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Air Asia Indonesia Lost Contact from Surabaya to Singapore

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Air Asia Indonesia Lost Contact from Surabaya to Singapore

Old 28th Dec 2014, 09:51
  #101 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2004
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Devil

proline, the final report is not even issued and you know the cause of Swiftair ?
It is way too early to make assumptions.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 09:54
  #102 (permalink)  
 
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The average depth of the Java Sea is just 46 metres. Wreckage of an A320 would be surely be easily spotted in this sea by now?
I'm amazed, that with the huge population in this region, both working on the water and on land, that reports of people seeing an aircraft coming down haven't started to surface? Vast numbers of Indonesians have mobile (cell) phones.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:01
  #103 (permalink)  
 
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Latest report from the Malysian Insider:

QZ8501 believed crashed near Belitung, boats despatched, says Indonesian SAR - The Malaysian Insider
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:03
  #104 (permalink)  
 
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I'm amazed, that with the huge population in this region, both working on the water and on land, that reports of people seeing an aircraft coming down haven't started to surface? Vast numbers of Indonesians have mobile (cell) phones.
There's low visibility (< 3 miles at times) in the area presently.

There have been unconfirmed reports of fishermen hearing noises & spotting debris.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:04
  #105 (permalink)  
 
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BBC states
"British national was on board missing AirAsia flight QZ8501 and next of kin have been informed, says UK Foreign Office."
This does not match the previously published pax list.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:10
  #106 (permalink)  
 
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Dual Nationality

pretty common in this part of the world to have dual Indonesian/British or maybe other British dual national
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:13
  #107 (permalink)  
 
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british national

one of the first posts in this thread say one missing briton amongst the passengers - the one french national is believed to be the f/off

not all rubbish on here thankfully
the wx info that has been posted here has been a revelation that of the extreme TS activity and i am interested in the winter ITCZ

Last edited by rog747; 28th Dec 2014 at 12:17.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:15
  #108 (permalink)  
 
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Reports now say the Captain has over 20,500 total time, with 6,100 hours with AirAsia. This is different from earlier information from AirAsia.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:26
  #109 (permalink)  
 
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Updated info from Indonesian National SAR:

06:12 local time: QZ8501 in contact with Jakarta center at FL320 and requested deviation left from M635 and climb to FL380.

ATC approved left deviation, but the climb to FL380 had not been approved, pending conflicting traffic.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:34
  #110 (permalink)  
 
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Nothing wrong with educated speculation, but not nonsense like "requested climb from FL320 to FL380".
FL320 is way below "Econ Cruise FL" IMHO... there was a reason for FL320 e.g. Flt Planning (Level CAP), head/tailwind, MEL. The FL380 request "for weather" might even have been "tactical" So I see not issue with that request, and indeed have made it myself for genuine weather reasons.

"Outclimbing a CB", as stated, is not usually a great idea - however, climbing may well make navigating a multitude of CBs easier. The PF on AF447 also had a repeated desire to "climb" for weather avoidance...
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:43
  #111 (permalink)  
 
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Air France repeat? - blocked pitots (ice) during attempted climb above Cb. Static pressure falls with altitude causing over reading airspeed. Raise nose to contain erroneous speed indication = stall hence the slow reported groundspeed.
Actions: -
1. Ignore speed - press EMER CANC to kill the o/speed warning noise.
2. Fly power / attitude - Best is 2 degrees nose up and 78% N1 or my favorite Thrust idle and level attitude or just below and decent. Going for 5 degrees nose up and climb power iaw QRH won't work that high.
3. Turn off all ADRs to bring up BUSS (Back-up speed scale) if fitted on PFD to show AoA.
4. Do nothing else until clear of weather.
5. Companies have been hammering unreliable airspeed to death (no pun intended) in every sim since Air France.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:49
  #112 (permalink)  
 
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3. Turn off all ADRs to bring up BUSS (Back-up speed scale) if fitted on PFD to show AoA
If your pure desire is to "see" AoA, what is wrong with just flying a bit above Alpha Prot? Which IMHO is just an AoA gauge?
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:53
  #113 (permalink)  
 
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AviationSafety ‏@AviationSafety
#QZ5801 dispatch info shows it took off with 8296 kgs of fuel; minimum sector fuel is 7725 kgs; planned fuel consumtion: 5211 kgs.

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Old 28th Dec 2014, 10:57
  #114 (permalink)  
 
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Jockster suggests: "Air France repeat? - blocked pitots (ice) ..."

Can someone say whether the pitot tube heater would be automatic or manual? The idea that the lessons of AF447 have not been learned seems ludicrous.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 11:01
  #115 (permalink)  
 
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BBC states
"British national was on board missing AirAsia flight QZ8501 and next of kin have been informed, says UK Foreign Office."
This does not match the previously published pax list.
There's a correction from AirAsia: http://on.fb.me/1vjWooS

"AirAsia Indonesia would like to issue a correction on the nationality breakdown of passenger and crew on board QZ8501 as follows:

Nationalities of passengers:
1 Singapore
1 Malaysia
3 South Korea
1 United Kingdom
149 Indonesia

Nationalities of crew:
1 France
6 Indonesia

AirAsia will release further information as soon as it becomes available. Updated information will also be posted on the AirAsia website, www.airasia.com."
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 11:17
  #116 (permalink)  
 
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It's now a few minutes past sunset over the area and major SAR activities will be winding down until tomorrow morning, 6am local time (23:00Z, 6pm EST).

National SAR has updated the aircraft's last known position as: 336'31.0"S 10941'46.0"E. See Google Maps.

The are gearing up for an initial search which may last up to one week, at which time they will re-assess the situation.

Air and sea assets from Malaysia and Singapore will also be arriving overnight to take part in the search starting tomorrow. Australia has also offered assistance.

Local fishermen are also helping to search, and a Susi Air aircraft chartered by one of the families.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 11:19
  #117 (permalink)  
 
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no more daylight 19.20 local time

13 hours since a/c missing and its dark now there - nothing found is all we know

plenty of today in daylight to try and find some wreckage but has the weather been too bad for a decent SAR?
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 11:26
  #118 (permalink)  
 
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The weather has been mixed.

Near Belitung Island (the nearest "big" island) the weather was relatively good (light rain). But closer to the last known point, there has been lower visibility, with 3+ meter swells in light thunderstorms which added to the difficulties.

There might be some air assets which may be able to continue to search tonight, but for the most part they will have to wait until tomorrow to re-start.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 11:44
  #119 (permalink)  
 
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Seems to be a sad event indeed.

Haven't read all the posts but trying to out climb a thunderstorm for e.g., is foolish in the extreme due to reduced G protection/coffin corner, as stated in earlier posts. Contemplating doing so is a sure sign of inexperience and or poor training. We must not forget, that a sudden ascending air mass (parcel of air) would be a lot warmer than ambient, making the safety margins even narrower still, for a given altitude. "Optimum altitude" may even be too great for adequate G protection in these conditions. Aircraft are very strong and will most likely hold together provided an attitude is maintained and the A/S is keep within the margins required in an extreme situation. Therefore a lower altitude is more preferable, as a stall/departure will have a very high chance of resulting in in flight break up or non recovery.

After MH370 was lost a certain airline boasted in their in-flight reading material "we don't lose aircraft" or words to that effect. Even more dangerous.

Last edited by Sop_Monkey; 29th Dec 2014 at 01:56.
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Old 28th Dec 2014, 11:55
  #120 (permalink)  
 
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its been mentioned before an ELT will not be picked up if submerged or not work if not G activated/damaged -

it seems the current ELT design and format is certainly not helping with the recent losses

too early in the stage for a sub to pick up an underwater ELT transmission unless there is one around the area already
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