EC notice on BREXIT issued, licenses/certificates invalid
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If continued UK membership of EASA cannot be agreed, the UK could empower the UK CAA to discharge all the UK’s ICAO responsibilities. This would require the UK CAA to rebuild its competence in the many areas of an NAA’s remit which are currently delegated to EASA. Given the large number [around 300] of additional specialist staff needed, and the new systems and processes that would need to be put in place and used by industry, this could not be achieved by March 2019. Most of the specialists who carried out these tasks in the CAA prior to EASA taking them over have gone to EASA, taken on other work at the CAA, or retired. Based on the UK’s experience of transference of regulatory responsibility to the European level back in 2002, there is no evidence to suggest that a ‘reverse transfer’ back to the UK would be less challenging.
Under this scenario, a multi-year transition would be needed, during which activities would gradually move under the CAA’s direction. If suitable transition measures were not put in place there would be disruption of services following Brexit, increased costs to business, and almost certainly loss of business to UK companies. The reasons for this have been covered in the section on how the system works today with EASA above. Indeed, if this scenario appears likely during 2018 it is likely that the uncertainty will already cause UK industry to lose business. Businesses which have operations in multiple countries might decide to move some activities out of the UK and other businesses might move out of the UK. Clearly this would not be an option in every case. In any event, such moves would not be beneficial to the UK economy.
A transition period with high levels of change is not good for product safety assurance, as it takes the focus away from assuring every task is done correctly and from continuous improvement requiring additional work that does not add to safety. This situation would be worse if the transition period was badly managed, or indeed if there was an attempt to manage with no transition period and all the competent resources and system were not in place at Brexit.
Under this scenario, a multi-year transition would be needed, during which activities would gradually move under the CAA’s direction. If suitable transition measures were not put in place there would be disruption of services following Brexit, increased costs to business, and almost certainly loss of business to UK companies. The reasons for this have been covered in the section on how the system works today with EASA above. Indeed, if this scenario appears likely during 2018 it is likely that the uncertainty will already cause UK industry to lose business. Businesses which have operations in multiple countries might decide to move some activities out of the UK and other businesses might move out of the UK. Clearly this would not be an option in every case. In any event, such moves would not be beneficial to the UK economy.
A transition period with high levels of change is not good for product safety assurance, as it takes the focus away from assuring every task is done correctly and from continuous improvement requiring additional work that does not add to safety. This situation would be worse if the transition period was badly managed, or indeed if there was an attempt to manage with no transition period and all the competent resources and system were not in place at Brexit.
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If you identify with the ‘idiots’ I referred to earlier, maybe you could tell me what choices the UK has to remain flying on 1 November. If you are saying that this is simply scaremongering, you really do need to come up with a realistic alternative within three months.
Your move!
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Given the quite scathing summary Andrew Haines described in the paper - it basically says there is little benefit in not remaining a full EASA member and a whole load of serious issues if not - I can sort of understand for certain sectors, there will be big problems.
My CAMO has already stated that if they have to go through a reregistration process, they will be retiring. They've had more than enough problems and cost over recent years dealing with EASA changes. They won't be doing that again.
But the CAA has been VERY quiet over recent months so we don't know where they are at with preparations. Still now we have Grant Shapps/Michael Green as SoS for Transport, all will be well ....!
My CAMO has already stated that if they have to go through a reregistration process, they will be retiring. They've had more than enough problems and cost over recent years dealing with EASA changes. They won't be doing that again.
But the CAA has been VERY quiet over recent months so we don't know where they are at with preparations. Still now we have Grant Shapps/Michael Green as SoS for Transport, all will be well ....!
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https://amp.theguardian.com/business...eave-regulator
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Why would the EU offer an EASA membership for a third country that just destroyed a peace treaty they have signed, does not fulfill its past obligations and seriously disrupts EU commerce? Answer: It wouldn't. Easy as that. The EU has already done its homework with its unilateral no deal legislation that it can withdraw without prior notice at any time, just protecting its own interests. And Airlines, workers, shareholders in a third country are not an interest to the EU.
BTW, there is a training company in the UK just changing all their licenses to the Austrian authority - whilst staying on their premises close to London.
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Why would the EU offer an EASA membership for a third country that just destroyed a peace treaty they have signed, does not fulfill its past obligations and seriously disrupts EU commerce? Answer: It wouldn't. Easy as that. The EU has already done its homework with its unilateral no deal legislation that it can withdraw without prior notice at any time, just protecting its own interests. And Airlines, workers, shareholders in a third country are not an interest to the EU.
1) How is the WA a peace treaty? Are we at war with the EU ? War of words maybe, but not guns and bullets . Poor choice of words
2) How has the UK 'destroyed' anything ? The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. I don't think the UK has actually destroyed anything at present
3) How has the UK 'not fulfil' past obligations. The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed. I don't think the UK has actually failed to fulfill any obligation at present
4) How "disrupts EU commerce" This is getting repetitive, The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. I don't think the UK has actually disrupted anything at present
Wow, what an easy post to demolish !
radiosutch,
"The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. "
No, they are not. They are not in ANY kind of negotiation. THAT is the very worrying point in all this.
"The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. "
No, they are not. They are not in ANY kind of negotiation. THAT is the very worrying point in all this.
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Light on facts here
1) How is the WA a peace treaty? Are we at war with the EU ? War of words maybe, but not guns and bullets . Poor choice of words
2) How has the UK 'destroyed' anything ? The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. I don't think the UK has actually destroyed anything at present
3) How has the UK 'not fulfil' past obligations. The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed. I don't think the UK has actually failed to fulfill any obligation at present
4) How "disrupts EU commerce" This is getting repetitive, The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. I don't think the UK has actually disrupted anything at present
Wow, what an easy post to demolish !
1) How is the WA a peace treaty? Are we at war with the EU ? War of words maybe, but not guns and bullets . Poor choice of words
2) How has the UK 'destroyed' anything ? The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. I don't think the UK has actually destroyed anything at present
3) How has the UK 'not fulfil' past obligations. The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed. I don't think the UK has actually failed to fulfill any obligation at present
4) How "disrupts EU commerce" This is getting repetitive, The UK and the EU are in a negotiation. I don't think the UK has actually disrupted anything at present
Wow, what an easy post to demolish !
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Remember that EASA is not the EU.
Further, the CAA was independent once before; if they pull their finger out, they can be so again!
The UK does have a choice, and should not be weak when faced with such scaremongering!
By your patronising reckoning, I must be an ‘idiot’.
How other non-EU airlines somehow work it out, is beyond my feeble, idiotic brain cells, but all is not lost.
Further, the CAA was independent once before; if they pull their finger out, they can be so again!
The UK does have a choice, and should not be weak when faced with such scaremongering!
By your patronising reckoning, I must be an ‘idiot’.
How other non-EU airlines somehow work it out, is beyond my feeble, idiotic brain cells, but all is not lost.
I'm not going to call you an idiot, just someone who has absolutely no idea what they are talking about yet has a strong opinion anyway.
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My question is: why should a UK licence issued under EASA, not be valid after brexit (I mean in EU).
I can understand for licences issued AFTER brexit, but in mine I can read in capital letters EASA.
I'm afraid that the conversion period will go beyond the deadline.
I can understand for licences issued AFTER brexit, but in mine I can read in capital letters EASA.
I'm afraid that the conversion period will go beyond the deadline.
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There's been a fair bit of disinformation around but the answer to your question might be "because the licensing records are no longer held by an EASA state". To avoid this possibility you could transfer your State Of Licence Issue now. Several other EASA States (Austria at least) take the view that a transfer of SOLI process started before a hard Brexit can be completed even after the event.
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There's been a fair bit of disinformation around but the answer to your question might be "because the licensing records are no longer held by an EASA state". To avoid this possibility you could transfer your State Of Licence Issue now. Several other EASA States (Austria at least) take the view that a transfer of SOLI process started before a hard Brexit can be completed even after the event.
So, just to recap, right now in case of a hard brexit, any UK issued licences would not be reckognised outside UK anymore, and, in order to, I should retake all the ATPL examinations, is it correct ?
I mean, if the scenario does not change.
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Why would you assume that? If you have a UK issued EASA licence (by which I think you mean your EASA licence records are currently held by the UK) and there is a hard brexit then worst case other EASA States may not recognise the licence because (arguably) the records are not held by a member State. On the other hand they may recognise it, no-one knows. In order to avoid the possibility just transfer your SOLI. No-one mentioned retaking your ATPL exams, or flight tests, or ratings.
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Why would you assume that? If you have a UK issued EASA licence (by which I think you mean your EASA licence records are currently held by the UK) and there is a hard brexit then worst case other EASA States may not recognise the licence because (arguably) the records are not held by a member State. On the other hand they may recognise it, no-one knows. In order to avoid the possibility just transfer your SOLI. No-one mentioned retaking your ATPL exams, or flight tests, or ratings.
So I suppose the process will be, in this case, more complicated, and I'll need to resit everything again.
Of course this is gonna be the worst case scenario, and I'm gonna start the conversion asap.
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