Delta loss of comm
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Delta loss of comm
Anybody have any thing else of this??
Investigators have determined that a Delta Air Lines Boeing 757-200 was involved in three losses of separation within a few minutes of departing Atlanta, after the crew failed to activate the twinjet's transponder.
Despite being instructed to contact departure control after being cleared to an initial waypoint, the pilots did not establish communication with air traffic control until around 8min after take-off from runway 27R.
Radar displays showed only a primary target, with no identifying data, and analysis of this information indicated that the 757 lost lateral separation with a Beech 55, a Pilatus PC-12 and an Atlantic Southeast Airlines Bombardier CRJ100. The respective closest proximities were 1.44nm, 0.81nm and 2.36nm.
"The [aircraft] flew through one controller's airspace and entered another controller's airspace without co-ordination, before radar and radio contact was established," says the US National Transportation Safety Board.
Procedures required Atlanta tower controllers to check that departing flights were showing a radar data block before transfer to terminal airspace control. But the NTSB says that the tower controller - distracted by a situation at the 27R approach - "did not notice" that the data block had not been automatically acquired.
As a result the radar showed no altitude information about the 757, which was using a standard instrument departure - designated UGAAA 2 - involving a climb to 10,000ft.
Although the aircraft took off at 13:19 local time, the crew did not make contact again until almost 13:27. In the intervening 8min, departure control had asked the tower about an unaccounted flight strip for the Delta jet, but attempts to locate the aircraft among primary radar targets proved "futile", says the NTSB.
The 757's first radio contact was not with departure control, but with Atlanta tower, to ask whether it was required to stay at 10,000ft, to which the tower replied that the crew was supposed to be communicating with departure control.
When the pilots made contact with the departure controller, they were asked to verify that the transponder was switched on. Six seconds later the aircraft's data block appeared on the radar display, showing that the jet was 20nm east of the airport. Owing to its proximity to inbound Atlanta traffic, the 757 was quickly cleared to 14,000ft and handed off to Atlanta's en-route centre.
Visual conditions prevailed during the 11 March 2011 incident.
Investigators have determined that a Delta Air Lines Boeing 757-200 was involved in three losses of separation within a few minutes of departing Atlanta, after the crew failed to activate the twinjet's transponder.
Despite being instructed to contact departure control after being cleared to an initial waypoint, the pilots did not establish communication with air traffic control until around 8min after take-off from runway 27R.
Radar displays showed only a primary target, with no identifying data, and analysis of this information indicated that the 757 lost lateral separation with a Beech 55, a Pilatus PC-12 and an Atlantic Southeast Airlines Bombardier CRJ100. The respective closest proximities were 1.44nm, 0.81nm and 2.36nm.
"The [aircraft] flew through one controller's airspace and entered another controller's airspace without co-ordination, before radar and radio contact was established," says the US National Transportation Safety Board.
Procedures required Atlanta tower controllers to check that departing flights were showing a radar data block before transfer to terminal airspace control. But the NTSB says that the tower controller - distracted by a situation at the 27R approach - "did not notice" that the data block had not been automatically acquired.
As a result the radar showed no altitude information about the 757, which was using a standard instrument departure - designated UGAAA 2 - involving a climb to 10,000ft.
Although the aircraft took off at 13:19 local time, the crew did not make contact again until almost 13:27. In the intervening 8min, departure control had asked the tower about an unaccounted flight strip for the Delta jet, but attempts to locate the aircraft among primary radar targets proved "futile", says the NTSB.
The 757's first radio contact was not with departure control, but with Atlanta tower, to ask whether it was required to stay at 10,000ft, to which the tower replied that the crew was supposed to be communicating with departure control.
When the pilots made contact with the departure controller, they were asked to verify that the transponder was switched on. Six seconds later the aircraft's data block appeared on the radar display, showing that the jet was 20nm east of the airport. Owing to its proximity to inbound Atlanta traffic, the 757 was quickly cleared to 14,000ft and handed off to Atlanta's en-route centre.
Visual conditions prevailed during the 11 March 2011 incident.
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contact departure GOODBYE
Whilst great for local boys, it is a problem for foreigners, who might not know just which is the frequency: you get odd responses when you ask :which Departure frequency....
or is it just me...
or is it just me...
Routing and Altitudes via the following priorities 'AVE-F' hold at clearance limit until times up ...make any available IFR approach you want if this is the type of 'emergency' facing aircrew today we have a very bleak outlook indeed! while doing this you can fiddle with the radios and try to re-establish coms...
AVE-F
Route and Altitudes as Assigned... Vectored...Expected...Filed
Whst does every one think all that CRAFT clearance mumbo-jumbo is for anyway?---your health
Lastly, although perhaps not the best idea in commercial operation...if VFR you can remain VFR and follow procedures for NORDO at a chosen airport
I know that SOPS are overriding but most include some variation of the above...
AVE-F
Route and Altitudes as Assigned... Vectored...Expected...Filed
Whst does every one think all that CRAFT clearance mumbo-jumbo is for anyway?---your health
Lastly, although perhaps not the best idea in commercial operation...if VFR you can remain VFR and follow procedures for NORDO at a chosen airport
I know that SOPS are overriding but most include some variation of the above...
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According to the AV Herald, the NTSB released its factual report on the incident in june 2012 (That should explain why a Mar 11th 2011 incident made it to the "news" section 
).
I must confess I didn't read it, but I suppose it does have something (else?) in.
).I must confess I didn't read it, but I suppose it does have something (else?) in.
contact departure GOODBYE
Whilst great for local boys, it is a problem for foreigners, who might not know just which is the frequency: you get odd responses when you ask :which Departure frequency....
or is it just me...
Whilst great for local boys, it is a problem for foreigners, who might not know just which is the frequency: you get odd responses when you ask :which Departure frequency....
or is it just me...
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Isn't the point of this that they forgot to turn on the transponder, which magically bloomed six seconds after they were asked to confirm that the xpdr was on? Or maybe they just recycled it and now it worked?
Also, who calls the tower from 10,000 feet to confirm a clearance?
What am I missing?
Also, who calls the tower from 10,000 feet to confirm a clearance?
What am I missing?
Longtimelurker
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In the states you contact departure after the tower gives you a frequency change.These guys just keep flying along either waiting to be called or not able to get word in and it happened the transponder was either inop or not turned on.Dont think I would handle it that way.
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ATL is not known for its slow traffic. Depending on how much runways the TWRcontroller was operating I guess there would have been a few takeoff clearances issued in the time to climb to 10000', should have rung a bell...
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Actually there is no requirement that the tower hands you off with a frequency. It's nothing more that a courtesy and by eliminating that piece of the handoff they also eliminate needless talk, After all, it's right there on the SID. 
