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Airbus A320 crashed in Southern France

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Airbus A320 crashed in Southern France

Old 25th Mar 2015, 16:56
  #701 (permalink)  
 
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My understanding of the many replies on the CVR contents is that they had retrieved an audio file short ago, they had corroborated that things could be heard so it is usable, and that it belongs to the flight in question, but any deeper analysis is ongoing so he couldn't comment yet on whose voices are there, at which phase of the flight correspond, etc.

But yes, at some point he said there were voices on record.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 16:57
  #702 (permalink)  
 
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This is the best translation of the exact statement I can offer:
'We have not been able to analyze everything the pilots said after recovering the voice recorder of the crashed Germanwings plane."

We should be able to analyze and time-stamp everything recorded in the cockpit, but it may take a couple of days.

This is what Rémi Jouty, Director BEA (Bureau d'Enquêtes et d'Analyses pour la sécurité de l'aviation civile) explained today.

He did not confirm to have located the second part of the black box containing all technical data.

He had no reason why the plane started a decent and crashed with full speed in the French mountain region. French civil aviation professionals tried to contact the pilots after they noticed the unexpected decent without success.

When asked if they were be able to recognize the voice of pilots after the decent started, he refused to respond.

The speed of descent was about 3,500ft per minute, he says. There is a question about rumours of lithium in the cargo. Jouty says such questions have to be investigated.

When asked about a possible a terror attack, he also refused to respond.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:04
  #703 (permalink)  
 
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BEA press conference

I claim to accept the need for extreme prudence by the head of such an organisation in such circumstances as these.

I was however surprised that:

i) He said that he hadn't listened to the cockpit recording at all himself almost 8 hrs after it arrived on site.

ii) He refused to say if the voices were speaking in English or German

iii) He intimated that his organisation had not yet received a copy of the cargo manifest (in response to a question concerning the presence there of lithium batteries.)
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:08
  #704 (permalink)  
 
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Oddchina

Stupid? Fair enough. Maybe my post was. However just watch. As the post goes on and more 'news' articals are published the theories will get more and more sensational.

A few words from the BEA could have kept some sort of restraint by the press and maybe go a ways toward reassuring the thousands who work on the 'Bus and the millions who travel on them. That is all and I make no apology whatsoever.

If you're going to have a press conference or a news conference then have something to tell. Don't regurgeteate facts already printed 24 hours ago by germanwings with a couple of extra bits of information. Give us something meaningful. In a world where people want to know EVERYTHING and know it NOW, people will just make things up to fill in the blanks.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:09
  #705 (permalink)  
 
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With the talk of finding the FDR but no memory card, is it possible that they found the QAR, less it's memory card and mistaken it for the FDR?
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:10
  #706 (permalink)  
 
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But yes, at some point he said there were voices on record.
He actually said 'sounds and voices' which is no surprise.

His reason for giving no further information was that they were still syncing the recording to the flight in question.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:10
  #707 (permalink)  
 
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Simulating Decompression

Of course you can simulate explosive decompression. Every military pilot has to go through it. I went through the altitude chamber several times during my career in the Army, including explosive decompression. Yes, it's disorienting. Yes, it makes the air in your lungs expand and you cannot speak, but all of the symptoms dissipate after a few moments and you are free to put on your oxygen mask and then fly the aircraft. That cockpit crew should have had quick-don mask at the ready. Something else happened to this crew.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:14
  #708 (permalink)  
 
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BEA Press Conference translation

We have not been able to analyze everything the pilots said after recovering the voice recorder of the crashed Germanwings plane."

We should be able to analyze and time-stamp everything recorded in the cockpit, but it may take a couple of days.
Which I would read as the pilot's voices are on the recording however, as at what point in the flight these voice recordings occurred has not been determined. Just my opinion mind you.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:14
  #709 (permalink)  
 
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is it possible that they found the QAR,
QAR is unlikely to have survived.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:21
  #710 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dicks-airbus View Post
From an anonymous comment on avherald:

Quote:
CVR data has been read. It seems structural failure (windshield? not determined yet)..It was quick... sound of cracks,but crew initiated emergency descent by autopilot and then they weren't heard anymore. Autopilot was on during whole descent, but disconnected automatically shortly before impact when GPWS alerts appeared.
Here we go again - sets of 'experts' listening to noises and trying to ascertain what went wrong and who did what. All the potential evidence was destroyed by a 375Kt collision with a rock face.

A workhorse airliner could have a fault that has demonstrably incapacitated a crew and led to the loss of life of all on board, yet because management pilot relations are so untrusting there is no simple video recording to show what went wrong.
So let's hope those SME's can identify what the failure was from the noise. Or all the A-319 - 321 series, of that vintage at least, may be flying with a problem.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:21
  #711 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by INeedTheFull90
Surely if anything was heard they could have briefly summarised it. I appreciate they need to be meticulous. However the CVR has been at the BEA for several hours now. Chance for the last ten minutes of the flight to be listened to many times over. They MUST know something. This lack of information will just cause people to read between the lines and again as night falls on now day 2, with no more REAL information, speculation will become frenzied and tomorrow's newspapers (especially the vile ones we have here in the UK) will be full on sensationalist speculation and scaremongering based on what some FS98 pilot has said on here..
The media can go to hell! They are usually poorly qualified to understand air accident investigations, they like simple, dramatic stories and will make great logical leaps with little or no supporting data. We need to let the BEA and the other organisations assisting the investigation do their job thoroughly and not heap pressure on them to come up with hasty opinions just to feed the media beast.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:26
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"these look like classic organic-rich (i.e. intensely black) shales to me and hence is their naturally colour. The more resistant, thin, lighter coloured rocks (seemingly uncharred) are white-yellow sandstone layers."

I walk a lot in this area and confirm this. The ground is a loose, friable clay/shale with isolated pieces of sedimentary rock. It's usually dark grey to black. Black appears more when cut open or if wet. Scrambling on it is hard work as the ground if heavily ravined and breaks up easily and falls apart. Landslips and erosion are common after rain/thaw. The detailed landscape can change from year to year as features collapse or wash out.

I'm surprised to see no main impact point. I think it possible significant amounts of aircraft parts lie under shale that has broken off and fallen on top. Possibly the FDR has been buried in this way.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:29
  #713 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by espike007 View Post
Of course you can simulate explosive decompression. Every military pilot has to go through it. I went through the altitude chamber several times during my career in the Army, including explosive decompression. Yes, it's disorienting....... Something else happened to this crew.
I too have done this in a previous life. But if you check your logbook as I just did I think you will find it was not from 6k to 38k. I am also certain it would not have been air at -40c (possibly at 350kts) coming at you. I seem to recall the most uncomfortable thing about my explosive decompression experience was the stench of the previous night's Ruddles...
I reckon the real thing is very different :-/
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:36
  #714 (permalink)  
 
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All these comments about what happens in an explosive decompression - my first hand experience as the flight test engineer (B744) and caught not paying attention - when those valves were opened I was unconscious in less than 15 seconds - I remember the world getting very slow but that's it. Woke up around 8 000 ft somewhere if I recall. Barely functional the rest of that day.

(I was biking about 70 K a day back then and in great shape)
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:37
  #715 (permalink)  
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Whilst realising that this aircraft suffered a tremendous impact, is it possible that even greater protection for the CVR and FDR might now be considered - such as a detachable capsule?
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:41
  #716 (permalink)  
 
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Hum: the mention of Ruddles gives yr post authenticity, all right! But my log book says 25k - 45k and later, 27k -56k. So not all were the same.

Fonsini: in your hypothesis, 7700 would not be the appropriate squawk.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:46
  #717 (permalink)  
 
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avherald

From an anonymous comment on avherald:

CVR data has been read. It seems structural failure (windshield? not determined yet)..It was quick... sound of cracks,but crew initiated emergency descent by autopilot and then they weren't heard anymore. Autopilot was on during whole descent, but disconnected automatically shortly before impact when GPWS alerts appeared.
an anonymous comment -all you need to know

another bit said to be from the same avherald (The Aviation Herald avherald(.com) is the website) posted several the pages back indicated that some data has been recovered from the FDR -Hello?

The at the present story (not the comments thereto) from said same avherald.com website states:
When confronted by journalists with rumours originating in Finnish media quoting Finland's CAA about a burst windshield, the BEA said they have no such information.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:49
  #718 (permalink)  
 
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@G-CPTN

When, where and how would a capsulized recorder be "ejected" for the sake of saving the data? What would trigger it and what about the lost data prior to impact?

Just asking.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:50
  #719 (permalink)  
 
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I claim to accept the need for extreme prudence by the head of such an organisation in such circumstances as these.

I was however surprised that:

i) He said that he hadn't listened to the cockpit recording at all himself almost 8 hrs after it arrived on site.
He's the head of the organisation and judging by the TV coverage in the last 24 this gent has been working flat out (interviews, statements to French TV, meeting with the politicians) since the accident happened. I suspect he's been far too busy to listen to recordings, even if it was part of his job spec.
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Old 25th Mar 2015, 17:55
  #720 (permalink)  
 
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We have as yet insufficient information to establish a cause or even contributor to this tragic event.

But if there is any benefit from all the educated speculation, perhaps it is motivation to pilots still flying to review the emergency procedures for a decompression and be better prepared for such an unlikely - but still possible - event. First actions are critical.

I think that might be the kind of reaction our successful Captain Sullenberger might encourage.
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