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EC notice on BREXIT issued, licenses/certificates invalid

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EC notice on BREXIT issued, licenses/certificates invalid

Old 26th Oct 2018, 11:22
  #461 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by infrequentflyer789
North has a habit of spouting overly pessimistic rubbish, such as "EASA membership is limited to EU countries" (hello Switzerland),.
Care to comment on the relevance EASA membership, the ECJ vs. The U.K. Governments’s infamous “red lines”?

Or do we just blame the EU?
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Old 26th Oct 2018, 12:37
  #462 (permalink)  
 
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We guys can talk all we want, but as today they are not even close to a deal and the fact that people with a UK licence will only be able to fly a G aircraft is very real. Do as you please, but I would never take the risk. Unless you’re in BA or Virgin I would convert asap.
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Old 26th Oct 2018, 12:59
  #463 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wiggy


Care to comment on the relevance EASA membership, the ECJ vs. The U.K. Governments’s infamous “red lines”?

Or do we just blame the EU?
That issue was 'solved' months ago when the UK Government changed their red line from 'direct' jurisdiction to 'indirect' jurisdiction.
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Old 26th Oct 2018, 16:20
  #464 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by wiggy
[left]

Care to comment on the relevance EASA membership, the ECJ vs. The U.K. Governments’s infamous “red lines”?
I think the phrase is "I refer the honorable member to the answer I gave earlier" - post #456
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Old 27th Oct 2018, 11:46
  #465 (permalink)  
 
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In short. We are stuffed!!
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Old 27th Oct 2018, 15:29
  #466 (permalink)  
 
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EASA does take third country applications from the UK, however, not from airlines. Just from manufacturers, MROs, maintenance training, CAMO, ATOs and for individual flight simulators as well as AeMC, of which there is only one in the UK as far as i know. It does not cover licenses in itself or airline ops.

Well, as for easyJet, if they did their homework they have to split the company in three (it is already two parts) latest on brexit day, keep all the OE-aircraft based in europe and only EU licensed individuals (pilots and cabin crew) can fly them, maintenance is local anyway from what i hear. But ownership and control might be an issue, although Austrocontrol is famous for its flexibility for cash.
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Old 27th Oct 2018, 19:57
  #467 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Denti
EASA does take third country applications from the UK, however, not from airlines. Just from manufacturers, MROs, maintenance training, CAMO, ATOs and for individual flight simulators as well as AeMC, of which there is only one in the UK as far as i know. It does not cover licenses in itself or airline ops..
My point is that Richard North says that EASA cannot be doing this because the UK is not, yet, (and may not become) a third country.

Either Richard North is wrong or EASA is wrong - I think North is wrong, but I'll admit this is partly because I think that in general in disputes over interpretation of the rules it is unwise to bet against the rule makers.
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Old 28th Oct 2018, 12:00
  #468 (permalink)  
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More than two years into this process, not many people know much more than they did two years ago.

Despite an outward mood of quiet confidence that things are nearly sorted out, or will be, the UK's transport minister Chris Grayling is reputed to have discussed with ministerial colleagues there might be contingency measures against no deal, chartering ships to arrange emergency deliveries of food and medical supplies, to bypass possible delays and other chaos at UK ports.

This is the man who insists that rail strikes are outside his responsibility, despite that government subsidy and poor contracts allow some rail companies to make the same money whether they provide service or not. He also complained about too many cyclists in London, and it transpired he'd recently knocked one over by opening a car door without looking first. So not promising, but I digress.

What I haven't seen in those rumours of possible disruption at ports is anything about aviation. We occasionally see reminders that Heathrow is one of our biggest ports. I wonder whether the putative need for extra shipping capacity, to bypass some of us queuing to catch the ferry, is partly also a contingency against being able to fly less stuff in, and if so why this might not have occurred to journalists producing those articles the other day
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Old 28th Oct 2018, 12:22
  #469 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by aox
What I haven't seen in those rumours of possible disruption at ports is anything about aviation. We occasionally see reminders that Heathrow is one of our biggest ports. I wonder whether the putative need for extra shipping capacity, to bypass some of us queuing to catch the ferry, is partly also a contingency against being able to fly less stuff in, and if so why this might not have occurred to journalists producing those articles the other day
That's why I posted #475. It seems only Reuters covered this.
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Old 28th Oct 2018, 16:25
  #470 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by infrequentflyer789
My point is that Richard North says that EASA cannot be doing this because the UK is not, yet, (and may not become) a third country.

Either Richard North is wrong or EASA is wrong - I think North is wrong, but I'll admit this is partly because I think that in general in disputes over interpretation of the rules it is unwise to bet against the rule makers.
Well, i suspect that EASA allows applications, but cannot grant them until the UK is a third country.
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Old 29th Oct 2018, 17:51
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So as certificates for ATM/ANS providers (including NERL) will no longer be recognised by EASA, then I assume no EU operators will be allowed to enter UK airspace, including flights between mainland Europe and North America? That won't be down to the UK refusing overflight clearance which, as has been pointed out earlier, is not possible, but because EASA won't allow EU operators to fly into airspace that is controlled by an entity that doesn't hold a valid EASA authorisation.

Yeah, I can just see that happening!

I suspect it isn't just the UK that 'wants to have its cake and eat it too'
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Old 29th Oct 2018, 22:00
  #472 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by judge11
Shock horror! UK CAA has to do some work and provide value for it's exorbitant fees.
Spot on - this isn't Quantum Physics i.e. Difficult
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Old 29th Oct 2018, 22:56
  #473 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by sewushr
... but because EASA won't allow EU operators to fly into airspace that is controlled by an entity that doesn't hold a valid EASA authorisation.
Pfft. EU based operators fly all over the world, including overflight of many countries well outside the EASA cabal. See "Most of the more badly organised bit of Africa" for more details.
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Old 30th Oct 2018, 09:21
  #474 (permalink)  
 
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I see that the UK Minister of Transport Chris Grayling commonly known as failing grayling, ailing grayling or just a doughnut, has admitted that it is theoretically possible that there will be no flights between the UK and the EU in the event if a no deal. No talks have taken place, they cannot until a deal has been agreed apparently. How do these people keep a job, I know he is a staunch support of the PM.
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Old 30th Oct 2018, 11:50
  #475 (permalink)  
 
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Does anyone know, if you were to apply to another EASA state to transfer your UK issued EASA licence, do you retain the UK one until the other State issues you with their licence or is there a period when you do not hold a licence and therefore cannot fly?
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Old 30th Oct 2018, 12:27
  #476 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bingofuel
Does anyone know, if you were to apply to another EASA state to transfer your UK issued EASA licence, do you retain the UK one until the other State issues you with their licence or is there a period when you do not hold a licence and therefore cannot fly?

Hi bingo, Can only speak for the Maintenance side but I asked the same question of the IAA who said as far as they are concerned it remains valid until the day they issue your new licence.
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Old 30th Oct 2018, 12:30
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Thanks Exup
That helps with the decision whether to apply elsewhere..

BF
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Old 30th Oct 2018, 15:48
  #478 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bingofuel
Thanks Exup
That helps with the decision whether to apply elsewhere..

BF
Also check out the UK CAA site at https://info.caa.co.uk/euexit/

In general it seems that even after a no-deal exit the CAA will continue to recognise EASA licences as equivalent for up to 2 years, while EASA says it will cease to recognise CAA licences as valid. If you need to work in both or fly G-reg and EASA regs then best option looks to be transfer to a non-UK EASA licence and then two years to apply for CAA in addition, if needed (assuming you can't hold both right now).
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Old 30th Oct 2018, 17:08
  #479 (permalink)  
 
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That was my thinking but I obviously cannot be without a valid licence at any point, and the CAA website is silent on that point. Clearly this will affect a large number of UK licence holders and there seems little guidance on what we can do to safeguard our futures.
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Old 31st Oct 2018, 13:41
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If anyone has any experience of transferring a UK licence with TRE to an Austrian one can you give feedback please? Why has easyjet chosen Austria? I am being forced to move my licence and am trying to figure out the best option. Thanks.
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