Emirates A380 pilots find aircraft 'too quiet' to sleep
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MarkD
Nice to see someone gets back to the real issues - fatigue and bunk placement vs. responisbilities and not a commercial break for ipods ....
I am not questioning the capabilities of relief pilots, even if they are two FOs. It is a question of legality. With a serious incident the indictors will look for the guy in charge. Any emergency calls for decisions and we all know that we sometimes don't get it absolutely right - from the legal law twisting, suing fraction point of view. For us pros, if we get it down in one piece without any casualties, we've done a good job. For them it's the start for making headlines, money and careers.
So now be the SIGNING commander and be stuck in the torpedo tube, your colleagues do a great job up front, but some weeks later a quartepounded, sleezy lawyer (be it from the company or else) wants to get compensation or absolution. WHO will be up at the stand?
That is my question.
If I have to report there, good enough, that's what my position and salary should be for. But then I would definitely want a say on how good or bad our rest facility is and I would definitely want a choice of beeing able to join the active crew or not. If the company denies me such possibilities, and will never stand up to me on the stand and share responsibility, then accept my criticism. And to the regulators, we know you read this, you have been informed.
No action means consent.
Such consent applies to the multiple unnecessary entries to the cockpit as well.
Nice to see someone gets back to the real issues - fatigue and bunk placement vs. responisbilities and not a commercial break for ipods ....
I am not questioning the capabilities of relief pilots, even if they are two FOs. It is a question of legality. With a serious incident the indictors will look for the guy in charge. Any emergency calls for decisions and we all know that we sometimes don't get it absolutely right - from the legal law twisting, suing fraction point of view. For us pros, if we get it down in one piece without any casualties, we've done a good job. For them it's the start for making headlines, money and careers.
So now be the SIGNING commander and be stuck in the torpedo tube, your colleagues do a great job up front, but some weeks later a quartepounded, sleezy lawyer (be it from the company or else) wants to get compensation or absolution. WHO will be up at the stand?
That is my question.
If I have to report there, good enough, that's what my position and salary should be for. But then I would definitely want a say on how good or bad our rest facility is and I would definitely want a choice of beeing able to join the active crew or not. If the company denies me such possibilities, and will never stand up to me on the stand and share responsibility, then accept my criticism. And to the regulators, we know you read this, you have been informed.
No action means consent.
Such consent applies to the multiple unnecessary entries to the cockpit as well.
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captain not on flight deck liability
re POOls question about what a lawyer would do if in an accident the captain could not get back to the flight deck
by using augmented crews etc, and crew rest in any position, and cruise FOs, this barrier has already been breached, ie there are lots of occaisions now that a Captain is not on the flight deck.
Where the crew rest is located merely add's a probability angle, but as I say the barrier has been passed long ago...
G
by using augmented crews etc, and crew rest in any position, and cruise FOs, this barrier has already been breached, ie there are lots of occaisions now that a Captain is not on the flight deck.
Where the crew rest is located merely add's a probability angle, but as I say the barrier has been passed long ago...
G
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There is apparently a notice on SeatGuru that the EK A380 may have differing internal configurations based on EK decisions, so it is quite possible that EK might change the layout and move CRC back to where it was originally proposed by Airbus.
S.
S.
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ARINC
You obviously missed the incident back in october on the 201. (a very hilarious one btw).
It seems that the showers are now under control but the wiring issues however are not solved....
It seems that the showers are now under control but the wiring issues however are not solved....
Last edited by 5star; 8th Dec 2008 at 09:34.
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After 15 years on T-props one cannot avoid admitting that one´s ability to hear the oboe solo in a favourite symphony is decreasing. Hearing test at med. is still acceptable, but problems in middle range frequencies show up.
Sometimes I do envie some of our colleges for their problems.
Sometimes I do envie some of our colleges for their problems.
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Earplugs wont be a bad idea. At least if they sleep off so well they can tell thier colleagues to wake them up. I am assuming the bunk beds are comfortable as well. On a recent vigin atlantic flight i was shocked to discover the crew rest area was under the main cabin near where i was seating.
There was a door that led to a stairway and could see the beds. Considering the fact that persengers will be moving around during the flight wont this be noisier than having it at the rear like the 747.
There was a door that led to a stairway and could see the beds. Considering the fact that persengers will be moving around during the flight wont this be noisier than having it at the rear like the 747.
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5star
"It seems that the showers are now under control but the wiring issues however are not solved...."
Well, show us all just EXACTLY what you mean by that!
Well, show us all just EXACTLY what you mean by that!
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Originally Posted by jumpship
My heart bleeds
I would like my relief crew on a long trip to have had a proper sleep.
They're only human, after all.
Not everybody needs the same conditions to be able to relax and go to sleep, but generally a bit of "even" and "familiar" background noise helps no end.
So?
CJ
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...problems sleeping!!....
....and the Emirates pilots have trouble sleeping!!!!!
Photos: Airbus A380-861 Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net
Just a thought!!.
WTDWL.
Photos: Airbus A380-861 Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net
Just a thought!!.
WTDWL.
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Sleeping noise
Yep, I'd agree with a few post's here!
Perhaps a little more thought should have gone into the placement of the bunks and exposure to ambeint noise...
I spent many an hour dossing down for combat kips in the military on the ground and in the air and it was always better with a little ambeint noise and a little warmth.
However, sudden noises, etc would soon snap even the most tired from a deep sleep.
I'm pretty sure most sleep study scientist's that work with in the NHS etc would confirm this, surely this is all part of human factors?????
Perhaps a little more thought should have gone into the placement of the bunks and exposure to ambeint noise...
I spent many an hour dossing down for combat kips in the military on the ground and in the air and it was always better with a little ambeint noise and a little warmth.
However, sudden noises, etc would soon snap even the most tired from a deep sleep.
I'm pretty sure most sleep study scientist's that work with in the NHS etc would confirm this, surely this is all part of human factors?????
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No Sponsor , no one is disputing flight safety. Agreed its a safety issue.
He just raised a point that there are other people who deal with noise every day. Not just the 3 times a month they fly . There are other people in the world too you know. Its not just the mighty 380 drivers who cant get sleep. ( and I am entirely behind the guys as their complaints are justified). A little perspective is always healthy.
He just raised a point that there are other people who deal with noise every day. Not just the 3 times a month they fly . There are other people in the world too you know. Its not just the mighty 380 drivers who cant get sleep. ( and I am entirely behind the guys as their complaints are justified). A little perspective is always healthy.
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You obviously missed the incident back in october on the 201. (a very hilarious one btw).
It seems that the showers are now under control but the wiring issues however are not solved..
It seems that the showers are now under control but the wiring issues however are not solved..
The issue here is NOISE. Get it?
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The posting of the photo was just a little tongue in cheek humour.
The people who live in those house do so of their own free will.They get their double glazing paid for together with their loft insulation and roofing tiles.Many of the properties are also let out to local workers.
JetPhotos.Net Photo » A6-EDA (CN: 011) Emirates Airbus A380-861 by jetman41
I know the present BA B777's have some noise issue as they are located by the rear of either the First or Club World cabin depending on the variant.It is curtained off but some passengers do still 'sneak' through.The power of the vaccum toilet is nearly enough to pull the First Class duvet clean off!!
WTDWL.
The people who live in those house do so of their own free will.They get their double glazing paid for together with their loft insulation and roofing tiles.Many of the properties are also let out to local workers.
JetPhotos.Net Photo » A6-EDA (CN: 011) Emirates Airbus A380-861 by jetman41
I know the present BA B777's have some noise issue as they are located by the rear of either the First or Club World cabin depending on the variant.It is curtained off but some passengers do still 'sneak' through.The power of the vaccum toilet is nearly enough to pull the First Class duvet clean off!!
WTDWL.
