FO removed from BA Flight
Of equal concern is the disruption to available hours of sleep. While fasting, if that's what you want to do, then any eating needs to occur outside of daylight hours and is accompanied by a strict regime of prayer. So, depending on geographic location and time of year, this can mean getting up as early as 3 am for a morning meal (break fast, get it) and not being able to go to bed until 10 or 11 at night.
This inevitably has a major impact on restful sleep patterns. Combine it with flying duties and a bit of ketone on the breath then becomes a minor problem. Though not for the person sitting next to you.
This inevitably has a major impact on restful sleep patterns. Combine it with flying duties and a bit of ketone on the breath then becomes a minor problem. Though not for the person sitting next to you.
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Anyone got any ideas on how to get help to a person before it blows up like this ? You got someone you know who has reputation for being a bit of a binge drinker , few run ins with the law , history of failed relationships , family concerns but he is a good bloke so he gets looked after . Any approach sees his friends and family circle the wagons ! Intervention ? Or it has to blow up before anything can be done ?
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In the USA as well. A good friend of mine is Muslim and will not eat or drink during the day during Ramadan. He has flown like this for over 20 years. Even working out in the gym, he stays faithful. Pretty impressive.
Fasting and flying is very common in the Middle East
https://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-71960.html
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I lived in ANC for a few years. I never heard of this incident. Can you cite a source for this info? Thanks.
It was a Dc8.
JAL Cargo Flight 8054 was a charter flight on January 13, 1977, from Grant County, Washington to Tokyo with a stopover in Anchorage. The flight crashed during the initial climb phase, shortly after takeoff from Anchorage due to pilot intoxication.
JAL Cargo Flight 8054 was a charter flight on January 13, 1977, from Grant County, Washington to Tokyo with a stopover in Anchorage. The flight crashed during the initial climb phase, shortly after takeoff from Anchorage due to pilot intoxication.
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I urge people not to read too much into media regards police response! From my perspective (10 years) there's likely to have been a lot going on around that time of day for any police service and no doubt Gatwick's ARV's were closest/closest available unit. Between 7-9 (on a late) is a cracking break time for a uniform patrol cop.
I'd be shocked if the officers went on board with firearms deployed, no doubt rifles were stowed in vehicle safe and they had Glocks on their legs/tasers on vests.
Handcuffs - officer's personal responsibility; resulting in a "use of force" form at the end of the shift. Depends how FO was transported to custody, if he sat in the back of the ARV then I'd say handcuffs were a 100% due to him being an unknown entity (be it unstable through alcohol or medically and the fact he likely has no criminal record to speak of).
From a speculative POV (and I have no idea how they board this type of flight at Gatwick). At my airfield a 777 is boarded via air bridge through door 2nd door just forward of the wing - if this is the case - I'm surprised no video has emerged of the arrest/intervention...unless the Police were more discreet than people think.
I'd be shocked if the officers went on board with firearms deployed, no doubt rifles were stowed in vehicle safe and they had Glocks on their legs/tasers on vests.
Handcuffs - officer's personal responsibility; resulting in a "use of force" form at the end of the shift. Depends how FO was transported to custody, if he sat in the back of the ARV then I'd say handcuffs were a 100% due to him being an unknown entity (be it unstable through alcohol or medically and the fact he likely has no criminal record to speak of).
From a speculative POV (and I have no idea how they board this type of flight at Gatwick). At my airfield a 777 is boarded via air bridge through door 2nd door just forward of the wing - if this is the case - I'm surprised no video has emerged of the arrest/intervention...unless the Police were more discreet than people think.
Not that unusual...all sorts of reasons why, but the usual reason is since BA, like many other airlines, uses a seniority based promotion system if you join as a DEP your flying hours accrued in a previous company/military don’t accelerate your move to the left hand seat, you join the bottom of the umpteen years queue for a chance of an upgrade.
Saw a programme on the superefficient Japanese rail system
When the drivers clock into work they go through a security gate
Along that stretch is a device which they blow into taking less than a minute to check they are alcohol free for duty
I am surprised a similar check isn’t made at airports
A lot is saving pilots from themselves and hence their careers
When the drivers clock into work they go through a security gate
Along that stretch is a device which they blow into taking less than a minute to check they are alcohol free for duty
I am surprised a similar check isn’t made at airports
A lot is saving pilots from themselves and hence their careers
She was surprised when I said that there's no similar system here. Maybe there should be.
I don’t think there would be any complaints at a ground up system of alcohol and drugs checking before work from the cleaner through to pilots, management and continuing up to judges, lawmakers, etc. I think what annoys many is seeing the workers being treated like potential terrorists and criminals every time they go to work while others get merry in a subsidized company or parliamentary bar and then go on to make some life changing votes or decisions.
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CargoOne
Ex mil, ex some other carrier, ex different career.
So that's that one put to bed. Move along now, and like a lot of the posters here, try not to assume.
*see wiggy's post above for fuller explanation.
is it normal these days for BA to have FO who is 49 years old? Assuming he started his carrier in early 20s he must be approacing 18-20k hours under his belt?
So that's that one put to bed. Move along now, and like a lot of the posters here, try not to assume.
*see wiggy's post above for fuller explanation.
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What's shocking is how little the general population, let along pilots whose livelihoods depend on their health, understand about their endocrine system.
You do not need to eat to "keep up your blood sugar levels". Your body can do that on its own, unless you are diabetic.
If you are suffering from lethargy after not eating for a little while then it is an indictment of your poor diet which relies on mostly refined carbs and sugar.
It is little surprise that the western population is so obese, when was the last time you had a look at what is in your food.
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If the statement that a 49 year old male remains in custody is also correct, it is highly probable that suspicion of an offence taking place was the correct action. The reason a suspect would remain in custody on suspicion of any alcohol related offence would be that they remain too intoxicated to be interviewed about the circumstances. Detainees have three options to prove innocence or guilt in alcohol related offences. Blood sample, urine sample or breath sample from the custody suite intoximetre. The intoximetre is instant and admissible evidence. Two readings are taken and the lower one is used for evidential purposes. Suspects who need to be questioned will often be given a few hours in custody and the breath tests repeated until they are deemed within limits to be interviewed.
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With regards to testing, we have in my own industry (construction), started carrying out random testing (both Blue and White collar) in the UK and the findings are appalling in my view. However the issue is not alcohol but drugs. On one project I am aware of they had a 60% failure rate ! Another rail infrastructure company carrying out similar tests on employees out of circa 3000 test produced about 1700 failure,s, ONLY one of which was for alcohol ! For my generation alcohol was probably, and maybe still is the drug of choice mostly, but that has now very much changed in my industry, not sure about aviation.
I hope the officer involved is treated fairly, and receives treatment / help if required, and is not just hung out to dry, no pun intended.
I hope the officer involved is treated fairly, and receives treatment / help if required, and is not just hung out to dry, no pun intended.
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On a recent coach trip in the UK, the engine cut out due to overheating in slow London traffic. The driver had to blow into a built in breathalyser before it would allow him to start the engine. I don't know how widespread this is.
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
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City workers do not drink as much as those in aviation and it's not a point for amusement.
2. The only police I ever see at airports these days are heavily armed.
3. Would be interesting to know if the CC side-stepped the usual chain of command and reported this incident to the police without talking to the senior CC and then the captain first. Outcome should involve FO removed and company informed, no doubt, but appropriate action from the company should remove the need to involve the police and the criminal courts, in my humble opinion.