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Airbus A320 crashed in Southern France

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Airbus A320 crashed in Southern France

Old 5th Apr 2017, 16:42
  #3501 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by A320ECAM View Post
The moment the plane lost RT, the French should have sent up two F-16s to check what was going on in the flight deck.
No F-16 in french airforce.

One Mirage was sent at 09:48, airbus crashed at 09:41 UTC....
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Old 6th Apr 2017, 10:34
  #3502 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by A320ECAM View Post
I cannot believe that the AVH would give the father of Lubitz time considering what Lubitz did?

The moment the plane lost RT, the French should have sent up two F-16s to check what was going on in the flight deck. Had they seen Lubitz alive and conscious, then that would shut Lubitz' ignorant and unapologetic father up once and for all!
I agree with point 1 - AvH is losing the plot by allowing the father time and space to voice his doubts as to the heinous and criminal act his son carried out.

The second point is unnecessary - after all, the data from the FDR is very clear what happened. The son didn't just 'play with the selected altitude' and become unconscious, he was adjusting the target speed as the aircraft descended. Had the father's claims held any truth, the son could have returned the target altitude back to a safe level, rather than repeatedly turning the target speed ever higher.

As the last movement of the speed control knob happened more than 4 minutes after the altitude was selected to 100 feet, it was clear that Lubitz knew what he was doing, the father should shut up and think of the families of the victims......
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Old 6th Apr 2017, 10:58
  #3503 (permalink)  
 
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Steve, I fully agree. Especially with regard what Lubitz did on the incoming flight to BCN, check my post of April 4th.

Cheers
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Old 6th Apr 2017, 12:25
  #3504 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by gearlever View Post
Steve, I fully agree. Especially with regard what Lubitz did on the incoming flight to BCN, check my post of April 4th.

Cheers
The problem is, the father could point to that recording and say

'see, he did that on the previous flight, the a/p altitude knob was something he always played with when the other crew member was out of the cockpit'

and try to use it as proof the son never intentionally crashed the aircraft because in the previous flight, the turning to 100 feet had made no difference; unfortunately - so is the probable reasoning of Lubitz Senior - on the return flight his son became incapacitated after he had adjusted the altitude to 100 feet, hence the plane crashed.

The fact that he wasn't incapacitated enough to stop continually modifying the target airspeed over the next 4 minutes hasn't yet registered with this ill-informed and crassly insensitive father - but I can live in hope that he eventually reads this and understands how much anger he is causing families of the victims by his refusal to accept the truth.
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Old 6th Apr 2017, 12:38
  #3505 (permalink)  
 
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Yes Steve, but it's not Andreas father, it's the journo T.v.B. who is arguing that way, payed by G.Lubitz.
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Old 6th Apr 2017, 13:31
  #3506 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by gearlever View Post
Yes Steve, but it's not Andreas father, it's the journo T.v.B. who is arguing that way, payed by G.Lubitz.
Doesn't matter.... Whoever pays for the piper, determines the music being played.
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Old 6th Apr 2017, 13:43
  #3507 (permalink)  
 
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Exactly Steve.

I'm wondering also why AvHerald is so keen about 4u9525.... I mean the owner of that site went to Berlin to visit the press conference. Can't remember any other case where he did that.

And it wasn't about fumes....
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Old 6th Apr 2017, 15:05
  #3508 (permalink)  
 
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Simon attended the BEA press conference for the final report on AF447, for example. And he didn't make the trip to Berlin just to hear GŁnter Lubitz talk, but he was in town for a few days anyway - at least that's what he says (4th paragraph in the avherald article).

I can understand that the part about the possibly defective door keypad got his attention, and that he asked BEA for more information about it:
Originally Posted by avherald
6) Has the BEA received information about an occurrence on D-AIPX a few days prior to the crash, that a flight crew managed to lock themselves out of the cockpit while still on the ground and needed maintenance to get back into the cockpit?
7) Did the BEA investigate this occurrence, or did the BFU investigate this occurrence? Is it possible to receive that investigation report?
8) Is it correct, that this occurrence was caused by the failure of the digit x (Editorial note: actual key removed for publication) on the keypad?
9) Is the BEA in possession of the relevant tech log entries and is this occurrence included in this tech log? Was the keypad replaced, or was the defect deferred by maintenance?
And I find their response kind of disappointing:
Originally Posted by BEA
I am well aware that the recent press conference has renew the interest in this event but as far as the BEA is concerned, we have published the final report and have nothing else to add or to comment.
But then again, maybe he shouldn't have submitted a whole catalog of no less than 25 questions about all kinds of weird topics brought up at the press conference, including gems like "Is the BEA aware that there are 4 different versions of the CVR transcript?"
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 13:41
  #3509 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by gearlever View Post
I'm wondering also why AvHerald is so keen about 4u9525.... I mean the owner of that site went to Berlin to visit the press conference. Can't remember any other case where he did that.
No, he did not go to Berlin to be at the press conference, as far as I know that trip was scheduled a very long time before it was known to happen. He apparently decided to visit it as he was there anyway and had the time to do it.

Why AVH is keen on the story he has answered more than clearly. Like many of us the Herald staff seem to find that there are a lot of unanswered questions which need addressing, some of them quite pressing ones such as the keypad issue and generally the conduct of that investigation. That is reason enough to keep looking at it.
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 13:58
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This is a pilot's father trying do defend the family or similar in formation flight with some "investigative" journalist with some non proven suspicions. So far okay but nothing to bring forward the topic itself. Shouldn't we wait for actual news to come up? Apologies but I don't care that much about the FO family's PR.
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 14:58
  #3511 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by AN2 Driver View Post
I don't think what triggered that article was the question of guilt, but the question whether there were things in this investigation which deserve scrutiny because they are either wrong or at least do not live up to the standards of a normal accident investigation.
Originally Posted by AN2 Driver View Post
Like many of us the Herald staff seem to find that there are a lot of unanswered questions which need addressing, some of them quite pressing ones such as the keypad issue and generally the conduct of that investigation. That is reason enough to keep looking at it.
What is it about the conduct of the investigation that makes you repeatedly say that ?

The BEA knew from the start that, because of the particular circumstances of the crash, every word they published would be subject to intense scrutiny and, on the whole, the investigation report reflects that (including a detailed discussion of the CDLS as applicable to the airframe in question)..
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 22:51
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Runs in the family ?

Mental illness ?
Lack of understanding of what goes on and accepting it.
As father, as son we say in Norway.
A total lack of understanding how things work, and how to behave.

This Andreas is a mass murderer and a traitor to his country and his profession.
3 independent investigations say so.
Andreas was a rotten egg, and his Father knew he was a Coo Coo.
His inaction and his sons action has made a mess.

He could have stopped him, he did not.
He should not attack others, for telling the truth.
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Old 13th Apr 2017, 17:08
  #3513 (permalink)  
 
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Question:

Is it possible to turn the ALT SEL knob on A 320 from 38.000 ft to 100 ft within one second?
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Old 13th Apr 2017, 17:27
  #3514 (permalink)  

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Absolutely yes.
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Old 13th Apr 2017, 19:23
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The father is victim too.
He lost his son, and his son went from the perfect son (young pilot from the national airline) to a mass murderer.

He (the father) feel probably guilty about his son's actions, but he has nothing to do with it. And all Germany hates him now, and his wife (the mother) ass well, And all the Lubitz Family.

So, as a father, you can :
1- commit suicide (alone please)
2- deny the truth
3- go insane

He chose the second option...

I feel sorry for him
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Old 13th Apr 2017, 20:04
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He could have stopped him, he did not.
That's a big allegation to make. Do you know of anything we don't, to support you in making it?

Lots of people have - and muddle through with - severe psychiatric problems. It's far from true to say that their nearest and dearest always know what's going on, or how unwell they are.
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Old 14th Apr 2017, 13:57
  #3517 (permalink)  
 
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We all have problems, and we all hide things.
But you have to be blind as a father is you in this case did not see that your son had big problems and needed serious help and restrictions.
If Your son drops out due to depressions it is Your duty to help him. If not there is something wrong with You.
I think Lubnitz Sr just proved to all that he was not a good and passionate father. He could have helped his son get proper treatment and job on the ground. That is what good Dads do!

And , no, I am not privy to any information You dont have.
But my field of interest happens to be Human Performance in Aviation, or the lack of it.
This person should never have been near an aircraft , never mind flying one!
Some knew this but chose to turn the blind eye, that is a crime.
His father must have known or should have.
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Old 14th Apr 2017, 14:09
  #3518 (permalink)  
 
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BluSdUp

Lubitz father is denying a depression of his son.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaJOTaPK0sc&t=5488s
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Old 14th Apr 2017, 16:58
  #3519 (permalink)  
 
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But my field of interest happens to be Human Performance in Aviation, or the lack of it.
This person should never have been near an aircraft , never mind flying one!
Some knew this but chose to turn the blind eye, that is a crime.
His father must have known or should have.
I don't speak German well enough to appreciate Lubitz senior's perspective. But speaking generally, a very high proportion of people suffer from psychiatric problems at some point in their lives and few go on to kill themselves, let alone anyone else. The lifetime prevalence of major depression is 20-30% depending on which figures you look for.

Now, there are clearly several types of depression (and related illnesses). Certainly some stories about Lubitz suggest that his illness was unusual and should have raised red flags if they are true as reported. However speaking more generally, people who kill themselves often do surprise friends and family. Also, the brighter you are, the more unwell you can get whilst still seemingly holding things together. And even if families know about a person's low mood, it's not uncommon for it to seemingly improve shortly before they decide to kill themselves - presumably due to the newfound sense of purpose.
And , no, I am not privy to any information You dont have.
In that case I'm afraid I find your comments both ignorant and disrespectful - not so much to Lubitz' father about whom I know very little, but with regard to the bereaved relatives of people who have killed themselves in general. The writing isn't always on the wall, and even when it is, it can sometimes only be read in retrospect.

Last edited by abgd; 14th Apr 2017 at 17:29.
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Old 15th Apr 2017, 17:27
  #3520 (permalink)  
 
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I never disputed that Lubitz killed himself and his passengers.
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