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MH17 Investigators Report

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MH17 Investigators Report

Old 26th May 2018, 07:42
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Originally Posted by ehwatezedoing
Don't forget the USS Vincennes shooting down the Iranian Airbus back in 1988.
Even if it was pretty obvious who did it, various lies were told at the time to shift blame.
The US never denied shooting it down. Russia has, and has denied previous shoot downs.
https://www.vox.com/2014/7/17/591269...ivilian-planes
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Old 26th May 2018, 10:18
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Originally Posted by Intrance
Very well thought out plan. I'm sure it's fool proof and nothing that Russia could do in return, like say, ban Western airlines from it's airspace causing major issues for basically anything wanting to go to Asia from places like AMS for example.
Russia would probably ban European aircraft from its airspace.But the southern routes would still be open.
To ensure a level playing field the aerospace border with Russia should be closed as well.
No air traffic could enter European airspace from Russia.
To sit back and do nothing is the result Russia wants.
They get away with murder and we get to talk about it.

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Old 26th May 2018, 10:25
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I agree. There's always the Southern Routes while we punish Russia, for as long as that takes.

They're murdering scum, and they've been getting away with it for far far too long.

Russia should be completely isolated, for the time being.
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Old 26th May 2018, 10:50
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Given the lily livered response to Russia generally from most western politicians, they will just keep lying and get away, literally, with murder.
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Old 26th May 2018, 12:07
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Originally Posted by Timmy Tomkins
Given the lily livered response to Russia generally from most western politicians, they will just keep lying and get away, literally, with murder.
Europe depends on Russian gas. Politicians have to take that into account.
So a messy aviation incident during a civil war (fostered incidentally by European and US politicians, if Victoria Nuland is to be believed) is not going to be allowed to derail the relationship.
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Old 26th May 2018, 12:31
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Originally Posted by etudiant
Europe depends on Russian gas. Politicians have to take that into account.
So a messy aviation incident during a civil war (fostered incidentally by European and US politicians, if Victoria Nuland is to be believed) is not going to be allowed to derail the relationship.
"So a messy aviation incident" !!!

then of course there is..

..SALISBURY.

Goodness knows what it would take for your metric to decide what a major event would be!!!
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Old 26th May 2018, 14:17
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Originally Posted by WingNut60
The following is not meant to exonerate anyone, and undoubtedly the aircraft was deliberately targeted.
But does anyone really think or assert that the aircraft was deliberately targeted while knowing it to be a non-Ukrainian, non-combatant over-flight?

Or, put more simply, is there anything to support this being anything other than a major f.....k up?
Something along the lines of the USS Vincennes incident.
i am sure that is exactly what happened. It was a giant mistake. The real question that should be asked is why civilian airliners are flyin in, around and near war zones. It will happen again in the next few years, probably in the Middle East.
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Old 26th May 2018, 14:49
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Originally Posted by Start Fore
I agree. There's always the Southern Routes while we punish Russia, for as long as that takes.

They're murdering scum, and they've been getting away with it for far far too long.

Russia should be completely isolated, for the time being.
That's what the US tried with Japan in 1940-41 - and look how that turned out.............
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Old 26th May 2018, 19:04
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Originally Posted by glad rag
"So a messy aviation incident" !!!

then of course there is..

..SALISBURY.

Goodness knows what it would take for your metric to decide what a major event would be!!!
The Ukraine civil war has cost at least 10,000 lives, according to UN reports, yet is considered only a distraction even by European politicians.
Presumably their metric for a 'major event' is different from that of most people.
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Old 26th May 2018, 19:06
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Originally Posted by Brat
The US never denied shooting it down. Russia has, and has denied previous shoot downs.
https://www.vox.com/2014/7/17/591269...ivilian-planes
Denying shooting it down no, like I said that was pretty obvious where it was coming from, shifting blame yes.
The ‘Forgotten’ US Shootdown of Iranian Airliner Flight 655*

Sorry for the thread drift.
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Old 26th May 2018, 20:38
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Originally Posted by Start Fore
I agree. There's always the Southern Routes while we punish Russia, for as long as that takes.

They're murdering scum, and they've been getting away with it for far far too long.

Russia should be completely isolated, for the time being.
I believe since Trump's crony, Putin has been in power, Russia has been a greater threat to Western democracies than during all the latter years of the Cold War.
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Old 27th May 2018, 00:05
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I feel for the victim's families. Unfortunately, no one is going to take on Russia over this. Even with evidence, who's going to take on Putin?
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Old 27th May 2018, 00:11
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Originally Posted by ehwatezedoing
Don't forget the USS Vincennes shooting down the Iranian Airbus back in 1988.
Even if it was pretty obvious who did it, various lies were told at the time to shift blame.
you mean,like, within a week USA had admitted they did it, unlike Russia?
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Old 27th May 2018, 05:59
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Originally Posted by etudiant
The Ukraine civil war has cost at least 10,000 lives, according to UN reports, yet is considered only a distraction even by European politicians.
Presumably their metric for a 'major event' is different from that of most people.
No-one wants another major war in Europe......... the last one cost tens of millions of lives and that was before we had the A bomb
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Old 27th May 2018, 15:14
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I lost a good friend on that flight...Miss him still, but not as much as his wife and children do.
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Old 27th May 2018, 18:43
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Given the sanctions against Russia; given the report about this event in Ukraine; given the Salisbury incident, how the hell did the UEFA final end up in Kiev? Or is this "we don't allow sport to get mixed up in politics." Yeah, right. And the world cup?
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Old 27th May 2018, 20:46
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Originally Posted by RAT 5
Given the sanctions against Russia; given the report about this event in Ukraine; given the Salisbury incident, how the hell did the UEFA final end up in Kiev? Or is this "we don't allow sport to get mixed up in politics." Yeah, right. And the world cup?
Awarded years ago............... and Kiev is the country that was invaded by Russia - what you want to ask is why everyone went to Sochi....................

Vested interests, TV money, - you expect PRINCIPLES?????
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Old 28th May 2018, 00:01
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Originally Posted by etudiant
The Ukraine civil war has cost at least 10,000 lives, according to UN reports, yet is considered only a distraction even by European politicians.
Presumably their metric for a 'major event' is different from that of most people.
The EU is reliant on Russia for 35% of their gas supply. Under that circumstance you dont poke the Bear
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Old 28th May 2018, 10:05
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Originally Posted by WingNut60
The following is not meant to exonerate anyone, and undoubtedly the aircraft was deliberately targeted.
But does anyone really think or assert that the aircraft was deliberately targeted while knowing it to be a non-Ukrainian, non-combatant over-flight?

Or, put more simply, is there anything to support this being anything other than a major f.....k up?
Something along the lines of the USS Vincennes incident.
I did see an article saying that an Aeroflot flight was on a crossing north/south track at the time Mh17 was hit. The theory goes that Putain was try to shoot down that one in order to justify full scale invasion of Ukraine. No proof or course, but plausible with that nutter.
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Old 28th May 2018, 11:17
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Originally Posted by hoss183
I did see an article saying that an Aeroflot flight was on a crossing north/south track at the time Mh17 was hit. The theory goes that Putain was try to shoot down that one in order to justify full scale invasion of Ukraine. No proof or course, but plausible with that nutter.
first minutes after downing MH17, russian media reported about crash of ukrainian military AN-26, not SU2074. If they really wanted to hit Aeroflot, they would ve report about it instantly. IMHO.
besides if Russi wanted to hit their jet on purpose, they could launch a "low-speed" rocket when aircraft passed state border, to make it reach the target 10-15 minutes later and many miles away.
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