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USA Today: UA forcibly remove random pax from flight

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USA Today: UA forcibly remove random pax from flight

Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:30
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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Any number of reasons from technical (broken seat) to behavioural (intoxicated passenger) and everything inbetween.
I am curious why security (police) were required for what should have been an operational matter. This situation (which hasn't been fully explained) superficiously seems to be a management failure, and by that I mean how the specific situation was managed. Any experienced pilot or crew member will tell You there are many ways to "skin a cat" and resolve a difficult situation. Dragging a passenger down the aisle by their heels wouldn't be a sensible resolution for most of them, as United are no doubt about to find out.
Sorry I should have been clearer. Why does there ever need to be an involuntary removal when you're overbooked?
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:30
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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There must be more to the story, that video was started well in to the event, but it certainly doesn't look good for UA at all.


I once had to reduce weight by 10 people in an unusual tailwind situation and the cash offer exceeded US$1,500 plus food, hotel, transportation, and the next flight confirmed, etc. People jumped at it. I feel bad for the first 2 people who accepted $500.


I would have rather cancelled the flight then let it get to the point of dragging people around - but - the good news is that, if this played out as published, this guy will probably be getting enough money to charter his own jet in the future.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:31
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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Protocols? Oh, it's OK to over sell tickets and then bump customers so you can position crew?
Yes, sometimes it happens, but it doesn't usually take too much ingenuity to avoid getting into this awful situation.
Sorry I should have been clearer. Why does there ever need to be an involuntary removal when you're overbooked?
Because the airlines policy was to overbook. It appears here that the seats were needed for operational reasons. If you don't get enough volunteers you have to remove people who don't want to be removed. There are varying degrees of that, and in the worst case it might be necessary to deplane everybody and start again. Far better (and likely quicker in the circumstances) than ending up in this mess.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:33
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by AluminumStructure View Post
There must be more to the story, that video was started well in to the event, but it certainly doesn't look good for UA at all.


I once had to reduce weight by 10 people in an unusual tailwind situation and the cash offer exceeded US$1,500 plus food, hotel, transportation, and the next flight confirmed, etc. People jumped at it. I feel bad for the first 2 people who accepted $500.


I would have rather cancelled the flight then let it get to the point of dragging people around - but - the good news is that, if this played out as published, this guy will probably be getting enough money to charter his own jet in the future.
Yeah, this is what I don't understand. You just keep raising the price until you get volunteers. I don't understand why it ever needs to be involuntary if you're overbooked.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:33
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Cha ching. I will take that blank check now.

I stopped flying on UAL twenty years ago, along with AA, because of their pizz poor service and attitudes.

We don't know what the airport police officers were told by UAL staff. They could have been asked to remove an unruly passenger.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:45
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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CGB

Yes, it is appropriate to overbook. Welcome to the airline world.

Bub

Don't equate the man being pulled off the plane as a failure of protocol. 3 of the 4 people to be removed did so, the fourth didn't comply with lawful order from the police officer and you saw the result. The aircraft isn't a public place, if those responsible and with the authority to remove the pax did so properly, then it's incumbent upon the pax to leave. The good Dr needs to remember he also has responsibilities as well.

Hems

Why would he get anything besides a refund? He didn't comply with a requirement to leave the aircraft from airline officials , and did the same to police. I have no idea if UA or the police have bigger plans for him, but covering his 3rd point of contact should be his concern, he's the only one who did anything wrong.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:46
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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Yes, sometimes it happens, but it doesn't usually take too much ingenuity to avoid getting into this awful situation.
Because the airlines policy was to overbook. It appears here that the seats were needed for operational reasons. If you don't get enough volunteers you have to remove people who don't want to be removed. There are varying degrees of that, and in the worst case it might be necessary to deplane everybody and start again. Far better (and likely quicker in the circumstances) than ending up in this mess.
Again, I don't understand, you just keep raising the price until you get volunteers. It doesn't take more than 30 seconds. Ring your call button if I have any takers at $2000, $3000, etc.?

The only reason I can think of is United it too tight to do that.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:55
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Never let the facts get in the way of customer perception.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:58
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by West Coast View Post

Hems

Why would he get anything besides a refund? He didn't comply with a requirement to leave the aircraft from airline officials , and did the same to police. I have no idea if UA or the police have bigger plans for him, but covering his 3rd point of contact should be his concern, he's the only one who did anything wrong.
It has to be - REASONABLE and LAWFUL. The cops can't be agents for the airlines for civil matters. This pax was not disruptive, not drunk, not a threat to security.

Ironically, the Chicago Airport LEOs aren't even trusted with firearms.

Bottom line
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:58
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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Maybe Chicago was so disappointing that everyone wanted to leave, no matter what.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 19:59
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by hitchens97 View Post
Again, I don't understand, you just keep raising the price until you get volunteers. It doesn't take more than 30 seconds. Ring your call button if I have any takers at $2000, $3000, etc.?

Here's an article published yesterday bragging about how the author made $11,000 by getting bumped off Delta flights a few days ago:

Apr 9, 2017 @ 07:00 AM

Why Delta Air Lines Paid Me $11,000 Not To Fly To Florida This Weekend

Laura Begley Bloom

Over the past week, Delta Air Lines has encountered epic travel delays after unprecedented storms forced the cancellation of thousands of flights.

I travel a lot for my career, and when I’m headed somewhere, I want to get there. As a travel editor, I’ve run stories about people who make a profession out of getting bumped by the airlines. And yet, I’ve always quietly scoffed at travelers who would give up a seat on a flight in exchange for a voucher. Not my thing.

This weekend, my family and I profited from Delta's travel woes — big time. We made $11k. Here's how we did it and why I'm not such a snob about getting bumped any more.
The article is here: https://www.forbes.com/sites/laurabe.../#7534167a4de1
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:01
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by twb3 View Post
Bottom line is that it's United's aircraft.
You're kidding right?

It's their aircraft so it'ts ok to assault the customers?
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:01
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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Certainly very bad publicity for UA and deservedly so. No way to offload legit passengers.
Has hit the news in Germany as well.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:01
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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Chicago Police Department statement:

"At approximately 6:00 p.m., a 69-year-old male Asian airline passenger become irate after he was asked to disembark from a flight that was oversold. The passenger in question began yelling to voice his displeasure at which point Aviation Police were summoned. Aviation Officers arrived on scene attempted to carry the individual off of the flight when he fell. His head subsequently struck an armrest causing injuries to his face. The man was taken to Lutheran General Hospital with non-life threatening injuries. Ongoing investigation."

Presumably written before they became aware that there are several different videos of the incident circulating on the Net ...
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:05
  #55 (permalink)  
 
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Again, I don't understand, you just keep raising the price until you get volunteers. It doesn't take more than 30 seconds. Ring your call button if I have any takers at $2000, $3000, etc.?

The only reason I can think of is United it too tight to do that.
Yes, all businesses are. There is a limit to the compensation they will offer at this stage of contract failure. Generally this action takes place at the gate before boarding.

don't equate the man being pulled off the plane as a failure of protocol. 3 of the 4 people to be removed did so, the fourth didn't comply with lawful order from the police officer and you saw the result. The aircraft isn't a public place, if those responsible and with the authority to remove the pax did so properly, then it's incumbent upon the pax to leave. The good Dr needs to remember he also has responsibilities as well.
No indeed. However it does raise the question why the police were called?
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:07
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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From reports they got to $800 and a hotel.

CFR 250.5 fixes compensation for denied bording at 400% of the fare, with a maximum of $1350. (Can be less if they get rerouted to arrive within an hour or two)

Perhaps if they fixed it at $10,000, (not a percentage of the fare) there would never be another denied boarding.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:09
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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Yes, all businesses are. There is a limit to the compensation they will offer at this stage of contract failure. Generally this action takes place at the gate before boarding.
FWIW - passengers are saying they offered $800, and when no takers, said an algorithm had determined 4 passengers.

In other words they were cheap gits.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:10
  #58 (permalink)  
c52
 
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So it's important to the police what part of the world a person looks as if they come from?
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:10
  #59 (permalink)  
 
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Being in aviation claims of all sorts including pax liability, UA(well, their insurance company)is going to get crushed on this one. Attorneys are probably camping in front of his house now since the video is viral, and they see an innocent physician being man-handled like a sack of rice, blood on his face. Oh an American jury would tee-off on United if it ever made it to court, multiple of eye witnesses to take the stand for the plaintiff, so UA will throw big money at this one to make it go away.
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Old 10th Apr 2017, 20:11
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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What has race got to do with it? He is a paying passenger. And he was NOT wearing leggings!
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