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Security

Old 26th Dec 2010, 16:15
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Background

I think a little background on the current security charade is in order since most of you were probably not around when these events occurred.

When passenger screening was initiated in the US in the early 1970's all working airline employees, both ground & flight, could bypass the checkpoint by showing their airline ID. This worked well for some 15 years until the following event out of LAX on Dec 7, 1987 (Pearl Harbor Day):

A RECENTLY DISCHARGED USAIR EMPLOYEE BOARDED PSA FLT 1771 AFTER HAVING LEFT A GOODBYE MESSAGE WITH FRIENDS. HE BYPASSED SECURITY AND CARRIED ABD A BORROWED 44 CALIBER PISTOL. A NOTE WRITTEN BY THIS PSGR, FOUND IN THE WRECKAGE, THREATENED HIS FORMER SUPERVISOR AT USAIR, WHO WAS ABOARD THE FLT. AT 1613, THE PLT RPTD TO OAKLAND ARTCC THAT HE HAD AN EMERGENCY AND THAT GUNSHOTS HAD BEEN FIRED IN THE AIRPLANE. WITHIN 25 SECONDS, OAKLAND CTR CONTROLLERS OBSERVED THAT PSA 1771 HAD BEGUN A RAPID DESCENT FM WHICH IT DID NOT RECOVER. WITNESSES ON THE GND SAID THE AIRPLANE WAS INTACT AND THERE WAS NO EVIDENCE OF FIRE BEFORE THE AIRPLANE STRUCK THE GND IN A STEEP NOSE-DOWN ATTITUDE. THE CVR TAPE REVEALED THE SOUNDS OF A SCUFFLE AND SEVERAL SHOTS WHICH WERE APPARENTLY FIRED IN OR NEAR THE COCKPIT. THE PISTOL WAS FOUND IN THE WRECKAGE WITH 6 EXPENDED ROUNDS. FAA RULES PERMITTED AIRLINE EMPLOYEES TO BYPASS SECURITY CHECKPOINTS

After this disaster, Elizabeth Dole, a politico who was then Sec. of Transportation, decreed that no employee could bypass screening at a PASSENGER checkpoint. The result was that the flight crews, who were the potential victims, were required to be screened, while the ground crews continued to use the "downstairs doors" with NO screening.

The only thing more absurd than this situation is the fact that you flight crews have put up with it for the past 23 years....

Last edited by BobM2; 26th Dec 2010 at 16:29. Reason: spelling
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Old 26th Dec 2010, 18:05
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BobM2:

After this disaster, Elizabeth Dole, a politico who was then Sec. of Transportation, decreed that no employee could bypass screening at a PASSENGER checkpoint. The result was that the flight crews, who were the potential victims, were required to be screened, while the ground crews continued to use the "downstairs doors" with NO screening.
When that stage kicked in, at pilot domiciles, the august management pilots were issued special airport-issued IDs in addition to their company ID. Same for the baggage busters, mechs, etc. They were considered part of the "airport team" whereas as line pukes, even though based at that airport, where not part of the "airport team." Thus, when we wanted to preflight the aircraft, we had to have some member of the "airport team" accompany us to do the preflight. This "team" member could be a clueless baggage buster.

So, this B.S. came in stages, long before 911.
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Old 26th Dec 2010, 18:11
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New Interview

Revolutionary Politics::Revolutionary Politics : Pilot Whistleblower Exposes Huge Holes In Airport Security & Gets Treated Like A Criminal By TSA

This is a slow load. It's one of those sites that the government doesn't like.
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Old 26th Dec 2010, 18:12
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BobM2

This gunman didn't "bypass" the screening system with an ID. He Waved at the gate agent, who recognized him, and waved him onto the Flight, with a 5 pound handgun in his jacket.

So. Let's see.......
Costing the Country billions of dollars, while failing utterly at the mission, the TSA is considered necessary to protect "US" from "THEM".

Hmm.......What could an "actual" enemy do that is more insidious??
bear

Beyond embarrassing, the TSA is a black hole of money, and security.
 
Old 27th Dec 2010, 00:14
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please correct me if I'm wrong, but that flight wasn't a USAIR flight, it was a PSA (the original pacific southwest airlines)...now there might have been conversations about buying PSA...but the plane had PSA on it when it went down.
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Old 27th Dec 2010, 16:55
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Originally Posted by bearfoil
BobM2

This gunman didn't "bypass" the screening system with an ID. He Waved at the gate agent, who recognized him, and waved him onto the Flight, with a 5 pound handgun in his jacket.
I don't quite follow you here Bearfoil. Once he reached the gate, he had already cleared the checkpoint & was well within the "secure" area. He had either avoided screening at the checkpoint with his ID card (which is what the feds say), or else used the downstairs door (which in 1987 had only a keypad combination lock) to bypass the checkpoint altogether. The only duty of the gate agent was to verify his ticket & allow him to board.

I do agree with your assessment of the current security situation.
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Old 27th Dec 2010, 23:14
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Pilot decides to go public,

The Kathryn Report: Chris Liu: I am the YouTube airline pilot
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Old 28th Dec 2010, 16:06
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BobM2

Memory might have failed me, and I've not looked back at the report. I remember the shooter as being recognized and waved through by security, so my gate agent post must be wrong. At the time I was living about ten miles from the hole. I forget the depth, it was impressive. God rest.
 
Old 29th Dec 2010, 07:16
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San Francisco pilot questions security.

YouTube pilot reveals himself | Chris Liu | Defends security video

Chris Liu appeared in a press conference Dec 29th explaining why he is dissatisfied with the present security arrangements at San Francisco Airport, which extends, presumably, to all airports in the US. (Include the UK and pretty well everywhere else in this criticism).
He sees as a fundemental flaw the non-screening of all the air side workers including the TSA personnel themselves. They have full air-side access simply by swiping a smart card to gain entry. His argument is simply that these people should either go through the same screening as the crews or the crews should go through the same entry procedure as these card holders.
He would prefer that they all go through the same procedures as the crews.
I have to say, I agree with him.
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Old 29th Dec 2010, 07:52
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rubik101:

He sees as a fundemental flaw the non-screening of all the air side workers including the TSA personnel themselves. They have full air-side access simply by swiping a smart card to gain entry. His argument is simply that these people should either go through the same screening as the crews or the crews should go through the same entry procedure as these card holders.
I trust he doesn't mind facing those folks now that they know who he is.
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Old 29th Dec 2010, 08:11
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Airport security.

Why should he ?

We're all in this together, aren't we ??

Then together we can get the nonsense sorted.
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Old 29th Dec 2010, 12:55
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Sleeve Wing:

Why should he ?

We're all in this together, aren't we ??
Not exactly. That is his whole point.

Then together we can get the nonsense sorted.
Right, the baggage busters and TSA agents are our comrades in arm.
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Old 29th Dec 2010, 15:18
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Yes indeed forcing flight crew to be screened while ground staff simply amble in by means of a swipe card is a disparity.

But if anyone thinks pointing this out will result in a sensible policy is surely mistaken. The most likely reaction of officialdom is to introduce screening for ground staff after taking away their swipe cards. Lots more jobs for security apes and a subsequent increase in the hassle factor for airport workers.

No security benefit either.
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Old 31st Dec 2010, 21:49
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Flaws in the use of ID swipe cards.

I had one for 12 years - the photo was updated only twice over that period so I didn't resemble the photo at times.
Before swipe-cards, I recall that we rebelled against even the requirement wear name badges, and later a photo-ID hanging from every neck, and one of my colleagues replaced his photo with one of his spaniel dog.

Nobody noticed.
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Old 1st Jan 2011, 10:13
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clockwork said:
Do all these contractors hava an airside security clearance, I wonder? Or maybe when it suits the powers that be, it can all be glossed over.
All contractors used during the snow clearance at LHR were security cleared since they were already working airside on the T2 project.

The main T2A contractor had offered the use of their plant and workers to aid in snow and ice clearance; this offer was finally accepted by airport management.

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Old 1st Jan 2011, 16:59
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So if they were state employees that would be OK then. The old Soviet Union did a nice line in state employees. Would they be the sort of security staff you had in mind?
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Old 1st Jan 2011, 18:08
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Benefit of buying / running scanning: high - big profits for security theatre companies
[guess which of the above groups lobbies the politicians ?]
Michael Chertoff, 2nd Sec. Homeland Security 2005- 2009...

Michael Chertoff has been an advocate of enhanced technologies, such as full body scanners, that reduce security vulnerabilities and enhance detection capabilities for those threats not easily detected by metal detectors. Rapiscan Systems, a manufacturer of this technology, was a client of his security consulting firm, the Chertoff Group in 2009 and services provided were related to aviation security. The Chertoff Group played a massive role in the sale of whole body imaging technology to TSA

former Homeland Security secretary Michael Chertoff has given dozens of media interviews touting the need for the federal government to buy more full-body scanners for airports.
Who else is on the Chertoff group team ??

Other board members include : ex-director of CIA, ex-NSA/CSS, ex-US CBP, ex-DHS, ex-under sec. to UN on Safety and security..

Team Chertoff Group

and...

UK MP John Reid:
  • Home Secretary (2006-2007)
  • Secretary of State for Defence (2005-2006)
  • Secretary of State for Health (2003-2005)
  • Leader of House of Commons (2003)
  • Party Chair and Minister without Portolio (2002-2003)
  • Secretary of State for Northern Ireland (2001-2002)
  • Secretary of State for Scotland (1999-2001)
  • Minister for Transport (1998-1999)
  • Minister of Defence (1997-1998)
Security ? no. Politicos making bank off the taxpaying, travlling public ? hmmm.

follow ------------------------------> The Money



Now as a final comment.. Rapiscan....


Rapiscan CEO with Obama in India

In light of the news that Glenn Beck broke on his show last week regarding the owner of the Rapiscan body scanners (George Soros’ OSI) being used by the TSA, there’s this tidbit to add to it.
tidbit..

"OSI Systems is the owner of Rapiscan Systems which manufactures the Secure 1000, one of the most commonly used backscatter x-ray machines. And, no it is not the Deepak Chopra you’re thinking of.
OSI Systems Chief Executive Officer Joins US Presidential Visit to India
HAWTHORNE, Calif.–(BUSINESS WIRE)– OSI Systems, Inc. (NASDAQ: OSIS), a vertically-integrated provider of specialized electronic products for critical applications in the Security and Healthcare industries, today announced that Deepak Chopra, Chairman and CEO, was selected to accompany US President, Barack Obama, to Mumbai and attended the US India Business Entrepreneurship meeting, which was held by the US India Business Council (US IBC). The goal of the meeting was to promote further trade between US and India...."
So our industry continues to get scr3wed to the wall as vehicle for political elite to make fortunes off of, with no benefit to the industry, in fact much less, it remains detrimental to the industry... And lets not even get started on the taxation issues !
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Old 1st Jan 2011, 23:06
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In my analysis, TSA comes off as dramatically larger than it need be, with an unnerring focus on missing out on the Mission, and being relatively distracting of a sensible approach. The Personnel are mediocre, and the mission is evocative of a Ken Kesey novel, ripping good reading, but too ironic for words.

Captain Liu? a sensible man persecuted by the Nurse Ratcheds of the piece. Funny if not so disturbing..........

bear
 
Old 2nd Jan 2011, 03:42
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Slightly off topic, but on Sky news the other night when talking about snow clearance at LHR, I'm sure it was mentioned that there were 150 contractors brought in to help clear the runway.
Do all these contractors hava an airside security clearance, I wonder? Or maybe when it suits the powers that be, it can all be glossed over.
Unless the rules have changed, they get a temp airside pass which means they are accompanied by someone, who has been vetted, at all times. A simple solution as the time taken to go through criminal records checks would mean the snow would be gone by the time the "vetting" had been completed.

Of course, these contractors could always be on standby so will have had the vetting done and will have a full airside pass anyway.


That's how it used to work at LHR, I guessing it ain't changed much since I was there.



Edit: Or another reason like the one posted above saying they were already cleared since they were working on T2
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Old 23rd Jan 2011, 14:45
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Maybe it's because no ground staff were involved in the 9/11 plot, on the other hand...
I don't believe any Line pilot's were involved in this plot either!
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