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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:12
  #581 (permalink)  
 
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I wouldn't be surprised to find that the two fake passports, on an aircraft travelling to Beijing, is anything really noteworthy.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:18
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Stuffed up rapid descent due decompression and forgetting to put on the masks?
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:19
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A single primary radar (skin paint) gives you bearing and distance, nothing else. If you observe multiple returns you can deduce heading and speed.

If you want altitude you need a second radar stations returns time synchronized to the 1st station., and observing multiple sweeps.

I'm not counting a tactical radar that has a very narrow beam width and a very narrow scan angle, and has almost no use for civil aviation.

BTW: who is the genius that decided mode A would be Code, and mode C would be Altitude?
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:26
  #584 (permalink)  
 
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If you have enough readings from PSR, you can deduce heading, what i'm saying is SSR gives live, factual readings of heading, received from the transponder, PSR is all guestimation
Military surveillance radar systems do it all in real time and are more than accurate enough to vector interceptors to (predicted) location and altitude.

Vietnam especially runs round-the-clock military surveillance due to a number of ongoing territorial disputes.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:26
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LAS

DME based on PSR is getting VERY oldschool. I'm sure it is still used in accident investigation for confirmation, but with CPDLC and ADS, it's very much a backup
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:31
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Stormy Knight, I guess it boils down to this business needs answers, and fairly quickly at that. I imagine most on this blog are either pilots or engineers, all who are using experience as to their opinion what might or might not have happened. For those who suggest it is a poor blog, might take into consideration until something concrete shows up, speculate is all we/us can do. But the very nature of the business puts some urgency into it, and people react to that. Some, suggesting that pilots and engineers iqnore the whole dreadful thing, until something gives them a lead, is nonsense, this affects the whole industry and regardless of whom you work for, most are thinking about Malaysian Airlines right now. No airline, unless totally hopeless, deserves this. And this is considered to be a good airline.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:32
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Not really surprised that nothing has yet turned up. Descent from altitude after a catastrophic event, either in large or small pieces, would be subject to trajectories influenced by, amongst others, the forward motion of the aircraft, the force of whatever caused the catastrophy and wind, which could scatter debris over a wide area well away from the point of the event. In effect we are back to basics once the aircraft fails to be a complete unit and the fact is the area to be covered can be thousands of square kilometres.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:35
  #588 (permalink)  
 
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Okay okay I do not work in military and never have or ever will, if you have enough PSR heads in enough different locations then accuracy increases obviously, but in comparison to ADS or SSR? MAH 777's are full CPDLC apparently so that's the most up to date on board telemetry we are going to get before the FDRs are recovered
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:36
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Can anyone comment on the total lack of ACARS data. The key to being pointed early in the right direction on AF447 was ACARS. With all the resources of PPRUNE members, someone on a positon to know must be in a postion to know if there were ANY ACARS sent.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:37
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The South China Morning Post is running pictures of two debris fields spotted from a flight at 36,000ft this morning, they were taken from a MAS flight en-route from PEK to KUL.

Can anyone comment on the total lack of ACARS data. The key to being pointed early in the right direction on AF447 was ACARS. With all the resources of PPRuNe members, someone on a positon to know must be in a postion to know if there were ANY ACARS sent.
At the news conference they said no ''erroneous'' information was received via ACARS.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:37
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A photo taken by a passenger flying the same route has surfaced on twitter: https://twitter.com/JournoDannyAsia/...630848/photo/1. Apparently, it shows an area outside of the search location.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:37
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VN Express, Vietnam's largest news site, reports that Vietnam Emergency Rescue Center just announced it has found signal of the missing plane at 9.50am 120 miles South West of Ca Mau cape, the Southern-most point of Vietnam.

The signal is believed to be the ELT (Emergency Locator Transmittor) , which can be activated manually by the flight crew or automatically upon impact.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:38
  #593 (permalink)  
 
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No ACARS/ADS means the fuselage broke up immediately, the cockpit was severed from the transmitters
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:45
  #594 (permalink)  
 
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glofish Stuffed up rapid descent due decompression and forgetting to put on the masks?
A new thought!

I have 2 questions
1. What was the previous rotation of this aircraft?
Possibility of package hidden on board and not discovered by cleaners.
2. How long was the aircraft on the ground in semi darkness at KLI?
Possibility of of unauthorised entry.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:45
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Platinum: Sky News is reporting no abnormality. I presume that means good data til there was none.

Una: Understood. And I thought your earlier post explained it well, but there was a backlash of but in the XXX investigation...

When you think about it, when all else fails the old school stuff still has its place, even if it is in the aftermath of a disaster. It is interesting that they are reporting an increase of the search area in case the aircraft turned back??
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:51
  #596 (permalink)  
 
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No, multiple PSRs do not necessarily mean that you have improved track accuracy. For that to happen, one has to have track to track correlation, with some kind of smoothing and filtering. Mathematically it's not trivial. So, what most air surveillance systems do is pick the tracking source in which they have the greatest confidence and ignore or suppress the other inputs.

Also, most PSRs scan in az, but not in el. IOW, we don't frigging know how high you are, hence Mode C. Military surveillance systems will use a combination of search and height finder radars to develop a track that is coherent in az and el.

Phased array radars of course can do it all, but the el scan tends to be very duty cycle intensive. IOW, you can lose the track while you're farting around trying to see where the target is in el.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:54
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Originally Posted by Jack1985
The South China Morning Post is running pictures of two debris fields spotted from a flight at 36,000ft this morning, they were taken from a MAS flight en-route from PEK to KUL.
New possible sighting of debris at sea as China sends warships to join search for missing Malaysian Airlines flight | South China Morning Post



The poster, whose profile information says he is a banker working for China Minsheng Bank in Beijing, wrote that he took the snaps from his window at a height of 11,000 metres, at about 6.45am on Sunday.
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:55
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Exit Photos and prints

Malaysian Customs and Immigration takes photos of each departing passenger's face as well as electronically scanned fingerprints.

Stand by for the images of the four suspect passengers - if they are 'interesting'
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 05:59
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The Ca Mau think was 1st reported a day ago.

If the A/C ELT was going off the 406 signal would have been picked up by satellite long ago. And I would like to think every pilot within a thousand miles was listening to 121.5 on a comm "just in case"

Do we know for sure this aircraft had an ELT installed? Maybe it had one of the "Firestarter406's" in it an was pulled after the 787 barbecued?
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Old 9th Mar 2014, 06:00
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The FDR has a pinger. It is strange that this has not been mentioned.
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