Jet airways v low after takeoff at LHR
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Jet airways v low after takeoff at LHR
Jet plane flies too low after take-off from Heathrow, pilots suspended | india-news | Hindustan Times
Reports that it was just metres above the boundary wall after an intersection takeoff in a 777
Reports that it was just metres above the boundary wall after an intersection takeoff in a 777
Flight would have been 9W117, off 27L at 21:36 local on the day in question (30th August this year).
Curiously, although its track and altitude were displayed on Heathrow's WebTrak system following the event, all record of it now seems to have been removed, although its presence can still be inferred from the readings shown on WebTrak as it passes over the noise monitors.
Mode S/ADS-B data indicates that it was about 350' AAL as it crossed Spout Lane (Stanwell Moor).
Curiously, although its track and altitude were displayed on Heathrow's WebTrak system following the event, all record of it now seems to have been removed, although its presence can still be inferred from the readings shown on WebTrak as it passes over the noise monitors.
Mode S/ADS-B data indicates that it was about 350' AAL as it crossed Spout Lane (Stanwell Moor).
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Maybe because of of the works presently underway southside from Victor to S1 holding point the aircraft used an intersection take-off point of SB3 or S4E which gives a much lesser take-off distance than the normal full length.
So was this a case of incorrect performance data for the take-off or is it, as implied by the article, that they actually held the aircraft low after take-off (presumably because the FO's new girl friend was watching from the end of the runway)? 
What was the taxi clearance and did they request an intersection departure? Would this not have been seen as slightly odd by atc if they did ask for an intersection? I remember being told about a B747 that had numerous problems dispatching to the far east and eventually only went as far as Amsterdam but with the full asian route fuel aboard. The lengthy take off roll was commented on by ATC.
Standing by for another speculation frenzy!
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suspended the captain and co-pilot of the flight for maintaining an “unsafe altitude”
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Well, DEP criteria states 35 FEET above the end of the DEP runway.
Locals call police on low flying aircraft? That is how this was found out? Not that one wants to empower the locals complaining about aircraft at LHR...
ATC didnt notice anything?
If that is the case, there are plenty of twins B787, B777,and other ac that cross that point at around 350/400'...just watch a 787 cross that point..
Locals call police on low flying aircraft? That is how this was found out? Not that one wants to empower the locals complaining about aircraft at LHR...
ATC didnt notice anything?
Mode S/ADS-B data indicates that it was about 350' AAL as it crossed Spout Lane (Stanwell Moor).
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Last edited by underfire; 7th Oct 2016 at 04:57.
All we know so far is that by the time it flew over any habitation (the first is some 3000 ft beyond the end of the 27L TODA) it was at 350' AAL.
Clearly the DGCA don't consider that was a reasonable height to have achieved by that point, and the fact that Heathrow has chosen to suppress the flight track and vertical profile would suggest that the story isn't over yet.
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A few years ago I was in central India talking to a recently retired American Airlines pilot at the bar who had flown out from UK with AI on a 747. His comment was when he was a pilot they often used to line up behind AI 747 and watched them struggle off down the runway at LHR go "over the hump" as he described it, slightly disappear from view and the seemingly struggle skyward. He said it was always worth watching from outside, but vouched safe that it was not so much fun when on board !
747-100s departing LHR nonstop for LAX/SFO were a classic for this on warm summer afternoons in the 1970s-80s. BA always refused to put 747s on these routes until the better-powered 747-200B came into their fleet, but Pan Am and TWA, both of whom fully stocked up with the first production models, were stuck with what they had got.
Among other tower comments on a 10R departure were TWA "departing via the Piccadilly Line" and Pan Am "being a Hedge Clipper".
Among other tower comments on a 10R departure were TWA "departing via the Piccadilly Line" and Pan Am "being a Hedge Clipper".
I grew up in that part of the world and crossing the Stanwell New Road at 350 feet would be standard to good for a 747-100 in the summer and a Trident full and on a hot day wasn't going upwards very fast either.
it does however seem odd that no one from the airport side of things seem to notice it taking off from a point that is quite long way down the runway. As for the locals complaining well one thing about living that close to an airport you sure as anything pick up on any unusual noise be it louder or different to what you hear all day every day and Stanwell Moor residents would certainly detect that as quick as a flash.
it does however seem odd that no one from the airport side of things seem to notice it taking off from a point that is quite long way down the runway. As for the locals complaining well one thing about living that close to an airport you sure as anything pick up on any unusual noise be it louder or different to what you hear all day every day and Stanwell Moor residents would certainly detect that as quick as a flash.
It will be interesting to see if the recommendation made by the AAIB following the similar Air Lanka A340 incident at LHR in 2012:
"It is recommended that the International Civil Aviation Organization introduce a standard or recommended practice for fixed wing aeroplanes to record the flight management system takeoff performance data entries on the flight data recorder during the takeoff phase. The data should be retained in the operator’s flight data analysis programme."
turns out to be relevant to this investigation.
AFAIK, to date ICAO has not agreed to implement any such measure.
"It is recommended that the International Civil Aviation Organization introduce a standard or recommended practice for fixed wing aeroplanes to record the flight management system takeoff performance data entries on the flight data recorder during the takeoff phase. The data should be retained in the operator’s flight data analysis programme."
turns out to be relevant to this investigation.
AFAIK, to date ICAO has not agreed to implement any such measure.
>Among other tower comments on a 10R departure were TWA "departing via the Piccadilly Line" and Pan Am "being a Hedge Clipper".
They weren't faring much better 130 miles further up Amber One, either.
Growing up under the airway near Castle Don., it was often possible to make out the over-large "Pan Am" markings on a lumbering -100 series, the intake "drone" being clearly audible, too.
I never did find out what kind of height they were making at this point, but the perspective was/is similar to that of an EK 777 departing Newcastle and passing over our ranch at FL180 or so. After around 30 miles track!
They weren't faring much better 130 miles further up Amber One, either.
Growing up under the airway near Castle Don., it was often possible to make out the over-large "Pan Am" markings on a lumbering -100 series, the intake "drone" being clearly audible, too.
I never did find out what kind of height they were making at this point, but the perspective was/is similar to that of an EK 777 departing Newcastle and passing over our ranch at FL180 or so. After around 30 miles track!
Makes you wonder how these examples would have performed after engine failure at V1.
Heard on Tower frequency at LHR as a Trident began its take-off run: 'You're about to witness De Havilland's attempt at the world land speed record.'
a Trident full and on a hot day wasn't going upwards very fast either
I remember the Seaboard World DC-8-63s that seemed to require the curvature of the earth to get airborne. Heard one request 28R as 28L was not long enough. 12800ft vs. 12000ft.