Airbus A320 crashed in Southern France
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: schermoney and left front seat
Age: 57
Posts: 2,429
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Typical reaction of the doushbags in cologne... they use that incident to flex their muscles and extend the reach of legislation even further into our lives.
None of the proposed points would have prevented the murder Lubitz has committed.
This is the biggest joke of all:
"should"....
I can already see the MOLs of the airline world taking care of a pilots support program - that will consist of an axe, no doubt about that.
None of the proposed points would have prevented the murder Lubitz has committed.
This is the biggest joke of all:
- Pilot support systems should be implemented within airlines.
I can already see the MOLs of the airline world taking care of a pilots support program - that will consist of an axe, no doubt about that.
Guest
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the Beach
Posts: 3,336
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
His dudeness:
Well...perhaps. But, in the EU, the US, Canada, and OZ, the unions will short circuit your concern.
I can already see the MOLs of the airline world taking care of a pilots support program - that will consist of an axe, no doubt about that.
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Chissay en Touraine, France.
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not-so-random drink and drugs testing would be welcome imho.
And this alleged mass-murder only serves to demonstrate that controls over flight crew are still not yet adequate to protect the innocent travelling public. Who have a right, when they compulsorally place their trust and lives into the hands of two or three unknown, and unseen individuals, to expect that those individuals are Fit to Fly. In every sense.
And this alleged mass-murder only serves to demonstrate that controls over flight crew are still not yet adequate to protect the innocent travelling public. Who have a right, when they compulsorally place their trust and lives into the hands of two or three unknown, and unseen individuals, to expect that those individuals are Fit to Fly. In every sense.
Guest
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the Beach
Posts: 3,336
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ChissayLuke:
It will never be 100%, anymore than trains, automobiles, and ships.
And this alleged mass-murder only serves to demonstrate that controls over flight crew are still not yet adequate to protect the innocent travelling public. Who have a right, when they compulsorally place their trust and lives into the hands of two or three unknown, and unseen individuals, to expect that those individuals are Fit to Fly. In every sense.
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Chissay en Touraine, France.
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't recall saying that it ever would be.
But it is a sound aspiration, and there is a burden of duty of care upon 'regulators', to ensure that it is as near as it can be.
It is my view that the travelling public has a right to expect such.
But it is a sound aspiration, and there is a burden of duty of care upon 'regulators', to ensure that it is as near as it can be.
It is my view that the travelling public has a right to expect such.
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Cambridge
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I perceive the bigger danger here is not that we miss existing psychological conditions that affect pilots. Instead, my opinion (FWIW) is that increasing the pressure on pilots, and the intrusion of monitoring into private lives will drive some pilots into conditions that were NOT existing.
I agree absolutely that there needs to be a wholesale improvement in pilot support systems, and that pilots should be able to seek appropriate support and/or treatment for mental health issues. Just the same way as it is currently possible for physical health issues.
I just can't see that moving further down the road of intrusive monitoring linked to career-guilotines is going to achieve the intended result of reducing what is already a VERY rare situation.
I agree absolutely that there needs to be a wholesale improvement in pilot support systems, and that pilots should be able to seek appropriate support and/or treatment for mental health issues. Just the same way as it is currently possible for physical health issues.
I just can't see that moving further down the road of intrusive monitoring linked to career-guilotines is going to achieve the intended result of reducing what is already a VERY rare situation.
Guest
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the Beach
Posts: 3,336
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ChissyLuke:
Well, perhaps I am misreading your previous statement:
I don't recall saying that it ever would be.
...when they compulsorally place their trust and lives into the hands of two or three unknown, and unseen individuals, to expect that those individuals are Fit to Fly. In every sense. ...
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Europe
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nonsense
ChissayLuke
The number of times pilots lay the finger on safety related issues within the industry at the risk of loosing their livelihood is a reality.
It is the regulating authorities that look the other side.EASA has started a witch-hunt.
As a passenger do not expect that when you pay 600 Euro to travel to the other side of the world or 35 Euro to go from Paris to Rome that nobody in the system is getting exploited.
If you accept this as normal then you have to accept the consequences as well.
The solution is simple. A slowdown of growth in the aviation industry and a complete revision of pilot training. This implies to keep it out of the hands of commercial enterprises.
The number of times pilots lay the finger on safety related issues within the industry at the risk of loosing their livelihood is a reality.
It is the regulating authorities that look the other side.EASA has started a witch-hunt.
As a passenger do not expect that when you pay 600 Euro to travel to the other side of the world or 35 Euro to go from Paris to Rome that nobody in the system is getting exploited.
If you accept this as normal then you have to accept the consequences as well.
The solution is simple. A slowdown of growth in the aviation industry and a complete revision of pilot training. This implies to keep it out of the hands of commercial enterprises.
Last edited by Pitch Up Authority; 19th Jul 2015 at 22:53. Reason: rephrased for clarity
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 929
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pitch up authority well said.
Funny how jo public wants the cheapest but wants 5 star service.
When airfares were "well" priced maintenance was exemplary pilots well trained & not of a psychotic nature. ( yes some exceptions) so if Jo public wants/expects someone " driving" he can trust he better be prepared to pay for it!
Oh as for the 2 man rule. Well that has made it easier for those that wish us harm to get in on the act so to speak.
Funny how jo public wants the cheapest but wants 5 star service.
When airfares were "well" priced maintenance was exemplary pilots well trained & not of a psychotic nature. ( yes some exceptions) so if Jo public wants/expects someone " driving" he can trust he better be prepared to pay for it!
Oh as for the 2 man rule. Well that has made it easier for those that wish us harm to get in on the act so to speak.
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Europe
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Another truth
The suicide rate amongst doctors and in particular; dentist, psychiatrists and anestesist is amongst the highest of any profession.
The annual death rate due to medical malpractice outnumbers by far the loss of lives due to a crash.
And the shooting of MH17 has more to do with the fact that the authorities did not do their job properly by either closing down the whole airspace or issue an overflight ban to their respective airlines.
The annual death rate due to medical malpractice outnumbers by far the loss of lives due to a crash.
And the shooting of MH17 has more to do with the fact that the authorities did not do their job properly by either closing down the whole airspace or issue an overflight ban to their respective airlines.
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Chissay en Touraine, France.
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm glad to have provoked debate.
I stand by my oroginal comments.
And would respectfully point out that safety of the flying public has nothing to do with expecting 5 star service, or the price paid.
References to other suicides are irrelevant. They don't tender to murder many innocents.
If you really are real pilots, and really hold those views, perhaps you'd be kind enough to give full reference.
I stand by my oroginal comments.
And would respectfully point out that safety of the flying public has nothing to do with expecting 5 star service, or the price paid.
References to other suicides are irrelevant. They don't tender to murder many innocents.
If you really are real pilots, and really hold those views, perhaps you'd be kind enough to give full reference.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: where the money is
Posts: 385
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My psychiatrist neighbor told me that the Germanwings F/O most likely was suffering from some sort of 'narcissistic disturbance' (= best translation I could think of from 'narzistische Störung').
Looking at descriptions about this diagnosis, I can think of a bunch of people who in my opinion might be suffering from this. These people are steering cars, holding scalpels in their hands or even managing big corporations.
Looking at descriptions about this diagnosis, I can think of a bunch of people who in my opinion might be suffering from this. These people are steering cars, holding scalpels in their hands or even managing big corporations.
He was classified as "unable to work" (not just "unfit to fly") by some of his doctors for the day of the crash but he ignored it and did not tell his employer. He took strong psycho drugs against his depressions, drugs that are only available by doctor's permit and might change your mind up to making you agressive against yourself or others.
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Off the map
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Off the map
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If you believe safety comes cheap, either you're naive or misinformed.
Guest
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the Beach
Posts: 3,336
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Passengers don't understanding airline safety at all unless they are in an allied field.
Some pilots fly terrible pairings, layover in lousy, noisy hotels and accumulate fatigue. Then, they head back to the airport marginally rested at best, and fly another lousy segment of the pairing.
Some pilots fly terrible pairings, layover in lousy, noisy hotels and accumulate fatigue. Then, they head back to the airport marginally rested at best, and fly another lousy segment of the pairing.
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Cambridge
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I perceive the bigger danger here is not that we miss existing psychological conditions that affect pilots. Instead, my opinion (FWIW) is that increasing the pressure on pilots, and the intrusion of monitoring into private lives will drive some pilots into conditions that were NOT existing.
I agree absolutely that there needs to be a wholesale improvement in pilot support systems, and that pilots should be able to seek appropriate support and/or treatment for mental health issues. Just the same way as it is currently possible for physical health issues.
I just can't see that moving further down the road of intrusive monitoring linked to career-guilotines is going to achieve the intended result of reducing what is already a VERY rare situation.
I agree absolutely that there needs to be a wholesale improvement in pilot support systems, and that pilots should be able to seek appropriate support and/or treatment for mental health issues. Just the same way as it is currently possible for physical health issues.
I just can't see that moving further down the road of intrusive monitoring linked to career-guilotines is going to achieve the intended result of reducing what is already a VERY rare situation.
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Toowoomba Australia
Age: 75
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just more of the same
Everywhere bean counters are cutting costs and jeopardising quality to make an extra buck with exponential bonuses paid to execs with no accountability for consequences. When is $x million profit not enough to start taking risks.
Last edited by Nicolaus Silver; 20th Jul 2015 at 22:47. Reason: Grammar
