Helicopter Crash Central London
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An earlier post said the tower would be 500ft high (ie AGL) when completed then speculated about the height of the crane on top. An earlier post said the NOTAM had the obstacle (building + crane + jib) at 770ft AMSL, ie above sea level (so more or less Thames level). By some of the early news coverage the fog was up and down at the time but definitely capable of obscuring the crane and even the top of the tower according to eye-witnesses. The 500ft rule allowed the pilot to come down to land for his diversion to Battersea but horizontal viz would have been poor and on a divert he may not have had that particular NOTAM to hand and he hadn't yet made radio contact with Battersea it seems who may have been able to warn him. Very unfortunate circumstances.
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Eyewitness account from vauxhall station. Says top of crane not visible to him from the station.
Eyewitness account from vauxhall station. Says top of crane not visible to him from the station.
The 500ft rule allowed the pilot to come down to land for his diversion to Battersea but horizontal viz would have been poor and on a divert he may not have had that particular NOTAM to hand
(Note am not saying Commander in this case did not comply with this requirement)
Quote from UK ANO:-
A commander must, before taking off on a private flight, an aerial work flight or a public transport flight, take all reasonable steps so as to be satisfied of the matters specified in paragraph (3).
(3) The matters referred to in paragraph (2) are that:
(a) the flight can safely be made, taking into account the latest information available as to the route and aerodrome to be used, the weather reports and forecasts available and any alternative course of action which can be adopted in case the flight cannot be completed as planned;
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<<Remind us what the "Floor"altitude is for the London Terminal Manoveuring area.>>
The airspace around the site is Class A - the London Control Zone - extending upwards from ground level to meet the TMA.
The airspace around the site is Class A - the London Control Zone - extending upwards from ground level to meet the TMA.
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The Battersea AIP has the tower at 332 feet (updated October 2012). Yet I believe it's roof height is 594 feet.
Without the NOTAM - if he was map crawling he would have thought he was safe.
Without the NOTAM - if he was map crawling he would have thought he was safe.
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Wrong obstruction. It's not yet in the AIP.
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This is very sad. I am a bit confused about the location though. If the helicopter was going from Redhill to Elstree I'd have expected him to route Banstead to Barnes and then try to go north. In that area he'd be talking to Heathrow but it is to the west of Battersea and Vauxhall is to the east, beyond the heliport. Given that the crash site is south of the impact with the crane I wonder whether he'd decided to divert and turned right along the river, realised he'd missed the heliport and done a turnback across the river - all the while being to busy to change frequency to Battersea.
As already mentioned the Heathrow trace is very acuurate (I have also been reminded of my ever so slight divergence from the approved route) so they will no doubt be able to provide something. As an aside, the maximum permitted altitude on the London QNH along the river to the west of Battersea Heliport is 1000', to the east as far as Chelsea Bridge it's 1500', as near as damn it agl heights. The helilanes rules state that helicopters must not fly below 500' separation and I think it's a 1km minimum visibility, but pilots must endeavor to fly at the maximum altitude for the sector.
As already mentioned the Heathrow trace is very acuurate (I have also been reminded of my ever so slight divergence from the approved route) so they will no doubt be able to provide something. As an aside, the maximum permitted altitude on the London QNH along the river to the west of Battersea Heliport is 1000', to the east as far as Chelsea Bridge it's 1500', as near as damn it agl heights. The helilanes rules state that helicopters must not fly below 500' separation and I think it's a 1km minimum visibility, but pilots must endeavor to fly at the maximum altitude for the sector.
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500' clear could be horizontal, think of it as a bubble. This DOES NOT apply for t/o and ldg. He may have started his approach.
Has anyone considered that if he was diverting and had been handed over by heathrow, he would have to retune his radio and be heads in for a few moments. How long between handover and impact? I stated earlier, when all is going to plan it is high workload in the lanes, something unexpected is tough to deal with, even in good weather. Battersea is not the easiest to spot at night if you are not familiar, lookout could be concentrated down and not ahead. So there are a few scenarios, all speculation.
God bless those who died, only the pilot himself will really know what happened, we can only guess.
Has anyone considered that if he was diverting and had been handed over by heathrow, he would have to retune his radio and be heads in for a few moments. How long between handover and impact? I stated earlier, when all is going to plan it is high workload in the lanes, something unexpected is tough to deal with, even in good weather. Battersea is not the easiest to spot at night if you are not familiar, lookout could be concentrated down and not ahead. So there are a few scenarios, all speculation.
God bless those who died, only the pilot himself will really know what happened, we can only guess.
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I think it's already been published that he was diverting from Elstree into Battersea.
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I think it's already been published that he was diverting from Elstree into Battersea.
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OK - so he would have needed the NOTAM to know about the building if he was map crawling.
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BOAC, no he was on a perfectly normal routing to Battersea, if travelling from Elstree.
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ITN just posted the following:
"The pilot who died today after the helicopter he was flying crashed in London has been named by sources as Pete Barnes."
Also being reported by Sky News
"The pilot who died today after the helicopter he was flying crashed in London has been named by sources as Pete Barnes."
Also being reported by Sky News
Last edited by BrummyGit; 16th Jan 2013 at 13:24.
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There but for the grace of the gods....
Battersea (London Heliport) closed today out of respect. They said:
STATEMENT FROM LONDON HELIPORT ON VAUXHALL HELICOPTER CRASH
Just before 8am today a helicopter crashed in central London close to Vauxhall Bridge.
The helicopter involved in the accident was not destined in to the London Heliport.
However, we received a request from Heathrow air traffic control to accept the helicopter, which requested to be diverted due to bad weather.
Earlier in the helicopter's journey the pilot had been receiving an air traffic control service from NATS. The heliport never gained contact with the helicopter.
The Heliport will be closed for the rest of the day
My question, as only a PPL H on an EC120, is was he cleared in to land at Battersea, and if so, should he not have been at circuit height, as even the extended circuit was to the west of the helicopter?
STATEMENT FROM LONDON HELIPORT ON VAUXHALL HELICOPTER CRASH
Just before 8am today a helicopter crashed in central London close to Vauxhall Bridge.
The helicopter involved in the accident was not destined in to the London Heliport.
However, we received a request from Heathrow air traffic control to accept the helicopter, which requested to be diverted due to bad weather.
Earlier in the helicopter's journey the pilot had been receiving an air traffic control service from NATS. The heliport never gained contact with the helicopter.
The Heliport will be closed for the rest of the day
My question, as only a PPL H on an EC120, is was he cleared in to land at Battersea, and if so, should he not have been at circuit height, as even the extended circuit was to the west of the helicopter?
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If the helicopter was going from Redhill to Elstree I'd have expected him to route Banstead to Barnes and then try to go north.
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With the facts that are now coming out and as an ex helicopter pilot myself I find the sequence of events leading to the accident very strange. Clearly there is more than we currently know for an experienced helicopter pilot to do what he did.
On the face of it flying from Redhill to Elstree to decide to divert to Battersea in these weather conditions was a strange decision. An ILS approach into Heathrow would be the safe option after climbing to a safe altitude. Then the cost of landing at Heathrow could be a factor. But to fly down the Thames to land at Battersea in freezing fog? Odd. Maybe icing was becoming a factor and he did not want to climb? It's all a bit strange at present.
On the face of it flying from Redhill to Elstree to decide to divert to Battersea in these weather conditions was a strange decision. An ILS approach into Heathrow would be the safe option after climbing to a safe altitude. Then the cost of landing at Heathrow could be a factor. But to fly down the Thames to land at Battersea in freezing fog? Odd. Maybe icing was becoming a factor and he did not want to climb? It's all a bit strange at present.
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Originally Posted by ShyTorque
BOAC, no he was on a perfectly normal routing to Battersea, if travelling from Elstree.
Last edited by BOAC; 16th Jan 2013 at 14:06.
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Acknowledging all the concerns about speculation etc but, this is what Pprune is here for.
If one lines up the crash site on google maps with the tower crane, then extend it northwards, it lines up perfectly with a route that takes you down the RHS of the River Thames (if flying south) past the Houses of Parliament inbound to Battersea. This would undoubtedly be an appropriate point to contact the heliport, so eyes down onto the radio (single crew operation) to change frequency, whilst in and out of the mist and very easy, with the River quite narrow, to miss the right turn, especially in reduced visibility. It would only takes seconds to cover those hundred or so yards.
If one lines up the crash site on google maps with the tower crane, then extend it northwards, it lines up perfectly with a route that takes you down the RHS of the River Thames (if flying south) past the Houses of Parliament inbound to Battersea. This would undoubtedly be an appropriate point to contact the heliport, so eyes down onto the radio (single crew operation) to change frequency, whilst in and out of the mist and very easy, with the River quite narrow, to miss the right turn, especially in reduced visibility. It would only takes seconds to cover those hundred or so yards.