Qantas A380 uncontained #2 engine failure
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Disregarding UAL and the explosion of #2, we may be at the threshold of safety as it relates to Turbofans. UAL N1 had a crack in the Titanium disc, it disintegrated and crippled the airframe. But for Haynes and the others, all should have died. I use the word "Threshold" advisedly, I don't see anything that cannot be done to stiffen the powerplant.
GE has a monster that made 125,000 PoT in the test cell. As the Fan gets bigger, the limits of Mass and rotational Speed get tested, by man and by nature, hopefully by man first. Heat cycles, work cycles, vibration, harmonics, etc.
In the first thread of BA038, AAIB made note of "Heretofore unnoticed Fuel behaviour". I posted a theory of harmonics destroying the localized fuel supplies with Acoustic vibration at and near the FOHE. Incidence of airflow, if not at 0 degrees to the longitudinal axis of the shaft will create an imbalance in the large disc, so not only acoustic, but vibrational energy has a part to play. One would think because the powerplant is new, and cycles would be a lesser consideration of failure cause, that Manufacturing played a part, though this is just as unlikely. A Bird? What is the Avian environment like? That would have been noticed at takeoff, though in climb ingestion could have caused the explosion. Who knows. The Trent is not having a good year.
GE has a monster that made 125,000 PoT in the test cell. As the Fan gets bigger, the limits of Mass and rotational Speed get tested, by man and by nature, hopefully by man first. Heat cycles, work cycles, vibration, harmonics, etc.
In the first thread of BA038, AAIB made note of "Heretofore unnoticed Fuel behaviour". I posted a theory of harmonics destroying the localized fuel supplies with Acoustic vibration at and near the FOHE. Incidence of airflow, if not at 0 degrees to the longitudinal axis of the shaft will create an imbalance in the large disc, so not only acoustic, but vibrational energy has a part to play. One would think because the powerplant is new, and cycles would be a lesser consideration of failure cause, that Manufacturing played a part, though this is just as unlikely. A Bird? What is the Avian environment like? That would have been noticed at takeoff, though in climb ingestion could have caused the explosion. Who knows. The Trent is not having a good year.
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Those lamenting sensationalism in the press will undoubted appreciate the "restraint" being demonstrated by CNN: "Qantas grounds Airbus A380 fleet after engine cover falls off plane".
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Dave's Brother-get a clue
Hey Dave's bro...
don't know where you heard that, but they probably shut down a second engine on opposite side of plane for even distribution of engine power....
don't know where you heard that, but they probably shut down a second engine on opposite side of plane for even distribution of engine power....
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"As also indicated above the 'fail safe' condition for loss of signal to the engine control is to continue at last demanded power, it is obviously not a satisfactory condition if a single event can lead to loss of control."
I was talking about the engines' own control systems, not the aircraft's flight controls. Each engine has a controller on it that takes the flight controls' reference command and attempts to meet it. Without this controller, the surge/stall phenomena tends to do bad things to the engine.
I'm sorry, I thought this was a technical discussion forum and not USA Today.
I was talking about the engines' own control systems, not the aircraft's flight controls. Each engine has a controller on it that takes the flight controls' reference command and attempts to meet it. Without this controller, the surge/stall phenomena tends to do bad things to the engine.
I'm sorry, I thought this was a technical discussion forum and not USA Today.
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RR seems to struggle with controls design.
And by the way it's QANTAS (Queensland And New Territories Air Services).
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Anti Spelling Police be damned. This is too much. 1 to Go's Profile - All Airbus types. Occupation: Training Captain.
Quantus.
Two mistakes in (what should be) a 6 letter acronym. Not to mention (ETOPS et all).
Airbus Training Captain. Like I'm an astronaut.
Now boob smith's come up with another variant. Quantas! QANTAS! Bloody QANTAS!
Queensland and Northern bloody Territory bloody Aerial Services!
Dodo. Aerial Services - but close. Totally disregarding the New for Northern
Quantus.
Two mistakes in (what should be) a 6 letter acronym. Not to mention (ETOPS et all).Airbus Training Captain. Like I'm an astronaut.
Now boob smith's come up with another variant. Quantas! QANTAS! Bloody QANTAS!
Queensland and Northern bloody Territory bloody Aerial Services!
Dodo. Aerial Services - but close. Totally disregarding the New for Northern
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I was talking about the engines' own control systems, not the aircraft's flight controls. Each engine has a controller on it that takes the flight controls' reference command and attempts to meet it. Without this controller, the surge/stall phenomena tends to do bad things to the engine.
I'm sorry, I thought this was a technical discussion forum and not USA Today.
I'm sorry, I thought this was a technical discussion forum and not USA Today.
I'm not sure this thread has reached the technical heights of USA Today.
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The design criteria for jet engines state they must be able to contain fan AND/OR turbine disc failiures, think united DC10, these pictures look remarkably like a turbine disc fail. If any fan blades are damaged or missing its usually after the initial turbine fail and a result of shaft imbalance , a bad disc fail will usually result in the translating sleeve damaged or missing.
Will be interesting to see the official findings on why such a new , low hours engine failed so spectacularly.
Will be interesting to see the official findings on why such a new , low hours engine failed so spectacularly.
Engines have to be able to contain any blade off, including a fan blade but theres no way they can be certified to contain a disk that explodes. To do that you'd need a solid metal engine casing several inches thick!
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I see Reuters have updated their pics, but what is the brown stuff being sprayed on Engine 1 when it was still running - picture 29 in their set
Reuters Pictures
Reuters Pictures
Brown Stuff = AIRBUS & RR new Fadec control signal 
to shut down engine
The A380 Lav (s) is the prime source (high quality) of the brown Stuff hitting the fan...
I propose a new Thread: You know you're in Singapore when...
to shut down engine The A380 Lav (s) is the prime source (high quality) of the brown Stuff hitting the fan... I propose a new Thread: You know you're in Singapore when...
Last edited by Melax; 4th Nov 2010 at 17:17.
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I see Reuters have updated their pics, but what is the brown stuff being sprayed on Engine 1 when it was still running - picture 29 in their set
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If we're on to spelling, could some of you please try and remember what Miss Postlethwaite in elementary school was trying to knock into your heads:
of it = its
it is = it's
Rockhound
of it = its
it is = it's
Rockhound
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They just played a video shot buy a pax during landing. After the airplane slowed the number 1 engine was still kicking up quite a spray. It appears on first view that the engine indeed was uncontrolled.
Edit: Sorry for not including the source, it was Fox News in the US
Edit: Sorry for not including the source, it was Fox News in the US
