Air Algerie loses contact with its plane leaving Ouagadougou
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Spanish media reports
To summarise the media coverage I have seen in Spain:
EC-LTV is the aircraft registration.
Most reports seem to come from French sources; snippets of African sources too. (Filtered through Paris?)
The “official story” is most definitely that the cause of the accident was “bad weather”; though the possibility of other factors playing a “lesser” part is not wholly discounted.
Spokesman for the Spanish ATC (union?) interviewed on radio this morning mentioned his time as a controller in Ibiza and the need to divert aircraft hundreds of kilometers off course to avoid flying through storms which could wreck a modern aircraft there as analagous to the need for similar deviations in Africa.
The concept of 2 changes of course by this aircraft both to avoid the storm and (subsequently?) to avoid another aircraft is widely reported.
Though the presence of French military units operating in Mali is mentioned everywhere, one Spanish radio station COPE highlighted the presence of Spanish troops “in that area.” Mention has been made of 2 Spanish military aircraft being deployed to help repatriate bodies.
One flight recorder found.
Pilots Union (SEPLA) spokesman on lunchtime tv news highlighted the vast experience of the crew (both pilots are reported as ex-Spanair.)
SEPLA criticism of the company in question Swiftair for commercial practices which would inevitably lead to compromises of safety margins as printed in an issue of a SEPLA magazine during 2013 are reported, though the spokesperson mentioned above did not press this as a likely cause.
The captain is described as “an old Africa hand” though the co-pilot was effectively on “her first African posting.” (I think I heard it said that she had only moved there relatively recently.)
The company in question Swiftair is not very visible at all. Lots of video of the outside of their offices near Madrid and press-release-type shots of their aircraft.
Though relatives of the crew and employees of the company are seen entering and leaving the offices, direct contact of the company with the press has been almost non-existent. The small amount of official information from them has mainly come from statements on the web, although both yesterday and today a “spokesman” for the company read prepared statements to the press on camera. I write “spokesman” because his name and his position in the company is not quoted anywhere that I have seen.
In addition, in terms of location, these briefings were both conducted on the street. From this I conclude that Swiftair are currently unwilling to allow journalists to enter their offices.
This push for anonymity is reflected on-line currently in the “Statement from the Managing Director of Swiftair” in Spanish, French and English which nowhere mentions the actual name of this person.
http://www.swiftair.com/corporativa/NOTA.pdf
I think I am correct in saying that although lunchtime tv broadcasts today identified by name all 6 deceased crew, with a photo of the 6 of them together as well as individual photos from elsewhere, especially from social media, Swiftair has not currently revealed their identities.
In a routine Friday press briefing after the regular Friday meeting of the Spanish cabinet, the Spanish Deputy PM highlighted that all the aircraft’s paperwork was in order. The aircraft had received a major inspection in January 2014 and so had a valid certificate until December 2014.
EC-LTV is the aircraft registration.
Most reports seem to come from French sources; snippets of African sources too. (Filtered through Paris?)
The “official story” is most definitely that the cause of the accident was “bad weather”; though the possibility of other factors playing a “lesser” part is not wholly discounted.
Spokesman for the Spanish ATC (union?) interviewed on radio this morning mentioned his time as a controller in Ibiza and the need to divert aircraft hundreds of kilometers off course to avoid flying through storms which could wreck a modern aircraft there as analagous to the need for similar deviations in Africa.
The concept of 2 changes of course by this aircraft both to avoid the storm and (subsequently?) to avoid another aircraft is widely reported.
Though the presence of French military units operating in Mali is mentioned everywhere, one Spanish radio station COPE highlighted the presence of Spanish troops “in that area.” Mention has been made of 2 Spanish military aircraft being deployed to help repatriate bodies.
One flight recorder found.
Pilots Union (SEPLA) spokesman on lunchtime tv news highlighted the vast experience of the crew (both pilots are reported as ex-Spanair.)
SEPLA criticism of the company in question Swiftair for commercial practices which would inevitably lead to compromises of safety margins as printed in an issue of a SEPLA magazine during 2013 are reported, though the spokesperson mentioned above did not press this as a likely cause.
The captain is described as “an old Africa hand” though the co-pilot was effectively on “her first African posting.” (I think I heard it said that she had only moved there relatively recently.)
The company in question Swiftair is not very visible at all. Lots of video of the outside of their offices near Madrid and press-release-type shots of their aircraft.
Though relatives of the crew and employees of the company are seen entering and leaving the offices, direct contact of the company with the press has been almost non-existent. The small amount of official information from them has mainly come from statements on the web, although both yesterday and today a “spokesman” for the company read prepared statements to the press on camera. I write “spokesman” because his name and his position in the company is not quoted anywhere that I have seen.
In addition, in terms of location, these briefings were both conducted on the street. From this I conclude that Swiftair are currently unwilling to allow journalists to enter their offices.
This push for anonymity is reflected on-line currently in the “Statement from the Managing Director of Swiftair” in Spanish, French and English which nowhere mentions the actual name of this person.
http://www.swiftair.com/corporativa/NOTA.pdf
I think I am correct in saying that although lunchtime tv broadcasts today identified by name all 6 deceased crew, with a photo of the 6 of them together as well as individual photos from elsewhere, especially from social media, Swiftair has not currently revealed their identities.
In a routine Friday press briefing after the regular Friday meeting of the Spanish cabinet, the Spanish Deputy PM highlighted that all the aircraft’s paperwork was in order. The aircraft had received a major inspection in January 2014 and so had a valid certificate until December 2014.
Last edited by BigFrank; 25th Jul 2014 at 17:22.
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Has happened before
West Caribbean Airways Flight 708 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
West Caribbean Airways Flight 708 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Earlier post on this thread with reference to a French source described the main wreckage contained within a 500m crater. If the empennage or horizontal stabiliser are subsequently discovered at a separate location, chances are it was a severe weather encounter. What else could have caused caused such a steep descent. Are there any reports of comms enroute r/t tx with any station. Given the weather conditions I would expect there must have been some for level and heading changes for avoidance. It has also been speculated that the flight may have been turning back from its destination. If this was the case there would have been some ground comms.
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DAH5017 was under radar control
The French TV media France2 is broadcasting its journal presently. In their subject they briefly filmed a quick shot of a radar screen and the DAH5017 plot is seen. The plot is at FL 293 and immediatly after FL252 before the contact is lost.
France2 news is available shortly after on their website.
I will check again when it will be available on their website
France2 news is available shortly after on their website.
I will check again when it will be available on their website
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Or possibly like the Southern Airlines DC9 thunderstorm accident where hail broke the windshield on a flight in 1977.
Southern Airways Flight 242 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Southern Airways Flight 242 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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sun in my eyes
I agree with you about southern airways. First thing that came to my mind. Except with southern airways there were survivors, mayday call etc.
and it was during daylight.
the air algerie flight was at night, in marginal ATC land.
i can imagine losing both engines due to hail ingestion, aerodynamic stall and bam. flying at night, on instruments with both engines dead can lead to a stall (ask air france, and their engines were running). wonder if apu was running on line?
a deadstick landing at night in a sand storm/thunderstorm in the desert would be a lot of luck. southern airways was attempting a dead stick landing on a road in daylight.
I agree with you about southern airways. First thing that came to my mind. Except with southern airways there were survivors, mayday call etc.
and it was during daylight.
the air algerie flight was at night, in marginal ATC land.
i can imagine losing both engines due to hail ingestion, aerodynamic stall and bam. flying at night, on instruments with both engines dead can lead to a stall (ask air france, and their engines were running). wonder if apu was running on line?
a deadstick landing at night in a sand storm/thunderstorm in the desert would be a lot of luck. southern airways was attempting a dead stick landing on a road in daylight.
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Smell of fuel at crash site?
I hope it's not inappropriate to ask this question, but in several articles today, I've seen a statement that the smell of fuel at the crash site is significant in helping identify what happened:
example (emphasis mine):
French Transport Minister Frederic Cuvillier said the strong smell of aircraft fuel at the crash site and the fact that the debris was scattered over a relatively small area also suggested the cause of the crash was linked to weather, a technical problem or an accumulation of such factors.
I'd like to learn more about what the smell of fuel might mean and how it helps investigators. Thanks.
example (emphasis mine):
French Transport Minister Frederic Cuvillier said the strong smell of aircraft fuel at the crash site and the fact that the debris was scattered over a relatively small area also suggested the cause of the crash was linked to weather, a technical problem or an accumulation of such factors.
I'd like to learn more about what the smell of fuel might mean and how it helps investigators. Thanks.
This MD80 accident has some similarities with this one here:
ASN Aircraft accident McDonnell Douglas DC-9-32 LV-WEG Nuevo Berlin
MD8/DC9, CB's, Night IFR, ENR phase, Crater, etc, just my 2 cents. May all RIP.
ASN Aircraft accident McDonnell Douglas DC-9-32 LV-WEG Nuevo Berlin
MD8/DC9, CB's, Night IFR, ENR phase, Crater, etc, just my 2 cents. May all RIP.
There seems to be an unseemly rush to attribute this tragic accident to weather. A/C have been flying through the ITCZ/ITF ever since transport flying started, Its not pleasant but it is do able in safety. When there is a desire to determine the cause without a proper investigation there is normally a cover up about.
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Radar screen DAH5017
http://fr.tinypic.com/r/2lselpl/8]View My Video
The radar screen is centred on DFFD Ouagadougou
We can see WPT TATAB N12.5096 W01.4263 and the name KAYA is a city 50NM from Ouaga
The radar screen is centred on DFFD Ouagadougou
We can see WPT TATAB N12.5096 W01.4263 and the name KAYA is a city 50NM from Ouaga
There seems to be an unseemly rush to attribute this tragic accident to weather.
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View]dah5017 Pictures, dah5017 Images, dah5017 Photos, dah5017 Videos - Video - TinyPic - Hébergement gratuit d'images, partage de photos et hébergement de vidéos My Video
The radar screen is centred on DFFD Ouagadougou
We can see WPT TATAB N12.5096 W01.4263 and the name KAYA is a city 50NM from Ouaga
The radar screen is centred on DFFD Ouagadougou
We can see WPT TATAB N12.5096 W01.4263 and the name KAYA is a city 50NM from Ouaga
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Who will investigate? How long will it take.
Media reports in Spain all assert that "because the Republic of Mali does not have the infrastructure to undertake the investigation it has already/ is on the point of handing over the investigation to the French Authorities."
I think it was Spanish pilots' union SEPLA who were quoted as saying "for a Spanish registered craft with a Spanish crew, Spain would be a more appropriate country to take charge of the investigation."
I think it was Spanish pilots' union SEPLA who were quoted as saying "for a Spanish registered craft with a Spanish crew, Spain would be a more appropriate country to take charge of the investigation."
- Common sense?
- Misplaced national pride ? (Don't bother telling me that other countries don't have this defect!)
- A guarantee that the report would be inconclusive (save to highlight that that the Chicos del Minsterio had done everything but everything "by the book") and that the report would not be available in the lifetime of the youngest poster on these boards?
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"There seems to be an unseemly rush to attribute this tragic accident to weather. A/C have been flying through the ITCZ/ITF ever since transport flying started, Its not pleasant but it is do able in safety. When there is a desire to determine the cause without a proper investigation there is normally a cover up about."
Maybe.
Air Algerie AH5017: 'Hezbollah Leader and French Troops were On Board Flight'
Maybe.
Air Algerie AH5017: 'Hezbollah Leader and French Troops were On Board Flight'
