Frustrated (?) pilots and security screening
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Perhaps there is a lighter side to all of this...
This person has decided to try to make light of the whole idea of the airport security theatre and turn it into perfomance art:
Airport 'X-ray art' courts TSA trouble | NetworkWorld.com Community
Taking this one stage further, an idea for a christmas present
for the frequent fliers would be a light steel sheet with letters made from fridge magnet material (lead foil covered perhaps) so that you could compose your "message of the day" to the baggage screeners...
This person has decided to try to make light of the whole idea of the airport security theatre and turn it into perfomance art:
Airport 'X-ray art' courts TSA trouble | NetworkWorld.com Community
Taking this one stage further, an idea for a christmas present
for the frequent fliers would be a light steel sheet with letters made from fridge magnet material (lead foil covered perhaps) so that you could compose your "message of the day" to the baggage screeners...
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It never ceases to amaze me that some otherwise technically proficient aircrew are as gullible as the general public in believing that airport security offers a defence against terrorists. Do any on this site seriously believe that the boys from Hereford could not get weapons of some kind through security and on to an aircraft; and if they can so can the terrorist.
The only thing preventing a terrorist outrage is the fact that no government will back them with the resources to put together a viable operation for fear of the consequences. The Taliban were the last to offer a safe haven and look where that got them.
The only thing preventing a terrorist outrage is the fact that no government will back them with the resources to put together a viable operation for fear of the consequences. The Taliban were the last to offer a safe haven and look where that got them.
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From another perspective - maybe aircrew should be delighted that the security checks they suffer are so random that there is no pattern for the intending 'terrorists' to follow?
Has to be a bonus surely?
Has to be a bonus surely?
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No matter how random the boys from Hereford will get through. Get 6 pilots together and work out how to get through security. After a couple of hours you would have a viable plan plus several back ups. Don't you think the terrorists would embark on similar exercises?
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One notorious passenger has words about what pax put up with, and what a sham the process is:
Airport security: why it makes grown men cry - Learmount
Airport security: why it makes grown men cry - Learmount
Whilst I hate to quote Mr. 'Aviation' Learmount
... of course, the passenger encounters the ultimate proof of what a charade the overall security policy for airports is once he/she gets airside. You can buy a large glass bottle of duty-free liquor to carry with you. Large glass bottles, as members of street gangs know, when broken are truly fearsome weapons...
plus
..The duplicity of the policymaking government departments who know this full well is absolutely breathtaking...
That's it, in a nutshell, really.
... of course, the passenger encounters the ultimate proof of what a charade the overall security policy for airports is once he/she gets airside. You can buy a large glass bottle of duty-free liquor to carry with you. Large glass bottles, as members of street gangs know, when broken are truly fearsome weapons...
plus
..The duplicity of the policymaking government departments who know this full well is absolutely breathtaking...
That's it, in a nutshell, really.
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Building an Empire
While I agree there is a need for security screening I believe it has gone way over the top for Aircrew.
My take on this is they are 'Building themselves an empire'.
Over the top screening, inciting paranoiya. Over justifying there existance so governments pour more money into their expanding industry.
The head of security for each country and each airport will be on the same level as CEOs salaries.
If their salaries arnt as high as a wide bodied Captains yet, it soon will be.
Check and balances need to be implemented before their empire is too costly for the airline industry to swallow.
Already many airports have a 'security charge' included on every ticket. This charge will only increase to pay the securities 'executives' and middle managements salaries.
As the salaries of airline pilots are reducing, it may be time for me to retire and join the security management where I could earn four times as much as I am as a wide-bodied captain.
My take on this is they are 'Building themselves an empire'.
Over the top screening, inciting paranoiya. Over justifying there existance so governments pour more money into their expanding industry.
The head of security for each country and each airport will be on the same level as CEOs salaries.
If their salaries arnt as high as a wide bodied Captains yet, it soon will be.
Check and balances need to be implemented before their empire is too costly for the airline industry to swallow.
Already many airports have a 'security charge' included on every ticket. This charge will only increase to pay the securities 'executives' and middle managements salaries.
As the salaries of airline pilots are reducing, it may be time for me to retire and join the security management where I could earn four times as much as I am as a wide-bodied captain.
Last edited by Mr Pilot 2007; 12th Oct 2008 at 23:55.
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Airport baggage screener charged with stealing passengers' stuff
Kind of a heads-up.
Airport baggage screener charged with stealing passengers' stuff ? The Register
Airport baggage screener charged with stealing passengers' stuff ? The Register
Published in our local NZ newspaper today - how often have we to repeat the last phrase !!
Anyone who has travelled overseas since 9/11 has been subjected to ever-increasing security checks, writes Claire from St Heliers. "The list includes not leaving your bag unattended and not to carry any bag/object given to you by a stranger. Imagine our shock, horror as we checked into Air NZ at San Francisco for a flight to NZ only to be approached by two elegant, well-spoken women asking if we could take a very large bag back to be given to a relative of theirs on arrival. We refused and told the receptionist at check-in. I don't know what we expected - alarm bells to be rung, security descending on the miscreants who would then be taken away and searched along with their very over-weight bag but no, nothing. Just a raised eyebrow from the receptionist. Airline security is a joke."
Anyone who has travelled overseas since 9/11 has been subjected to ever-increasing security checks, writes Claire from St Heliers. "The list includes not leaving your bag unattended and not to carry any bag/object given to you by a stranger. Imagine our shock, horror as we checked into Air NZ at San Francisco for a flight to NZ only to be approached by two elegant, well-spoken women asking if we could take a very large bag back to be given to a relative of theirs on arrival. We refused and told the receptionist at check-in. I don't know what we expected - alarm bells to be rung, security descending on the miscreants who would then be taken away and searched along with their very over-weight bag but no, nothing. Just a raised eyebrow from the receptionist. Airline security is a joke."
Just been on a short break to Prague. The security check at Prague was polite and efficient but I watched in amazement as the passenger ahead of me had his full bottle of hooch take off him, followed by me that had my shaving foam confiscated.
Can anyone tell me that all the products sold in terminal buildings are "screened"?
I now say that if aliens landed from outer space they would not believe how we now conduct our lives!
Can anyone tell me that all the products sold in terminal buildings are "screened"?
I now say that if aliens landed from outer space they would not believe how we now conduct our lives!
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This thread has been around for some time now, and most of the comment is valid (Parmmo excepted).
Question really is, can it change. Answer, No.
Why not. Well think about it, why is it happening. I think two main reasons:
Too many people are making money from the circus, and
It's a suitable backside covering exercise for politicians.
You might ask could proffesional aircrew influence a change of goverment stance. Answer no.
Why not, again too many people making money, and importantly, no vehicle from which to launch a suitable cohesive process to achieve any worthwhile result.
What do I mean. Well I used to fly in Europe, and was a Balpa member for some time, even was a company rep for a while. It very soon became apparent that those at the top of the Balpa scheme of things have their own agenda, very much their own. One of them is becomming an MEP.
Therefore rocking the boat by representing pilots views on contentious subjects like security would not be in one's own best interests now would it. Much much better to form a "working group" and waste a bit of time and money. Why ?, we are intelligent, and all know what the damn problem is.
One of these gentlemen went as far as to state in a publication that a relaxation in the current security regime would need a more stringent pre airside ID card issue, security check. This was deemed unacceptable as "some current pilots may lose there employment due to not being able to fulfill the more stringent requirement". So when is a security risk a security risk ??. And what do the vast majority of those being hassled by the current regime think of that ?.
I guess that in many other countries where pilots are represented by "proffesionals", the highest levels ( non pilots ) of those organisations have similar sets of problems.
I am no longer a Balpa member, and I really do not believe that the security hassles we face are ever going to change.
In the last 2 weeks both LHR and LAX have been almost farcical, you can only put up with it and laugh afterwards. It is just not worth getting agitated over.
Question really is, can it change. Answer, No.
Why not. Well think about it, why is it happening. I think two main reasons:
Too many people are making money from the circus, and
It's a suitable backside covering exercise for politicians.
You might ask could proffesional aircrew influence a change of goverment stance. Answer no.
Why not, again too many people making money, and importantly, no vehicle from which to launch a suitable cohesive process to achieve any worthwhile result.
What do I mean. Well I used to fly in Europe, and was a Balpa member for some time, even was a company rep for a while. It very soon became apparent that those at the top of the Balpa scheme of things have their own agenda, very much their own. One of them is becomming an MEP.
Therefore rocking the boat by representing pilots views on contentious subjects like security would not be in one's own best interests now would it. Much much better to form a "working group" and waste a bit of time and money. Why ?, we are intelligent, and all know what the damn problem is.
One of these gentlemen went as far as to state in a publication that a relaxation in the current security regime would need a more stringent pre airside ID card issue, security check. This was deemed unacceptable as "some current pilots may lose there employment due to not being able to fulfill the more stringent requirement". So when is a security risk a security risk ??. And what do the vast majority of those being hassled by the current regime think of that ?.
I guess that in many other countries where pilots are represented by "proffesionals", the highest levels ( non pilots ) of those organisations have similar sets of problems.
I am no longer a Balpa member, and I really do not believe that the security hassles we face are ever going to change.
In the last 2 weeks both LHR and LAX have been almost farcical, you can only put up with it and laugh afterwards. It is just not worth getting agitated over.
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where do you draw the line?
Is it 1st Officer and co pilot? Is it head of cabin crew? Is it all cabin crew? Is it the engineer called to sort out your engine problems? Is it the cabin cleaners or the toilet emptier? Is it the refueller?
You have to draw a line somewhere and the line at the moment and for the forseeable future is all persons accessing airside.
As for the earlier quips about strange haircuts on security staff it seems like a throwback to my father and the Beatles haircuts.Fortunately ( or unfortunately for the security industry) we are all different and if someone wants to wear his hair differently to yours why should he be any less intelligent or less equipped to do his job. He should be easier to complain about when he overexercises his authority as he should be easily identifiable.
You have to draw a line somewhere and the line at the moment and for the forseeable future is all persons accessing airside.
As for the earlier quips about strange haircuts on security staff it seems like a throwback to my father and the Beatles haircuts.Fortunately ( or unfortunately for the security industry) we are all different and if someone wants to wear his hair differently to yours why should he be any less intelligent or less equipped to do his job. He should be easier to complain about when he overexercises his authority as he should be easily identifiable.
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is that an admission for where you get your simple minded comments from? i guess its all in the genes....
im not sure if it has been brough up on before, but ive been following this thread for a while now and no one has brough it up. does anyone know what exactly happens to all the stuff that gets taken off us at security check points? would be intresting to find out...
im not sure if it has been brough up on before, but ive been following this thread for a while now and no one has brough it up. does anyone know what exactly happens to all the stuff that gets taken off us at security check points? would be intresting to find out...
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Nashers
Pretty simple really.
All the good stuff like expensive perfumes, aftershaves etc. either gets pocketed by the Security Neanderthals themselves or (as we have seen herein) sold on e-Bay.
All the factory sealed stuff undoubtedly ends up on the shelves of the local 'open all hours' to the mutual financial benefit of all concerned. Who knows? It might even move only a few yards to end up in the air-side shops where flight crew and passengers are expected to replace that which has just been stolen from them at three times the price.
Who says larceny doesn't pay.
All the good stuff like expensive perfumes, aftershaves etc. either gets pocketed by the Security Neanderthals themselves or (as we have seen herein) sold on e-Bay.
All the factory sealed stuff undoubtedly ends up on the shelves of the local 'open all hours' to the mutual financial benefit of all concerned. Who knows? It might even move only a few yards to end up in the air-side shops where flight crew and passengers are expected to replace that which has just been stolen from them at three times the price.
Who says larceny doesn't pay.
Can anyone tell me that all the products sold in terminal buildings are "screened"?
The dubious products they sell landside appear identical in every respect of labelling and bottling to the chemically certified stuff they sell airside.
The miracle of distribution control that allows them to achieve this without any confusion or error is a marvel of the modern age.
Sirs I salute you.
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If you have any evidence that this happens xeque then give it to the airport Police.Another urban myth I fear.
As for the products delivered airside I think you will find they are supplied in the same tamper evident packaging which all other food and drink products are delivered in nowadays. Another urban myth that you can somehow gain access to one bottle of water and place it on the shelves.
As for the products delivered airside I think you will find they are supplied in the same tamper evident packaging which all other food and drink products are delivered in nowadays. Another urban myth that you can somehow gain access to one bottle of water and place it on the shelves.
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If I may add my inane ramblings to this thread.....
has anyone tried to prosecute whatever authorities are responsible for confiscating our highly dangerous bottles of water, for unsafe disposal of hazardous chemicals.
When i worked in a lab , you had very strict guidelines on disposal of hazardous chemicals. Presumably these confiscated items must be treated as hazardous chemicals , because if they weren't hazardous then there would be no need to confiscate.
Big fines for chucking toxic waste in the landfill
has anyone tried to prosecute whatever authorities are responsible for confiscating our highly dangerous bottles of water, for unsafe disposal of hazardous chemicals.
When i worked in a lab , you had very strict guidelines on disposal of hazardous chemicals. Presumably these confiscated items must be treated as hazardous chemicals , because if they weren't hazardous then there would be no need to confiscate.
Big fines for chucking toxic waste in the landfill
where do you draw the line?
I was 'moderated' out - my description of Paarmo was obviously unacceptable. I make no apology.
You 'draw the line' at the Flight Crew, and Engineers. If they can't be trusted to look after their aeroplanes, then we should all go home and contemplate our navels in some cave.
Othewise - wot's the point.
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Wrong paarmo. NOT another urban myth.
My other half who works at LHR was asked if she wanted a Harrods teddy bear from the confiscated bin. The security staff were helping themselves to items at the time.
Reporting security is a waste of time. When she reported security for an inappropriate pat down, the BAA ignored three witnesses and closed ranks. They refused to view the security tapes of the incident because it would apparently infringe the security gnomes Human Rights. This was about a year ago. Several of her colleagues had been asked by this female security gnome to go to a room and open their blouses. The incident that triggered the complaint could only be described as an assault and did not conform to security pat down procedure.
IMO the police should have been called, but then I’m willing to be a right royal pain to any jumped up SOB that believes they can get away with anything.
My other half who works at LHR was asked if she wanted a Harrods teddy bear from the confiscated bin. The security staff were helping themselves to items at the time.
Reporting security is a waste of time. When she reported security for an inappropriate pat down, the BAA ignored three witnesses and closed ranks. They refused to view the security tapes of the incident because it would apparently infringe the security gnomes Human Rights. This was about a year ago. Several of her colleagues had been asked by this female security gnome to go to a room and open their blouses. The incident that triggered the complaint could only be described as an assault and did not conform to security pat down procedure.
IMO the police should have been called, but then I’m willing to be a right royal pain to any jumped up SOB that believes they can get away with anything.