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Heavy casualties reported in Algerian IL78 crash

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Heavy casualties reported in Algerian IL78 crash

Old 11th Apr 2018, 08:39
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Heavy casualties reported in Algerian IL78 crash

According to initial report (from the Sun mind you ) as many as 200.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/602311...h-toll-latest/


https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/...081014559.html


Just googling it seems the 78 is mainly a tanker, and that it is likely a 76 (which is what Algerian military operate ) but, of no consequence in this tragedy.

Last edited by captplaystation; 11th Apr 2018 at 08:49.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 09:04
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Originally Posted by captplaystation View Post
According to initial report (from the Sun mind you ) as many as 200.

Just googling it seems the 78 is mainly a tanker, and that it is likely a 76 (which is what Algerian military operate ) but, of no consequence in this tragedy.
The Al Jazeera link correctly identifies it as an Il-76. The narrative and photos of the crash site in open farmland don't really square with the "as many as 200 dead" report in the Sun, though clearly all on board perished.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 10:29
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Video Grab: Scene outside Boufarik airport after Algerian military plane crash
Shows tail of aircraft with left horizontal stabilizer in the vertical position.



Video can be seen on this page
BREAKING Algerian Military plane with about 100 people onboard crashed near Boufarik airbase | AIRLIVE.net
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 10:53
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Algerian Ennahar tv reporting 300 onboard with 247 confirmed dead so far.

Edit to add just gone up to 257

Last edited by Officer Kite; 11th Apr 2018 at 11:20.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 11:22
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Il-76 payload = 17,500Kg. 300 pax + bags = 30,000kgs.

Plane crashed just after take-off.

Oops.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 11:41
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Originally Posted by rcsa View Post
Il-76 payload = 17,500Kg. 300 pax + bags = 30,000kgs.

Plane crashed just after take-off.

Oops.
I hope it's not the error of using the average person weight for the load calculation instead of the real weight of serviceman & kit.

If so it's not the first time this has happened.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 11:48
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IL76MD, a variant the Algerians have, can lift approx 40T of payload.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 11:51
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Originally Posted by rcsa View Post
Il-76 payload = 17,500Kg. 300 pax + bags = 30,000kgs.

Plane crashed just after take-off.

Oops.
Il76 payload depending of a model is 40 to 50 tons. Nevertheless the normal troops capacity is around 150 or so...
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 12:31
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At least 257 on board... That sounds like a fairly significant overload!
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 12:45
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Al Watan (the most reliable Algerian news source) also reports 257 casualties, 10 crew the rest military personnel and their families.

Weight wise not an issue (some Il-76 variants can take as much as 60 tons payload) but how on earth did they manage to cram that many into that space (perhaps some fold-down double-decker config, like it was in the C-124 ?)
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 12:50
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Originally Posted by andrasz View Post
Weight wise not an issue (some Il-76 variants can take as much as 60 tons payload) but how on earth did they manage to cram that many into that space
Balance issue?
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 13:00
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According to the BBC, the 257 aboard consisted of not only troops but also their families, so conceivably there may be many small children among them. There are also 10 crew believed killed, presumably included in the number being cited. A massive tragedy for the Algerians.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 13:11
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Hold size 728x135” = 682 sq ft

For 250 passengers each would have 2.73 sq ft or a 1.6x1.6 ft space on the floor.

Tight !
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 13:18
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There is a double-decker config for IL76 making it aprox 250 troops capacity but I am not sure how often/widely it used these days...

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Old 11th Apr 2018, 13:23
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Possible Engine failure with MTOW exceeded... nightmare scenario.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 13:26
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Originally Posted by flash8 View Post
Possible Engine failure with MTOW exceeded... nightmare scenario.
You cant exceed MTOW on IL76 with just 250 pax and fuelled for Algerian domestic flight
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 13:41
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Originally Posted by CargoOne View Post
There is a double-decker config for IL76
That's the one I was thinking of, thanks. Read about it somewhere but could not find a photo anywhere.

Originally Posted by CargoOne View Post
You cant exceed MTOW on IL76 with just 250 pax and fuelled for Algerian domestic flight
Completely agree, the load while unusual is well within aircraft capabilities, and may be easily accommodated with the kit shown above. Any number of things (or more likely their combination) could have gone wrong here (bird strike, incorrect flaps/slats, thrust, W/B just to name a few), at this stage there is nothing to go on. El Watan reports that the accident happened right on the airport perimeter (and is also confirmed by the released photos & videos, there are built up areas further along the extended centreline in both directions) so whatever happened occurred just around liftoff.

Last edited by andrasz; 11th Apr 2018 at 13:54.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 14:13
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Originally Posted by rcsa View Post
Il-76 payload = 17,500Kg. 300 pax + bags = 30,000kgs.

Plane crashed just after take-off.

Oops.
The Algerian Air Force operates both Il-76 and Il-78. This could be either. There are different models with different weights, but on average, their empty weight is about 92 tonnes and their Zero Fuel Weights are 139.5. So on average, they can haul a payload of about 47 tonnes, although I find that on the internet, most indicate a payload of 42 tonnes.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 14:37
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Accident location

https://www.google.com/maps/@36.5305.../data=!3m1!1e3

Clearly identifiable from videos/photos posted on news sites and social media, in fields between A1 highway and the end of RWY 22. The airport perimeter guard towers appear clearly in some photos.
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Old 11th Apr 2018, 15:01
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(bird strike, incorrect flaps/slats, thrust, W/B just to name a few)
Fairly intact tail section resting close to engines and fuel tanks, together with the proximity to the end of runway suggest a stall to me.

Condolences to all involved.
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