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EC notice on BREXIT issued, licenses/certificates invalid

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EC notice on BREXIT issued, licenses/certificates invalid

Old 6th Apr 2019, 15:31
  #681 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Valencia, Spain
Posts: 44
Originally Posted by JliderPilot View Post
Anyone know what the current turnaround time is for a UK to EASA conversion?
Fellows where I work have recently transferred from UK CAA to Spain's AESA in as little as 22 days...

Cheers
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Old 7th Apr 2019, 18:01
  #682 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
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I had a chat with AustoControl and the German LBA last week regarding my license transfer. Especially AustroControl was very customer friendly and I have been told; as long as you start the license transfer before Brexit, you will be all-right. Even if they do not receive the required paperwork from the UK CAA on time, you will keep your EASA privileges. The license will be issued as soon as they receive the documents from the UK CAA. This has been confirmed be the LBA as well.

Last edited by Peter_CDG; 7th Apr 2019 at 18:06. Reason: spelling
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Old 8th Apr 2019, 15:15
  #683 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Valencia, Spain
Posts: 44
de facto

When did the CAA charge you the fees for Doc 155 and medical release?

Thanks

Last edited by fdgolf; 8th Apr 2019 at 15:30.
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Old 11th Apr 2019, 06:33
  #684 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
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So I'm in a situation where I could be denied a job by an European carrier/AOC flying outbound from UK airports to outside the EU because EASA have provided no assurances to them that UK licenses will still be valid on their AOC. Unfortunately, I need a UK license by the terms of my current employment whilst serving my employment notice. So cannot start the process.

Yes, the foreign carrier on the day of Brexit is somehow sure that they will be allowed by the UK to continue flying but they cannot employ a Brit with a Brit license just in case. The irony? The carrier was brought in to replace the work my old airline was doing prior to my redundancy.

On another note, now that we know we are not leaving without a deal until October 2019 end. As far as an airline should be concerned, I have 6 months to convert right? In the event of a deal based Brexit prior to this, the so-called "transition period" of 2 years will allow my UK license to remain an EASA license for a little longer anyway. Is this how EASA views it? Or is the predicament the same even in a deal based Brexit?

Thanks
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Old 16th Apr 2019, 21:09
  #685 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: EDLP
Posts: 13
I am still not sure if Brexit will happen at all but I am wondering which NAAs you guys consider competent and a good choice to go to in case a hard and nasty (for pilots) Brexit seems more and more likely. Things that are of interest to me are
- is the NAA likely to quickly introduce new ratings such as recently EIR/CBIR and in the future BIR
- does the NAA either have a large and accessible pool of examiners or easy rules on accepting examiners from other EASA NAAs
- is the price structure at least somewhat sensible (ie, AustroControl is a lot more expensive than the LBA)
- is the NAA know for stupid deviations from part fcl (the LBA's ZUP / admissibility check comes to mind)
- other things I am not aware of as I am just a new PPL holder who just barely needs his first revalidation)
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Old 20th Apr 2019, 13:42
  #686 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 37
It seems you were right
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Old 21st Apr 2019, 09:34
  #687 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
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Originally Posted by CW247 View Post
So I'm in a situation where I could be denied a job by an European carrier/AOC flying outbound from UK airports to outside the EU because EASA have provided no assurances to them that UK licenses will still be valid on their AOC. Unfortunately, I need a UK license by the terms of my current employment whilst serving my employment notice. So cannot start the process.

Yes, the foreign carrier on the day of Brexit is somehow sure that they will be allowed by the UK to continue flying but they cannot employ a Brit with a Brit license just in case. The irony? The carrier was brought in to replace the work my old airline was doing prior to my redundancy.

On another note, now that we know we are not leaving without a deal until October 2019 end. As far as an airline should be concerned, I have 6 months to convert right? In the event of a deal based Brexit prior to this, the so-called "transition period" of 2 years will allow my UK license to remain an EASA license for a little longer anyway. Is this how EASA views it? Or is the predicament the same even in a deal based Brexit?

Thanks
Are you already serving your notice?
If so, you can start the process of transfer provided you do not have any further simulator checks.
Your transfer of licence can be started and will not be complete until you surrender your old license, so as long as paperwork is in order and ready when you want/need to, you should be fine.
If not serving your notice yet, plan accordingly.
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 03:04
  #688 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
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So this thread has gone quiet for the last three months.

It appears that BoJo is intent on leaving the EU without a deal. Treasury is spending big accordingly.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49183324 GBP2.1 billion pounds in extra funding.

The effect on aviation?
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 09:00
  #689 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Icarus2001 View Post
So this thread has gone quiet for the last three months.

It appears that BoJo is intent on leaving the EU without a deal. Treasury is spending big accordingly.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49183324 GBP2.1 billion pounds in extra funding.

The effect on aviation?
None.
If brexit will happen UK CAA will remain under the EASA umbrella, external member.
I would not lose my sleep on that.
The last 3 years were pretty funny in seeing that the UK goverment is not able to handle brexit.
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 09:46
  #690 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
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Originally Posted by Raski View Post


None.
If brexit will happen UK CAA will remain under the EASA umbrella, external member.
I would not lose my sleep on that.
The last 3 years were pretty funny in seeing that the UK goverment is not able to handle brexit.
Wouldn’t the CAA have to apply for associate membership?
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 10:08
  #691 (permalink)  
 
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And they'd have to accept falling under the auspicies of the European Courts. That's anathema to BoJo and his team.

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Old 1st Aug 2019, 10:11
  #692 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Speed of Sound View Post


Wouldn’t the CAA have to apply for associate membership?
And would EASA "associate" membership be subject to the UK accepting the 4 freedoms of the EU (something Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and Lichtenstein seem to have done)?
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 10:41
  #693 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by portos8 View Post
And would EASA "associate" membership be subject to the UK accepting the 4 freedoms of the EU (something Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and Lichtenstein seem to have done)?
they will have too.
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 10:42
  #694 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by robin View Post
And they'd have to accept falling under the auspicies of the European Courts. That's anathema to BoJo and his team.
i think bojo will have to change his mind on many issues...and he will.
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 11:26
  #695 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
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Originally Posted by Raski View Post


i think bojo will have to change his mind on many issues...and he will.
So he will have to accept the 4 fundamental freedoms of the EU ( free movement of goods, services, capital and persons within the EU, the famous “four freedoms” set out in the Treaty of Rome ) plus the ECJ jurisdiction for the UK to stay in EASA.

Somehow I can not see this happen.
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 12:31
  #696 (permalink)  
 
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Why would the EU offer an EASA membership for a third country that just destroyed a peace treaty they have signed, does not fulfill its past obligations and seriously disrupts EU commerce? Answer: It wouldn't. Easy as that. The EU has already done its homework with its unilateral no deal legislation that it can withdraw without prior notice at any time, just protecting its own interests. And Airlines, workers, shareholders in a third country are not an interest to the EU.
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 18:05
  #697 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by portos8 View Post
So he will have to accept the 4 fundamental freedoms of the EU ( free movement of goods, services, capital and persons within the EU, the famous “four freedoms” set out in the Treaty of Rome ) plus the ECJ jurisdiction for the UK to stay in EASA.

Somehow I can not see this happen.
The UK has no choice.

Either it becomes an associate member of another regulatory authority elsewhere in the world, which will take months just to sort the paperwork or the CAA becomes a full, internationally recognised, regulatory authority which will take the best part of a decade.

The only way that the UK can continue to fly on 1 November is to approach the EU for associate membership of EASA, BEFORE that date and face off the idiots at home who are refusing to have any links with the EU or ECJ.
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Old 1st Aug 2019, 19:38
  #698 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
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Remember that EASA is not the EU.

Further, the CAA was independent once before; if they pull their finger out, they can be so again!

The UK does have a choice, and should not be weak when faced with such scaremongering!

By your patronising reckoning, I must be an ‘idiot’.

How other non-EU airlines somehow work it out, is beyond my feeble, idiotic brain cells, but all is not lost.
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Old 2nd Aug 2019, 03:57
  #699 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 777JRM View Post
How other non-EU airlines somehow work it out, is beyond my feeble, idiotic brain cells, but all is not lost.
Probably because they operate under their NAA with approved regulations and Licences already in place that have no doubt taken years to develop and evolve. Come 1st November, in event of a hard exit, what approved and legislated regulations and Licences will the CAA have in place? As yet I have not seen anything issued by them as a standalone NAA, or advice that they have all this in place ready to go.
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Old 2nd Aug 2019, 06:33
  #700 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 777JRM View Post
Further, the CAA was independent once before; if they pull their finger out, they can be so again!
Yes, all the CAA needs to do is to have started the transition process about 10 years ago ...

If continued UK membership of EASA cannot be agreed, the UK could empower the UK CAA to discharge all the UK’s ICAO responsibilities. This would require the UK CAA to rebuild its competence in the many areas of an NAA’s remit which are currently delegated to EASA. Given the large number [around 300] of additional specialist staff needed, and the new systems and processes that would need to be put in place and used by industry, this could not be achieved by March 2019. Most of the specialists who carried out these tasks in the CAA prior to EASA taking them over have gone to EASA, taken on other work at the CAA, or retired. Based on the UK’s experience of transference of regulatory responsibility to the European level back in 2002, there is no evidence to suggest that a ‘reverse transfer’ back to the UK would be less challenging.

Under this scenario, a multi-year transition would be needed, during which activities would gradually move under the CAA’s direction. If suitable transition measures were not put in place there would be disruption of services following Brexit, increased costs to business, and almost certainly loss of business to UK companies. The reasons for this have been covered in the section on how the system works today with EASA above. Indeed, if this scenario appears likely during 2018 it is likely that the uncertainty will already cause UK industry to lose business. Businesses which have operations in multiple countries might decide to move some activities out of the UK and other businesses might move out of the UK. Clearly this would not be an option in every case. In any event, such moves would not be beneficial to the UK economy.

A transition period with high levels of change is not good for product safety assurance, as it takes the focus away from assuring every task is done correctly and from continuous improvement requiring additional work that does not add to safety. This situation would be worse if the transition period was badly managed, or indeed if there was an attempt to manage with no transition period and all the competent resources and system were not in place at Brexit.
Civil Aviation Regulation: What Future after Brexit?
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