Emirates B777 gear collapse @ DXB?

[Airbubba]

In the media the 'emergency landing' theme seems to persist despite the updated headlines:

Meanwhile, the pilot and crew have been roundly praised for landing the plane, with initial reports suggesting the pilot asked the airport for permission for a crash landing.

'Emirates pilot looks like he expertly landed the 777, and although there was a fire, still was time for pax [sic] to exit, get away,' Tweeted US-based journalist and aviation blogger Gerry Doyle.

And an Indian journalist for ABP news wrote: 'Passengers on board Emirates flight almost kiss & survive death..Pilot deserves all praises to have managed to save so many lives.'

Also praising the pilot from India, where the flight originated, was Bollywood star Pushkar Jog, who said: 'Emirates EK521 flight crashes after landing at d Dubai airport . Pilot saved 282 lives ..All passengers safe.'

Emirates pilots tried to abort landing when they crashed into Dubai runway | Daily Mail Online

[Deep and fast]

Had the previous aircraft vacated at the go around request? The atc tape seems like a standard go around from atc.

[Wirbelsturm]

'Asked for a crash landing' annnnnd the Tower controller just gave him a normal clearance and a vacate point?

Doesn't sound like he asked for anything out of the ordinary to me!

[aussie10]

Lets not the truth get in the way of a Superhero potential

So I've read it all now... bit of the odd knob polishing drivel going on here!!! Looooong (means very long) landing/lo go around/ over pitch due to thrust/ tail STRIKE (means struck very hard) leading to superhero status for l*cal Cap, and blame on FO and a round of more beatings for the rest of us, Two UAE ac down in 4 months....things go in three's lets hope it stops there, But I doubt it

[suninmyeyes]

It is only when you know about a subject that you realise how absolutely crap the reporting is.


I would like to bet the following were all false reports:


1) The plane was on fire before it landed.
2) The passengers were briefed for an emergency landing
3)The crew forgot to put the gear down
4)The tower told the crew to check the gear was down

[goeasy]

Always possible the PM grabbed the gear leaver instead of flap lever in fright of wake/heavy bounce, and unexpected go around call........

[tdracer]

It is only when you know about a subject that you realise how absolutely crap the reporting is.

No, you don't have to be an expert on the subject to realize how bad most reporting is, but it does make it more obvious
One part that makes zero sense is the idea that they knew they had a gear problem - had they known they were landing gear up they would have told ATC, declared an emergency, and requested that the runway be foamed. Remember the LOT 767 that did a gear up several years back? They didn't even scratch up the aircraft much.

I think the botched go-around theory is the most likely.

[ULMFlyer]

He seemed pretty calm reading back the instruction to climb to 4000 ft. Which brings me to when was that issued, before or after they bounced? In the audio/animation posted by too_much it seems to be before touchdown, but who knows?

[ExRR]

Originally Posted by suninmyeyes

It is only when you know about a subject that you realise how absolutely crap the reporting is.

Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for that rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. ~Erwin Knoll

As on this board there seems to be a rush from many quarters to be first to 'guess' the sequence before basic facts have been established. Newspapers of course want a 'scoop' to sell. I'm not sure of the motives of the erudite posters here.

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by Deep and fast

Had the previous aircraft vacated at the go around request? The atc tape seems like a standard go around from atc.

Listen to the tape again.

ATC told EK565 (the following flight) to go around, not EK521.

[PapaHotel6]

suninmyeyes said:

I would like to bet the following were all false reports:


1) The plane was on fire before it landed.
2) The passengers were briefed for an emergency landing
3)The crew forgot to put the gear down
4)The tower told the crew to check the gear was down

And I would completely agree.

This will not be an overwrought investigation. You can be sure that investigators with access to the relevant recorders have reached their conclusion already in terms of what happened (*why* it happened might take a little longer).

[ex-EGLL]

After listening again, certainly the tower instructs EK565 to go around, but prior to that there is a transmission "521 continue straight ahead......"

That suggests the tower is reacting to a (perceived) go around initiated by 521, and was giving the missed approach instructions (albeit a tad early into the manoeuvre)

[portmanteau]

too much; from ATC tape it seems clear that 521 did not state he was going around nor did he ask to climb to 4000ft. ATC cleared him to land and 20 seconds later told him to " continue straight climb to 4000 feet". 521 acknowledged. I wonder what prompted ATC to give that instruction and where was the aircraft when he gave it?

[portmanteau]

ex-egll, surely it is more likely that ATC instructed 565 to go around after it was clear that 521 was not going to get airborne again otherwise he would have had two aircraft climbing to the same altitude on same heading and in close proximity.

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by portmanteau

too much; from ATC tape it seems clear that 521 did not state he was going around nor did he ask to climb to 4000ft.

Well assuming we're not talking about a timely GA necessitated by a blocked runway or a late clearing lander ahead, presumably EK521 was fully occupied aviating and navigating at the time ...

[ex-EGLL]

ex-egll, surely it is more likely that ATC instructed 565 to go around after it was clear that 521 was not going to get airborne again otherwise he would have had two aircraft climbing to the same altitude on same heading and in close proximity.

Agreed, and that's what the tape indicates. In listening to the recording my initial thought was the controller saw EK521 perform a manoeuvre that appeared to be the start of a (pilot initiated) missed approach. The controller then gave EK521 the missed approach routing (NOT an instruction to commence the missed approach). At this stage EK565 was still on approach awaiting landing clearance. When the controller noticed that 521 had hit the ground, among many other things that had to be done, missed approach instructions were then issued to EK565.

As for having two aircraft on the missed approach it shouldn't be too much of an issue, they were separated coming down the approach, they should remain separated going on the missed approach, but a quick turn (when safe) or an altitude restriction should keep it all good.

[Oval3Holer]

My guess:

The call, "Go around, Flaps 20" made by a crewmember
"Set thrust" or "Check thrust" call is not made because it is not required when autothrottle engaged
Autothrottle disconnect switches are pushed rather than the TO/GA switches
No one notices thrust is still at idle
No one notices nor calls the FMA modes, which are not "THRUST" "TO/GA" "TO/GA"
Someone calls "gear up" without having verified a positive rate of climb and/or
Someone raises the gear without having verified a positive rate of climb
Pitch is increased, airspeed decreases and plane settles onto the runway

Just my guess...

[portmanteau]

DR, well yes 521 was fully occupied in the normal business of landing, runway in sight, cleared to land etc. What the tape shows is that ops were proceeding normally; 521 cleared to land, 565 next in line cleared to continue approach. Then ATC sees something which leads to him instructing 521 to climb to 4000 feet. If that had happened 565 would have been given landing clearance but it didnt so 565 is obviously sent round again while 521 is sliding all the way down 12L.

[ATC Watcher]

For the ATC recording on You Tube in post#355 seems to come from a cheap VHF receiver that did not record all transmissions . This is obvious at end of tape where calls are answered by the TWR but the initial call is not recorded. (Possibly due to using different transmitters relays )
The whole thing would make much more sense if EK521 would have declared " EK521 going around" then the ATC transmission : "continue straight ahead climb to 4000" would make sense, the 4000 restriction also make sense especially if you had inbounds descending to 5000 opposite. The investigation will clear this up., plus not really a factor at all in this accident.

[skydler]

Originally Posted by portmanteau

too much; from ATC tape it seems clear that 521 did not state he was going around nor did he ask to climb to 4000ft. ATC cleared him to land and 20 seconds later told him to " continue straight climb to 4000 feet". 521 acknowledged. I wonder what prompted ATC to give that instruction and where was the aircraft when he gave it?

How does it "seem clear" from an ATC tape that isn't clear to listen to at all? There are so many incomplete dialogues or indecipherable transmissions on that recording - it's entirely possible tower was responding to a GA call 521 made but the LiveATC receiver didn't pick up due to 521s low altitude and/or obstructions at the time.

I'm amazed how many people here are assuming that this crackly recording from a volunteer's home setup, no doubt several kilometres away through concrete and metal, serves as a whole and complete timeline of events.