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Turbo Otter Crash Near Ketchikan, Alaska

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Turbo Otter Crash Near Ketchikan, Alaska

Old 26th Jun 2015, 03:26
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Turbo Otter Crash Near Ketchikan, Alaska

Floatplane with 9 aboard crashes in Southeast Alaska

June 25, 2015

A floatplane carrying nine people, eight of them passengers on a Holland America Line cruise ship, crashed Thursday afternoon near Ketchikan, according to the cruise line and troopers.

The conditions of the eight passengers and the pilot were unknown Thursday evening. Alaska State Troopers, the Coast Guard and a rescue team were responding to the crash site.

Troopers in Ketchikan got a report of an overdue aircraft at 2:06 p.m. Thursday. A pilot with Temsco Helicopters then saw the downed plane about 800 feet above Ella Lake against a granite rock face in the Misty Fjords area, troopers said in an online dispatch.

Holland America Line said in statement that the plane was in an accident about 20 miles northeast of Ketchikan. The plane was a turboprop de Havilland Otter, according to Petty Officer 1st Class Kelly Parker with the U.S. Coast Guard.

The plane, owned by Promech Air, a charter and flightseeing service in Southeast Alaska, was operating a shore excursion sold through Holland America Line, said the statement from the cruise line....
More here: Plane with 9 onboard crashes in Southeast Alaska | Alaska Dispatch News
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Old 26th Jun 2015, 04:40
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No speculation here, but it's unfortunate that low weather doesn't slow down a thing in Ketchikan.
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Old 26th Jun 2015, 04:55
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The sadly predictable followup story:

9 killed when plane carrying cruise passengers crashes in Alaska

By Greg Morrison, CNN

Updated 12:43 AM ET, Fri June 26, 2015

(CNN)A sightseeing float plane carrying a pilot and eight cruise ship passengers crashed into a cliff in southeast Alaska, killing everyone on board.

"There are no survivors," said Promtech Air, the plane's operator.
9 killed in Alaska plane crash - CNN.com
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Old 26th Jun 2015, 05:17
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RE misty fjords crash

A personal note. Ive been to misty fjords twice, once by boat in 1963 and again about 4 years ago by that same flight. The normal routine is to fly from Kethikan into the sea level fjord to a floating dock anchored in a relatively shallow area of 150 feet deep near one shoreline. The rest of the fjord(s) are over 1000 ft deep. meanwhile a high speed tour boat which leaves ketchikan a few hours earlier meet them on the floating dock, and the return trip is by the boat. Some Boat passengers swap - and fly back. The surrounding area is mostly half mile wide steep clIffs going up 3000 to 4000 feet as I recall( will stand corrected on total height if good topo map can be found ) So to fly in the standard route is to fly in thru the bottom of the U. and land and taxi to dock.

Takeoff is towards the so called open end of U which sits at right angles to the main fjord entrance, and the " open end ' of u terminates in a 2000 to 3000 foot moderately rising mountain.

What seems to be puzzling is the lake mentioned is sort of at right angles to the U. With the lack of more detailed weather - MY speculation is that ** probably* after takeoff, the plane was making a 180 degree turn to fly back out the bottom of the U in marginal weather, and may have impacted about hjalfway thru the turn being maybe 500-1000 feet short of clearing the cliffs on the side of the U.

The turboporop used has more than sufficent power to climb out under normal conditions and it is starting from isea level

It is a beautiful area and on a clear day spectacular- but weather in that area does change rapidly and there is bucu rain.
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Old 26th Jun 2015, 08:25
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Ketchikan International Airport, AK. PAKT:


OBS:Ketchikan, Ketchikan International Airport


PAKT 260843Z AUTO 13008KT 10SM FEW013 OVC018 14/11 A3017 RMK AO2 T01390111 TSNO
PAKT 260800Z AUTO 17007KT 10SM BKN012 OVC025 13/12 A3015 RMK AO2 T01330117 TSNO
PAKT 260753Z AUTO 17006KT 10SM SCT014 BKN022 OVC027 14/12 A3015 RMK AO2 SLP209 T01390117 TSNO
PAKT 260653Z AUTO 14005KT 10SM BKN020 BKN024 OVC045 14/12 A3014 RMK AO2 SLP205 T01390117 TSNO
PAKT 260635Z AUTO 14004KT 10SM BKN020 BKN036 OVC047 14/12 A3013 RMK AO2 T01390117 TSNO
PAKT 260622Z AUTO 18003KT 10SM FEW015 BKN036 OVC047 14/12 A3012 RMK AO2 T01390117 TSNO
PAKT 260605Z AUTO 14006KT 10SM SCT017 BKN024 OVC049 14/12 A3012 RMK AO2 T01390122 TSNO
PAKT 260553Z AUTO 16005KT 10SM FEW019 SCT024 OVC048 14/12 A3011 RMK AO2 SLP196 60031 T01390117 10161 20139 53028 TSNO
PAKT 260527Z AUTO 15006KT 10SM BKN023 OVC050 14/13 A3009 RMK AO2 T01390128 TSNO
PAKT 260513Z AUTO 14006KT 10SM FEW025 BKN049 OVC060 14/13 A3008 RMK AO2 T01390128 TSNO
PAKT 260453Z 16008KT 10SM FEW019 BKN023 OVC060 14/12 A3007 RMK AO2 RAB11E38 SLP184 P0001 T01440122
PAKT 260353Z 14011KT 10SM BKN019 OVC026 14/13 A3004 RMK AO2 RAE46 SLP173 P0000 T01440133
PAKT 260253Z 14012KT 3SM -RA BR FEW009 BKN016 OVC024 14/13 A3002 RMK AO2 PK WND 13032/0156 SLP168 VIS 2V4 P0007 60030 T01440133 51017
PAKT 260218Z 15014G23KT 5SM -RA BR SCT009 OVC016 14/13 A3002 RMK AO2 PK WND 13032/0156 P0005 T01440128
PAKT 260204Z 14016G32KT 1 3/4SM R11/6000VP6000FT RA BR SCT007 BKN012 OVC016 14/13 A3001 RMK AO2 PK WND 13032/0156 P0003 T01440133
PAKT 260157Z 13022G32KT 2SM R11/5500VP6000FT RA BR SCT007 BKN012 OVC016 14/13 A3001 RMK AO2 PK WND 13032/0156 P0001 T01440133
PAKT 260153Z 14016KT 1 3/4SM R11/5000VP6000FT RA BR BKN007 BKN014 OVC020 14/13 A3001 RMK AO2 PK WND 15027/0054 SLP161 P0018 T01440133
PAKT 260053Z 14018G24KT 3SM RA BR BKN025 OVC030 15/13 A3000 RMK AO2 PK WND 16026/0026 RAB29 SLP158 P0005 T01500128
PAKT 252353Z 15017G25KT 10SM SCT013 BKN025 OVC033 16/13 A2998 RMK AO2 PK WND 13026/2327 SLP151 ACFT MSHP 60038 T01610133 10167 20156 53017
PAKT 252328Z 15017G26KT 10SM FEW013 BKN025 OVC031 16/14 A2997 RMK AO2 PK WND 13026/2327 ACFT MSHP T01610139
PAKT 252326Z 14015KT 10SM FEW013 BKN025 OVC031 16/14 A2997 RMK AO2 T01610139
PAKT 252253Z 15015G22KT 10SM FEW013 BKN025 OVC031 17/14 A2996 RMK AO2 SLP145 T01670139
PAKT 252153Z 14012KT 10SM SCT014 BKN021 OVC028 17/14 A2994 RMK AO2 RAE13 SLP139 P0003 T01670144
PAKT 252053Z 13011KT 8SM -RA SCT015 OVC021 16/15 A2993 RMK AO2 SLP135 P0006 60035 T01610150 53012
PAKT 251953Z 13015G23KT 6SM R11/4000VP6000FT RA BR FEW008 BKN012 OVC027 16/14 A2991 RMK AO2 SLP129 ROOF WIND 10025G35KT P0017 T01610144
PAKT 251853Z 15011KT 5SM R11/6000VP6000FT -RA BR BKN018 OVC025 17/14 A2989 RMK AO2 SLP123 P0012 T01670144
PAKT 251753Z 17006KT 5SM R11/5500VP6000FT -RA BR BKN015 OVC025 16/14 A2989 RMK AO2 SLP123 P0010 60057 T01560144 10156 20144 58007
PAKT 251653Z 16006KT 3SM R11/4500VP6000FT -RA BR SCT010 OVC014 16/14 A2990 RMK AO2 SLP126 VIS 2SM V 4SM P0008 T01560144
PAKT 251553Z 17005KT 6SM -RA BR BKN015 BKN022 OVC033 16/14 A2990 RMK AO2 SLP127 P0011 T01560139
PAKT 251453Z 15011KT 4SM R11/6000VP6000FT RA BR FEW010 BKN023 OVC047 15/14 A2991 RMK AO2 SLP130 P0012 60028 T01500139 56008
PAKT 251355Z 15003KT 4SM RA BR SCT021 OVC031 15/14 A2992 RMK AO2 P0000 T01500139
PAKT 251353Z AUTO 16003KT 2 1/2SM RA BR SCT021 OVC031 15/14 A2992 RMK AO2 SLP131 P0011 T01500139 TSNO
PAKT 251314Z AUTO 16006KT 4SM -RA BR FEW021 OVC048 15/14 A2992 RMK AO2 P0003 T01500139 TSNO
PAKT 251253Z AUTO 17005KT 9SM -RA SCT016 BKN021 OVC040 15/13 A2992 RMK AO2 SLP134 P0005 T01500133 TSNO
PAKT 251216Z AUTO 16006KT 3SM -RA BR SCT009 OVC015 14/13 A2993 RMK AO2 P0003 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 251153Z AUTO 15007KT 7SM -RA OVC017 14/13 A2994 RMK AO2 SLP139 P0007 60027 70058 T01440133 10161 20144 56007 TSNO
PAKT 251141Z AUTO 14006KT 3SM -RA BR SCT008 OVC017 14/13 A2994 RMK AO2 P0006 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 251104Z AUTO 15006KT 7SM -RA BKN008 BKN015 OVC037 14/13 A2994 RMK AO2 CIG 006V012 P0000 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 251053Z AUTO 16006KT 5SM -RA BR SCT008 BKN014 OVC036 14/13 A2994 RMK AO2 SLP141 P0009 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 251033Z AUTO 15007KT 3SM -RA BR SCT015 BKN023 OVC033 14/13 A2995 RMK AO2 P0007 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 251026Z AUTO 15008KT 3SM -RA BR FEW008 BKN012 OVC043 14/13 A2995 RMK AO2 P0007 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 251017Z AUTO 14010KT 3SM -RA BR SCT010 BKN015 OVC046 14/13 A2995 RMK AO2 P0006 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 251002Z AUTO 15008KT 2 1/2SM RA BR OVC008 14/13 A2995 RMK AO2 P0003 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 250953Z AUTO 16010KT 3SM -RA BR BKN008 OVC014 14/13 A2995 RMK AO2 RAE34B46 SLP143 P0003 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 250935Z AUTO 16007KT 10SM BKN008 BKN013 OVC020 14/13 A2995 RMK AO2 RAE34 P0001 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 250926Z AUTO 15008KT 6SM -RA BR SCT008 BKN017 OVC022 14/13 A2995 RMK AO2 P0001 T01440133 TSNO
PAKT 250902Z AUTO 14010KT 5SM -RA BR BKN008 BKN016 OVC022 15/13 A2996 RMK AO2 P0000 T01500133 TSNO
PAKT 250853Z AUTO 14011KT 4SM RA SCT010 OVC016 16/13 A2996 RMK AO2 RAB0754 SLP145 P0007 60008 T01610133 401610117 55001 TSNO
PAKT 250753Z AUTO 16008KT 10SM OVC022 15/13 A2995 RMK AO2 RAB08E53 SLP144 P0000 T01500133 TSNO
PAKT 250653Z AUTO 16010KT 10SM SCT020 OVC027 16/13 A2996 RMK AO2 RAE10B27E45 SLP147 P0001 T01560133 TSNO
PAKT 250553Z AUTO 16007KT 10SM -RA SCT015 BKN029 15/13 A2996 RMK AO2 SLP147 P0002 60021 T01500133 10156 20150 56005 TSNO
PAKT 250453Z 16006KT 10SM -RA SCT015 BKN029 OVC037 15/13 A2997 RMK AO2 SLP148 P0005 T01500133
PAKT 250353Z 17006KT 10SM -RA SCT015 BKN029 OVC035 15/13 A2997 RMK AO2 SLP149 P0003 T01500133
PAKT 250253Z 17006KT 10SM -RA SCT015 BKN025 OVC036 15/13 A2998 RMK AO2 SLP152 P0005 60011 T01500133 58005
PAKT 250153Z 16005KT 5SM -RA BR SCT015 BKN024 OVC033 15/13 A2999 RMK AO2 SLP156 P0006 T01500133
PAKT 250053Z 16006KT 3SM R11/6000VP6000FT -RA BR SCT016 BKN024 OVC033 15/13 A2999 RMK AO2 RAB03E29B48 SLP158 P0000 T01500133
PAKT 242353Z 16007KT 10SM SCT011 BKN020 OVC029 16/14 A2999 RMK AO2 RAE06B31E46 SLP157 P0001 60002 T01560139 10161 20150 58000
PAKT 242253Z 16007KT 5SM -RA BR SCT014 BKN022 OVC031 15/13 A3000 RMK AO2 SLP160 P0000 T01500133
PAKT 242153Z 15008KT 7SM -RA FEW018 BKN036 OVC044 16/13 A3000 RMK AO2 RAB48 SLP159 P0000 T01560133
PAKT 242053Z 16006KT 10SM FEW022 SCT029 OVC038 16/13 A2999 RMK AO2 RAB1958E31 SLP157 P0000 60001 T01560128 51008

Last edited by airman1900; 26th Jun 2015 at 08:50. Reason: added 36 hours of recorded metar data
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Old 26th Jun 2015, 16:56
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Operator reports in one story that crash occured at 11:20 am local (19:20 Zulu).
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Old 26th Jun 2015, 18:09
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Sampublius:

A personal note. Ive been to misty fjords twice, once by boat in 1963 and again about 4 years ago by that same flight. The normal routine is to fly from Kethikan into the sea level fjord to a floating dock anchored in a relatively shallow area of 150 feet deep near one shoreline. The rest of the fjord(s) are over 1000 ft deep. meanwhile a high speed tour boat which leaves ketchikan a few hours earlier meet them on the floating dock, and the return trip is by the boat. Some Boat passengers swap - and fly back. The surrounding area is mostly half mile wide steep clIffs going up 3000 to 4000 feet as I recall( will stand corrected on total height if good topo map can be found )
You're in the ballpark. The terrain on two sides of Ella Lake rises to about 2,500:

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Old 27th Jun 2015, 02:33
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Unhappy RE ELLA LAKE TOPO

Thank you for the topo. While the specific area i described was one of the typical trips, it turns out that the ella lake tour was a different trip. But the important part is that that terrain is typical being a lake virtually surrounded by steep nearly vertical cliffs and terrain. The trip I described is similar to trying to land on the valley floor of Yosemite re surrounding terrain.

My other point is that a 20 to 30 air mile difference from the airport in ketchikan often has significantly different weather sort of like on the other side of the island that ketchikan is on. Before the airport was put in on a island across the channel from ketchikan- flights in were by Catalina PBY or small float planes.
With over a 100 inches of rain average per year in ketchikan on one side of the island it is on , and much less on the other-( east side of revelligido island (sp ) the weather in ketchikan airport compared to the crash site may have been worse - or better at any moment .

Nuff said-
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Old 29th Jun 2015, 20:54
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Ella Lake was not part of the tour. The tour was to Rudyerd Bay (Misty Fjords) and was probably the same as the one you were on. This plane was exiting the area and heading back to Ketchikan after the tour was complete. the passage over Ella Lake is one route that can be taken. The topgraphy in the Ella Lake area is quite different from that in Rudyerd bay in that it is not the typical "U" shaped valley. Still rugged though.
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Old 30th Jun 2015, 01:02
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JD:

Ella Lake was not part of the tour. The tour was to Rudyerd Bay (Misty Fjords) and was probably the same as the one you were on. This plane was exiting the area and heading back to Ketchikan after the tour was complete. the passage over Ella Lake is one route that can be taken. The topgraphy in the Ella Lake area is quite different from that in Rudyerd bay in that it is not the typical "U" shaped valley. Still rugged though.
And, your point?
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Old 30th Jun 2015, 16:25
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Mine was a reply to an earlier post where there was speculation that the plane involved was making a turn in a U shaped valley. The poster had apparently visited the area a few years ago and, I assumed, was under the impression that the accident had occurred in that area. Mine was a point of clarification only.
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Old 30th Jun 2015, 19:09
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RE JD 2010 and Rudyard Bay

Thanks for the clarification as to the tour route. What is puzzling is why NOT , IF the weather was low clouds, etc the plane simply could have flown about a few hundred feet above sea level out of Rudyard Bay and high enough to clear Eddystone Rock and back into ketchikan? While it is more scenic to go over- past the lake(s) in the area, given low clouds, there IS a way out of Rudyard same as the boats use with more than sufficient room to fly a few hundred feet above sea level compared to taxing.

BTW I was in Misty Fjords- Rudyard bay long before it became a Park- Monument.

Anyhow - we'll have to wait for the report.

Last edited by SAMPUBLIUS; 30th Jun 2015 at 19:10. Reason: typos
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Old 7th Jul 2015, 16:09
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NTSB Preliminary Report

http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.av...25X15034&key=1
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Old 7th Jul 2015, 17:11
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The accident airplane was equipped with an avionics package known as automatic dependent surveillance-broadcast (ADS-B), which is also known as "Capstone." ADS-B technology provides pilots with situational awareness by displaying the airplane's position over terrain, while using GPS technology, coupled with an instrument panel mounted, moving map display. The ADS-B equipment installed in the accident airplane included two Chelton multifunction display (MFD) units. One MFD provides the pilot with a moving map with terrain awareness information, and the other provides primary flight display information. The two MFD units were removed from the wreckage and shipped, to the NTSB vehicle recorder laboratory, Washington, D.C.
That's a lot of equipment to be flying into a cliff, even in marginal VFR/IMC
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Old 7th Jul 2015, 17:34
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Turbo Otter Crash Near Ketchikan, Alaska

Hope the PFD/MFD/GPS will reveal a little more than 'just another example of a VFR into IMC mishap".
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