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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:35
  #6121 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by n6330v View Post
I feel that transparency in crisis communication is fundamentally important in keeping the media flocks away from exactly what they're doing now. Releasing known and easily attainable information is an easy way of achieving transparency.
Media Comms was discussed in the UK press yesterday. Essentially they said neither MAS nor the Malaysian authorities had any experience in crisis communication.

They also noted that the MAS IT Department had activated a 'dark' website which was more transparent with its information.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:36
  #6122 (permalink)  
 
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What baffles me the most is the fact that tangible data has not yet been released on dispatched fuel load. I would imagine that such a piece would be absolutely vital to an investigation focusing on range capabilities and potential routing.
'Released' to whom, the paparazzi? What are they going to do with it?

They don't even know [expected] what questions to ask.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:42
  #6123 (permalink)  
 
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Said expert said emergencies can be as small as a circuit breaker to as large as all 4 (ALL FOUR?) engines failing!
Then talked about South Atlantic south China sea.
Don't get me started on the "you have to climb and convert altitude to energy if you lose an engine during cruise" stuff he was spouting. And this guy supposedly flew?
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:44
  #6124 (permalink)  
 
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Quote:
What baffles me the most is the fact that tangible data has not yet been released on dispatched fuel load. I would imagine that such a piece would be absolutely vital to an investigation focusing on range capabilities and potential routing.
'Released' to whom, the paparazzi? What are they going to do with it?

They don't even know [expected] what questions to ask.
Quite right, Cory Blade.

And in any case the CEO of MAS did answer this question a day or two ago.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:51
  #6125 (permalink)  
 
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waypoints and fixes

Having been retired for more time than I care to admit, just a thought....whilst flying on active route 1 , is it not possible to put in the fix page, any 5 letter waypoint ? Then at the desired "moment", a quick Heading Select around towards ones "fix " turns the aircraft towards the fix and then , having made the big turn to new desired route, time enough to build up ones new route, altho' perhaps not enough time as the plane appears to pass the first fix/waypoint and then turn hard back towards the next airway waypoint....assuming the flight paths shown initially are correct! Thus no need to construct Route 2 at all......
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:54
  #6126 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Lost in Saigon View Post
Are you saying that is proof the aircraft landed or was ditched intact?
Of course not, otherwise we would all be a lot wiser by now.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:57
  #6127 (permalink)  
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Yancey, as said earlier, real professionals are keeping out of it and only the professional talking heads getting a hansom pay check are on the box.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:58
  #6128 (permalink)  
 
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Quote:
GTC58 said:
Quote:
The B777 has a super critical wing, as such it is not really designed to have aerodynamic inherent stability. Without pilot inputs it doesn't take very long for the aircraft to depart its altitude and flight path in manual flight.

--------------------------------
This is not true at all. The B777 is a fly by wire aircraft, the aircraft is flow by the primary flight computers (PFC) which interpret pilot inputs to the flying controls and the current flying conditions (speed, alt, configuration) and move the control surfaces as appropriate. If there is any inherent instability of the wing design it is irrelevant.

If the the auto pilot is switched off and the pilot makes no input on the flying controls the aircraft will continue to fly on roughly the same path as it was before the A/P disconnected.


A question for actual B777 piloten only plz: So is it therefore possible that a B777-200ER could fly on with an incapacitated crew, no LNAV or VNAV, fuel burn GW and trim changes, and stay in the air no doubt with phugoid altitude excursions and heading changes typical of those reported by RMAF AD radar ? And of course, going near but not through the waypoints as alluded to by the latest Malaysian press conference effort.
If you tried it in the sim, what happened ?
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 15:59
  #6129 (permalink)  
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If the aircraft had landed, would the ACARS continue to transmit on the ground and wouldn't the this look like an arc to the satellite?
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:04
  #6130 (permalink)  
 
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@dicks-airbus
* Last two pings came from same location = airframe not moving but operative.
No. No. That's an assumption that has been permeating this thread, but it is only one possible interpretation of what has been said.

The "arcs/corridors" are simply the loci of all possible positions that satisfy the constraints imposed by analysis of the satellite signals. The exact position of a ping on the arc can't be determined, or they could simply search at the last point!

If the last two pings were both from a 40 degree locus (which I think is a leak/speculation, not officially stated anyway) all that that would mean is that the last two pings came from positions on the same 40 degree locus, assuming that the two loci are too far apart to fly between in an hour.

The aircraft being stationary, whether landed, crashed or ditched, is one possible interpretation, but so is that it remained flying, either along the arc for some reason, or on a course which intersected the arc in two places an hour apart, within whatever margin of error is implicit in the analysis. It could have ended its life flying round in circles, for example...

Stating that the airframe was stationary is tempting, but is going beyond what has been announced.

Last edited by DespairingTraveller; 19th Mar 2014 at 16:14. Reason: clarity
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:09
  #6131 (permalink)  
 
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Whoever is in charge of this investigation (who?) has very few ideas and very well confused.

The smoke spread to the media is firing back on them and it is now too much to deal with. Usually in this cases another "big event" happens to divert the attention. It happened many times in the past world wide. It will happen again.

Many witnesses in their key positions, mainly civil and military radar personnel, are on the cutting edge. We all know that.

God bless all the pax/crew missing and other people linked to the facts that in the future will be missing in unknown circumstances.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:12
  #6132 (permalink)  
 
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Anyone else seen this yet?

Pieces of aircraft found floating on Andhra coast? : South, News - India Today
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:14
  #6133 (permalink)  
 
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@DespairingTraveller

The aircraft being stationary, whether landed, crashed or ditched, is one possible interpretation, but so is that it remained flying, either along the arc for some reason, or on a course which intersected the arc in two places an hour apart, within whatever margin of error is implicit in the analysis. It could have ended its life flying round in circles, for example...
If we assume that it has not become stationary, but has continued to fly but has been present on the same arc at both 07:11 and 08:11, can we make the maths work if we know the changing direction of the southern arc if we follow it south and we assume that the aircraft is flying on a constant track? IE. Where would they have converged, as it were? Or would that not have occurred at all?
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:16
  #6134 (permalink)  
 
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real professionals are keeping out of it
Not sure who you mean (?), but I doubt there is anyone who has any inkling about this mystery within the 'professional' aviation community.

The only 'professionals' who could Post on here are hardly likely too!

This is PPRuNe and although the disappearance has caused unprecented interest in all respects and, apart from the tragic human element whatever the outcome, should be taken in the normal manner - 99% bu****it and 1% interesting comment!

Now with 7 hours endurance the Nazca Lines are ...; or could it be an abduction; who assassinated JFK ... back to PPRuNeing!!!

Last edited by FlyingOfficerKite; 19th Mar 2014 at 16:43.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:20
  #6135 (permalink)  
 
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CodyBlade,

Released to the general public. Transparency implies being transparent with your audience. It doesn't matter if they can or will do anything with the information you furnish, but in crisis management, information calms and furthermore provides you with much needed credibility.

Either way, the whole situation is frustrating for everyone involved. I'm just baffled at the way MAS and the Malaysian govt are handling the situation from a communication perspective.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:23
  #6136 (permalink)  
 
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Briefing: We do not know what happened at this time. All we do know is that there have been a number of human errors in the system.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:24
  #6137 (permalink)  
 
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Why all the attention?

Basic human nature. Control and fear.

When things happen to us that we don't understand/are beyond our control, our first instinct is to "control" the uncontrollable by gaining a full understanding of it.

When something terrible happens and we can't understand it, the tension creates a huge vacuum which is so powerful that we would rather fill it with nonesense than let it stand until we can understand. Our hope is that occasionally the nonesense turns out to contain some real answers. It has happened—the outsider perspective sometimes provides fresh solutions (and we're all outsiders here to a degree when it comes to this investigation

PPRuNe is a fantastic technical forum for exploring technical/operational ideas and brainstorming solutions. As such, it occasionally also serves this other function of helping to fill void.

Both are essential and important, although the latter understandably annoying to the more-technically inclined. From watching this board for the last few years, I'd say give it some time, things will at some point return to normal. In the meantime I think PPRuNe is providing a valuable public service and I'd like to thank the dedicated people who provide this little corner of the world for all of us come together. You work—and I know it's work—is appreciated.

jm
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:35
  #6138 (permalink)  
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FO Kite, I was referring to the previous post referring to the retired RAF Lt Col and other talking heads on TV not in this forum.

It was said earlier that current T7 pilots were generally too sensible to go live on TV.

As this thread is demonstrating, there are many strands to this mystery, aircraft systems, external monitoring systems, air defence and ATC systems and many others. Too easy for your talking head to be asked a question outside his knowledge and experience but to spot off anyway.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:36
  #6139 (permalink)  
 
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Attention Press! Ask this:

If it exhausted fuel and ditched in Southern Indian Ocean . How come no ELT Signal.
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Old 19th Mar 2014, 16:38
  #6140 (permalink)  
 
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Interesting article in the UK Guardian:

"What the air traffic controllers knew about how to stop 'flying blind'
No matter where it is, the Malaysia Airlines jet suffered from outdated technology. Eyes in the tower saw this coming"

"It has come as a shock to the general public to learn that commercial flights aren’t monitored constantly by the high-tech GPS tracking systems we’ve come to expect in our cars and smartphones."

MH370: what the air traffic controllers knew about how to stop 'flying blind' | Barbara S Peterson | Comment is free | theguardian.com
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