC in France during periods of industrial action. It is the airlines that cancel flights , so in your case call the airline . they know.
Finally Newspapers ( especially UK ones except perhaps The Guardian ) are rarely a good source to find something in Aviation ..
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As we're a two hour drive to Nice, we'd really like to know whether their flight is one of the ' hundreds of flights cancelled ' according to UK newspapers before we set off.
Yesterday, at one stage the website only showed "Go to departures, almost 2 hours after the flight was supposed to have gone. At least, when the ADS-B squawk appears, I know something is happening. I can only imagine what the Nice passengers would think if they could know what the situation was in Bristol. Our passenger sat in the cabin for at least 30 mins before anything started moving, and you won't see that on the board.
French ATC delays are one thing, a lack of information from Easy just compounds the issue.
IG
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Same as, sort of....
The daughter and son-in-law due to fly back to the UK tomorrow, from Nice to Bristol..
As we're a two hour drive to Nice, we'd really like to know whether their flight is one of the ' hundreds of flights cancelled ' according to UK newspapers before we set off.
Can't seem to find anything on the Easy website, other than a generic warning, so anyone who can provide a link would be much appreciated.
The daughter and son-in-law due to fly back to the UK tomorrow, from Nice to Bristol..
As we're a two hour drive to Nice, we'd really like to know whether their flight is one of the ' hundreds of flights cancelled ' according to UK newspapers before we set off.
Can't seem to find anything on the Easy website, other than a generic warning, so anyone who can provide a link would be much appreciated.
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Tiennetti
Yesterday, that link showed our passenger's flight somewhere near Orleans South West of Paris, complete with a course line, when it had not even left the gate in Bristol. When the flight did take off, it did not take the planned track (which had been shown on the link page), but went much further East direct to Dover, before it was routed South at Dover more directly towards Lyon.
Not to be trusted
IG
Yesterday, that link showed our passenger's flight somewhere near Orleans South West of Paris, complete with a course line, when it had not even left the gate in Bristol. When the flight did take off, it did not take the planned track (which had been shown on the link page), but went much further East direct to Dover, before it was routed South at Dover more directly towards Lyon.
Not to be trusted
IG
Last edited by ImageGear; 24th Jun 2018 at 09:57.
