Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: somerset
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
'
There are only two facts; it lost contact at 1.30 am and is now on the bottom of the ocean.'
Neither of them you mentioned are facts.
They are facts aren't they?
Contact was lost at 1.30 ( give or take a few mins)
And the aircraft cannot conceivably be anywhere else surely?
There are only two facts; it lost contact at 1.30 am and is now on the bottom of the ocean.'
Neither of them you mentioned are facts.
They are facts aren't they?
Contact was lost at 1.30 ( give or take a few mins)
And the aircraft cannot conceivably be anywhere else surely?
Join Date: May 2011
Location: directly below the zenith
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
PAX under investigation
From SMH:
"Police investigating the backgrounds of all 239 people aboard the missing Malaysia Airlines flight are paying “special attention” to a 35 year-old Chinese Uighur man who undertook flight simulation training, according to a report in a leading Malay language newspaper in Kuala Lumpur"
"Police investigating the backgrounds of all 239 people aboard the missing Malaysia Airlines flight are paying “special attention” to a 35 year-old Chinese Uighur man who undertook flight simulation training, according to a report in a leading Malay language newspaper in Kuala Lumpur"
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Berks
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: Domaine de la Romanee-Conti
Posts: 1,691
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
1 Post
.I was under the impression ATC informed mas at 240 that last contact was 121
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: entre ici et lŕ
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Military Radar Q
At the point the transponder ceased to respond the plane was approaching the coast of Vietnam and would be on Vietnamese military primary radar, no? IF the plane did turn west and transited the Malay peninsula (and the possibility it did so was considered sufficient to deploy SAR assets to the Malacca Strait) it would have been picked up by Thai military primary radar and Indonesian also -so why have none of these countries said anything? Awhile back someone did post that at FL295 it would not be picked up by military radar but it was picked up (maybe) by Malaysian military radar. Being a Commair it would have been of none the interest to the Vietnam operator as it approached the coast, however a turn off of filed flight path would -if it happened. Perhaps it did not turn west?
Another Q: If SAR assets were committed to the Malacca Strait why were not recon flights made over the largely uninhabited jungles of Sumatra to the west. A couple of days back Onetrack posted a plausible scenario that had the plane crashing into that area.
Unrelated but to the RR engine data bit -my understanding is protocol in this situation is to turn over anything they know to the investigating entity and it is the investigating entity's call as to release or not release (or authorize RR to release)
Another Q: If SAR assets were committed to the Malacca Strait why were not recon flights made over the largely uninhabited jungles of Sumatra to the west. A couple of days back Onetrack posted a plausible scenario that had the plane crashing into that area.
Unrelated but to the RR engine data bit -my understanding is protocol in this situation is to turn over anything they know to the investigating entity and it is the investigating entity's call as to release or not release (or authorize RR to release)
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bali, Indonesia
Posts: 264
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Moderators
At this point, I think it appropriate to send a vote of thanks to the moderators of this forum. It is so fast moving and contains so much repetition and rubbish, including some of my own, that it must be a major challenge for them. Thanks Guys.
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: PA
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Radar Contact Till 2:40 AM
Surely:
I was under the impression ATC informed mas at 240 that last contact was 121
Two different things.
[A] Last contact with crew at 1:21 AM, Malaysia Time.
"Malaysia Airlines has said that ground controllers had their last radio communication with the pilots about 1:30 a.m" - Boston Globe
Confusion over plane?s route frustrates families and search - World - The Boston Globe
[B] Last Radar contact of an unknown aircraft flying in Malaysian airspace allowed to proceed unchallenged around 2:40 AM, Malaysia Time. This is the only reason search shifted to the west of the peninsula.
I was under the impression ATC informed mas at 240 that last contact was 121
Two different things.
[A] Last contact with crew at 1:21 AM, Malaysia Time.
"Malaysia Airlines has said that ground controllers had their last radio communication with the pilots about 1:30 a.m" - Boston Globe
Confusion over plane?s route frustrates families and search - World - The Boston Globe
[B] Last Radar contact of an unknown aircraft flying in Malaysian airspace allowed to proceed unchallenged around 2:40 AM, Malaysia Time. This is the only reason search shifted to the west of the peninsula.
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So after lots of messing around with westerly radar tracks it looks like we are back where were started Day 1.
Which to me makes the most probable outcome being a catastrophic event at FL350 leading to a crash on the flightpath with the debris mostly sinking and now some floating to the north and east, soon to be washed up on some beaches.
What that event was will be discovered when the boxes are found.
Which to me makes the most probable outcome being a catastrophic event at FL350 leading to a crash on the flightpath with the debris mostly sinking and now some floating to the north and east, soon to be washed up on some beaches.
What that event was will be discovered when the boxes are found.
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: PA
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Where Did It End Up?
Davidsoffice
IF the rogue radar track was our aircraft..... Where would it reach, in that general direction, outside of friendly radar coverage before needing fuel?
This is THE most important question today obviously and if the aircraft turned west as most believe now, the only party that can help answer this question is India. Just now the news came out that India has deployed 3 ships and 3 aircraft to search effort east of Andaman islands. However, their unexplained silence on tracking an unknown large aircraft near Andaman islands is curious to say the least, unless, like Malaysia they also have been caught in a situation where they cannot confess to holes in their radar coverage.
IF the rogue radar track was our aircraft..... Where would it reach, in that general direction, outside of friendly radar coverage before needing fuel?
This is THE most important question today obviously and if the aircraft turned west as most believe now, the only party that can help answer this question is India. Just now the news came out that India has deployed 3 ships and 3 aircraft to search effort east of Andaman islands. However, their unexplained silence on tracking an unknown large aircraft near Andaman islands is curious to say the least, unless, like Malaysia they also have been caught in a situation where they cannot confess to holes in their radar coverage.
Last edited by bono; 13th Mar 2014 at 13:26. Reason: typo
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: London
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Reports coming in of relatives of flight 370 passengers reducing malaysian airline staff in their hotel to tears during press conference and shouting at them "you are not leaving" after a 4 hour Q & A
Sounds like this situation is getting more and more toxic. Is there any precedent to something like this? (except air france 447).
Sounds like this situation is getting more and more toxic. Is there any precedent to something like this? (except air france 447).
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Pasadena
Posts: 633
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are arrays of suitable satellites. I'm sure that if it turns out a mystery remains, then their owners can be quietly asked if they can help, and in an informal way they would. Countries with ocean surveillance radar constellations and missile warning imaging satellite, along with even some weather coverage from moderate and geostationary locations might be able to shed some light.
In the meantime, a fisherman with a bit of plastic is likely to be the first to shed light on the location of the wreckage.
In the meantime, a fisherman with a bit of plastic is likely to be the first to shed light on the location of the wreckage.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: s wales
Age: 81
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
can we pls out this one to bed
Turin #2796
What is the distance between the bottle's forward end and the bulkhead?
Accepting all your reservations I comment as follows.
If it hasn't built up max momentum it will not pierce the bulkhead, being round at the "front end" it will deflect and bounce around ( may even get stuck) but if it ever got to face aft this would propel it into the MEC, which by now is a fairly oxygen rich environment.
As an aside to those speculating the aircraft could have been "secretly" fully fueled you obviously don't know much about refueling procedure.
It is not like pulling up at the pumps needing 1/2 tank and deciding you might decide to go the scenic route and filling up instead.
At your hub ops will have informed refueling of the required load and that is all they will put in.
We once landed at an airport which was a regular stop and the refuelers knew pretty well how much we need to depart full and would send out a bowser and trailer. On this occasion we needed more, the driver would not let me have more, he asked to check the flight deck gauges, read the fuel content subtracted the input and stated we had landed below minimum reserve. I confirmed this and stated pilot was filing a report right then. I still had to fill in loads of paperwork for the fuel company.
YOU CANNOT JUST TOP UP
The fittings are on the rear/aft facing end of the bottle. If the fitting was to fail and the restraining straps were also to fail, then potentially, the bottle would go forwards not aft. That would send it either straight through the radome or potentially deflected upwards into the below flightdeck area. This contains the backdrive mechanisms for the control column and rudder pedals.
The possibility (of an O2 bottle failing as such) is remote at the extreme but not unprecedented.
I don't buy it.
The possibility (of an O2 bottle failing as such) is remote at the extreme but not unprecedented.
I don't buy it.
Accepting all your reservations I comment as follows.
If it hasn't built up max momentum it will not pierce the bulkhead, being round at the "front end" it will deflect and bounce around ( may even get stuck) but if it ever got to face aft this would propel it into the MEC, which by now is a fairly oxygen rich environment.
As an aside to those speculating the aircraft could have been "secretly" fully fueled you obviously don't know much about refueling procedure.
It is not like pulling up at the pumps needing 1/2 tank and deciding you might decide to go the scenic route and filling up instead.
At your hub ops will have informed refueling of the required load and that is all they will put in.
We once landed at an airport which was a regular stop and the refuelers knew pretty well how much we need to depart full and would send out a bowser and trailer. On this occasion we needed more, the driver would not let me have more, he asked to check the flight deck gauges, read the fuel content subtracted the input and stated we had landed below minimum reserve. I confirmed this and stated pilot was filing a report right then. I still had to fill in loads of paperwork for the fuel company.
YOU CANNOT JUST TOP UP
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: what U.S. calls ´old Europe´
Posts: 941
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What that event was will be discovered when the boxes are found.
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Found in Toronto
Posts: 615
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Faking your ID:
In a Mode A/C transponder, you are whomever you want to be.
AFAIK with Mode S and ADS-B the identity of the airplane is hard coded into the transponder and not changeable in flight. Nothing stopping anyone from carrying around their own transponder, but setting it up in a 777 with access to an antenna would likely be quite the challenge
As far as popping up on a new code, this would work great in the middle of the USA at 4500 feet and 150 knots. Hi there! This is uncle Bill going to get a $100 burger and hit on the waitress. As far as flights crossing international borders and in the Class A - not so much.
In a Mode A/C transponder, you are whomever you want to be.
AFAIK with Mode S and ADS-B the identity of the airplane is hard coded into the transponder and not changeable in flight. Nothing stopping anyone from carrying around their own transponder, but setting it up in a 777 with access to an antenna would likely be quite the challenge
As far as popping up on a new code, this would work great in the middle of the USA at 4500 feet and 150 knots. Hi there! This is uncle Bill going to get a $100 burger and hit on the waitress. As far as flights crossing international borders and in the Class A - not so much.
Now if you were to coordinate with another known flight in the area and have them turn off their transponder as you turn yours on with the same code, that would be seamless with ATC.
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Australia
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Would the supposed conversation the Narita-bound 777 pilot had with MH370 about 10 minutes after the transponder loss, where he reported hearing "mumbling", be preserved on the CVR of his plane, or would it have been over-written by the time he reached Japan?
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: California Central Coast
Age: 75
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I hope someone is doing a carefully controlled sonar survey of the area where contact was originally lost. Swissair 111 was found almost exactly where it was lost several days after the search had moved on, due to poor control of the original sonar survey, later inspection of the records showed that the debris was seen on the very first track. Needless to say it didn't look much like an aircraft.
That may be true, but the "Satellite coms" don't talk directly with the Satellites. They talk to a ground station that relays the information up to a satellite, so if the aircraft is out of range of a ground station, the messages won't go through that system.
What would be the point? AFAIK satcom is used when out of range of VHF. EG over mid atlantic. The a/c communicates directly with satelites.
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ai....0%3B581%3B526
Re the fuel load, it was stated very early in this event that the aircraft had 7 and a half hours of fuel loaded. So there was plenty of gas to go even further than the 4 hours post loss of contact.