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Smartlynx A320 runway excursion EETN 28.2.2018

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Smartlynx A320 runway excursion EETN 28.2.2018

Old 4th Nov 2019, 06:37
  #121 (permalink)  
 
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Investigation Report - Accident, Loss of Control with Airbus A320-214 near Tallinn Airport on 28.02.2018
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Old 4th Nov 2019, 08:05
  #122 (permalink)  
 
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From a Boeing driver who hasn't got a clue about Airbus flight controls;

Is ELAC PITCH FAULT a dispatchable defect? To get a sense of the seriousness of such a message. To me it doesn't sound normal to keep resetting a computer that's not playing. Not only one, but two, computers erring quite early in on the training session. And they kept departing.
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Old 4th Nov 2019, 09:01
  #123 (permalink)  
 
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Elac 1 pitch fault is dispatchable, Elac 2 is not.
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Old 4th Nov 2019, 09:01
  #124 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 172_driver View Post
From a Boeing driver who hasn't got a clue about Airbus flight controls;

Is ELAC PITCH FAULT a dispatchable defect? To get a sense of the seriousness of such a message. To me it doesn't sound normal to keep resetting a computer that's not playing. Not only one, but two, computers erring quite early in on the training session. And they kept departing.
It is NO DISPATCH on ELAC2 and conditional on ELAC1 but here comes in play the ambiguity whether you apply MEL inside touch and goes, now it was clarified by Airbus because of this accident.
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Old 4th Nov 2019, 10:45
  #125 (permalink)  
 
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Thanks, the result spoke for itself this time.
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Old 6th Nov 2019, 12:45
  #126 (permalink)  
 
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i´m sorry but paragraph 5 from page 15 of the report doesn´t make sense whatsoever.

And then much less what is done in paragraph 6.

5. Four seconds later, while the aircraft was approximately 950m from the end of the runway 08, flying with the airspeed of 190 kt, at 19 ft, pitch attitude maximum of 2.8° Nose Up was reached, thrust levers were moved to IDLE and the flap lever was moved from CONF2 to CONF1, moving the flaps from conf. 2 to 1+F.

6. At 15:05:21 the instructor commanded “gear up” and the gear lever was selected to GEAR UP position. Two seconds later the aircraft reached its maximum altitude over the runway – 48ft and started to descend. The pitch attitude was 0.3° Nose Up, THS remained in 1.5° Nose Up position, and thrust levers were set back to TOGA (Figure 6).

Are the investigators sure it wasn´t the plane itself and not the TRI who put the thrust to idle??

And before this, are they sure Lever position before this was fully clacked at TOGA and not sensed by the plane in MCT/CLIMB??
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Old 6th Nov 2019, 14:25
  #127 (permalink)  
 
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Imagine you’re in what you think is a serviceable aircraft (or one where you haven’t yet realised the elevators have failed) with a wildly increasing airspeed approaching Vfe for the current configuration (200 knots flap 2), it might seem reasonable to reduce the thrust and retract a stage of flap (although idle thrust that close to the ground is a brave or unconsidered action). The auto thrust is disengaged with TOGA selected, there’s no way the aircraft would deliver anything other than TOGA thrust unless the thrust levers were moved back, MCT would be delivered at the next detent, the auto thrust only becomes active with a second click backwards reaching the climb detent.

I can’t imagine what it felt like when the results of those actions became apparent.
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Old 6th Nov 2019, 17:42
  #128 (permalink)  
 
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I refused to take a 320 with an ELAC 1 pitch fault that had occurred on push back.
Next day got phone call to be b*****d for not following the Mel and departing. Luckily I had kept in touch with the engineer who had informed me that the cause was a rather unknown relay. He considered the relay a no go item & being at main base not worth the risk. The bloke on the phone apologised & I got a thank you letter. This was early days of the 320 early 90s. What this waffle is about is that after failure things do not always go as the manufacturer may lead you to believe. The crew imho taken more note of the intermittent ELAC failures but boy did they then do a good job.
To those who think I should have taken the aircraft as per the Mel. Well fine but I always use the proviso do I understand what is wrong with the aircraft. If I don’t I do not go. My Mel if you like.
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Old 6th Nov 2019, 19:44
  #129 (permalink)  
 
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Followed this story ( along with the gradual dismantling of the airframe as I taxied by it ) The initial rumors were quite perplexing, but nothing like as scary as the eventually revealed reality. They were lucky with a capital WTF that this didn't end with a smoking hole in the middle of the village/ houses just off the 26 threshold.
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Old 6th Apr 2022, 12:15
  #130 (permalink)  
 
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I have just read the full report about this incident. How come both SECs got lost after receiving that one main landing gear was on the ground and the other not? I understand that they (the monitoring and control part of each SEC) received conflicting data (ground/flight mode) but it is a known scenario isn't it? In this specific case, with one MLG on the ground, you should get at least a partial deployment of the spoilers according to the FCOM but surely not the loss of those 2 computers! Anyone able to clarify this? Official report can be found on the
Estonian Safety Investigation Bureau (ESIB), sorry I'm not allowed to copy URLs.
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Old 6th Apr 2022, 12:16
  #131 (permalink)  
 
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I am now

https://ojk.ee/en/content/animation-...allinn-airport
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Old 6th Apr 2022, 12:35
  #132 (permalink)  
 
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That gave me the shivers.
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Old 6th Apr 2022, 20:39
  #133 (permalink)  
 
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During my Upgrade to Captain the very same Instructor was doing my Sim and he presented me with this failure and its side-effects no one knows about . Even Airbus is not acting towards a solution for that . so basically you Sioux City but you need to fight the Airplane till the end to actually essential advance the trust seconds before touchdown to get the nose up moment to land.....
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