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"Terror In The Skies" ITV 4th June

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"Terror In The Skies" ITV 4th June

Old 5th Jun 2007, 09:00
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A very comprehensive report especially considering the constraints.
Some of it has been plain to see, even to the casual observer.
So what has the DfT been doing.............? Are they not there to uphold and enforce the regulations.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 09:09
  #22 (permalink)  
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See post #244 in the Crew Security thread for the DoT response.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 09:32
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Disgrace at BHX

I was absoulutely appalled and I only caught the last 10 minutes of this programme. As what could only be described as 'spume', these people have no right to be working at an airport. They seemed more akin to an inner city street with their penchant for criminal activity and lack of duty. And as for anyone sticking up for these tedious people by implying its down to the lack of a decent wage. Well thats the biggest load of dross I have ever heard, these fools are at best, a bunch of semi skilled low IQ'd bad eggs who need nothing more than a P45 inserting in their behind. The people who recruit these muppets should also be having a word with themselves .
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 10:14
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I believe you are all being far to hard on thses valiant perveyours of the front line of aviation security. I have just read the back of my toothpaste tube (75ml) and let me tell you there are some damn dangerous chemicals in there! There are more long word on the back of that tiny (75ml in a clear plastic bag to prevent contamination) tube than in Stephen Frys' diary!

Imagine, if you can, the emotional stress of searching and then discovering a 125 ML BOTTLE OF ANTI AGING CREAM!!!! The shock and stress must be what has forced them to drink and drugs.

Instead of shunning our brave, selfless and valient heroes of the security check-in we should immediately set up a welfare system, leaflet campaign and after care councilling. Perhaps an experienced b*llsh*tter to cover the political spin side, Ruth Kelly should do nicely!

Bunch of to88ers, oh well back to the crew aisle for checkin, probably won't be posting for a while!

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Old 5th Jun 2007, 10:20
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For anyone working at any UK airport, the similarities between BHX and anywhere else are all too evident. In this country, we pay more attention to the profit bottom line. Security should be provided by the government. It SHOULD NOT be a profit making enterprise. ICTS like any other of the myriad private enterprises will keep squeezing the operation to gain an extra penny. We use ICTS to provide extra security at MAN and its a similar tale. The airlines are as much to blame. They want the cheapest possible service.
Manchester Airport had its own security highlighted not so long since, again there is a budget involved.

We are one of the most highly taxed nations on earth but our government cannot afford to address serious issues such as security. It can of course give free handouts to just about any immigrant coming here. Priorities? It wouldn't know one if it smacked it in the face. Of course it does know about political correctness and wastage. All aviation security needs to be state run and properly funded. In that way we might start to focus less on flight deck toothpaste and more on proper risk.

The U.S has its own problems, but aviation security is not one of them. When I report for work there, I can at least bring toothpaste, I don't need to remove my shoes and generally the TSA are a much more polite and friendly lot than any of our own shower over here.

The answer to last nights programme goes much higher than just the company involved. It requires a complete shift in governmental policy and outlook. Indeed it throws the whole concept of our welfare state into question.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 10:47
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It is exactly the way they behaved when they thought the public eye was not upon them. They are paid by the airlines and thereby through the ticket price the public to perform an important service which was clearly not being done and being acknowledged as such by their own staff. I would describe any creed, colour or race as such after such a pitiful performance. (called myself it after a particularly stressful sim cx )

Scottish disclosure and the employers of these people need a damn good kick up the backside for allowing some of these people to work in positions of trust in which they are obviously not suited. I was under the impression that that was why we had background security checks. Not to allow a self confessed drug dealer to preach security to our passengers.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 10:52
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If you pay peanuts you get monkeys!

Say no more ...
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 11:38
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Love the squabbling,

Disclosure Scotland provides the majority of airports within the UK with the preliminary background security check required to apply for a job within the restricted area of an airfield.

Most, if not all personell, myself included, have to have this rudimentary background check complete prior to job interview.

If you wish to defend these muppets thats up to you but at least most of us who have to put our lives in the hands of these people can see them for the sham they are.

Please note that that applies ONLY to those who have indited themselves by there own action on the programme last night. Many I have worked with have been extremely good.

Wake up to see the cancer that needs to be cut out before it gives the whole security system a bad name.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 13:04
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Oh you lot are just soooo funny!

Journalists put out a story about airport security, and you lap up every last word of it as gospel truth.

Same journos put out a story about the Sacred Cow of Aviation from a flight deck perspective and it gets shot down in flames like you wouldn't believe.

Double standards? Surely not.

And some people want to put the Government in charge. Great, yet another soaraway success like the Police, Health Service, Education, etc, etc.......
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 14:48
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The flight crew/flight deck has already been through the mill. Dispatches ran a thing a few years ago highlighting some of the down route antics from an insiders point of view.

Working practices were toughened up and a few people lost their jobs.

No point denying it or bleating about it, it was right there on camera. The military had the same, anyone remember 'Brilliant'? The bizarre thing about that 'sensationalistic jorno' piece was that while the old fogeys hated it the RN recruitment went through the roof.

I firmly believe that a few rocks need to be turned in any job to dust in the corners and shake out a few home truths.
Alot of what was shown last night was indeed senationalism and to be honest I can laugh at a guy catching 40 winks and snoring, it does little harm. However, there was one point at which I feel just about everyone watching the program was astounded. That was the part where a security employee detailed how he managed to smuggle a half a kilo of a class A drug into our country! A country where our children get to grow up with the every present drug spectre on the streets. Never should a person like that, a self confessed user of class A drugs and a dealer in the same, be allowed to hold a position of responsibility within ANY organisation. Worse still, the fact that his manager knew of this act and failed to act is a sign of gross misconduct and extremely poor management.

They are the two who should get the boot, the others have already watched their own wake up call and are probably feeling pretty awake today!
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 19:00
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Must say I'm a little surprised at most of the comments here. ICTS provide secondary security functions at BHX, they are not the guys you generally deal with as crew or pax passing through central search.
Obviously much of what was seen and heard- staff not paying attention to baggage passed through 'reject' x-ray system and drink and drug 'findings' are not acceptable.
But, much of what ICTS do in the UK do is provide secondary security to airlines (and contracted by airlines) required by their state regulations. Typical functions , as seen in the programme are guarding aircraft and searching all who enter it. Generally these services are provided to American based airlines and have been for many years - IMHO these requirements have always been ridiculous and pointless. In all the years I worked on the ramp I never witnessed one of these guards finding any reason not to grant staff access to the a/c in question.
I also found the implication that private security firms were to blame for the 911 atrocities shocking - correct me if my memory has got the better of me but weren't all the items used during the hijackings allowed under international regulations at the time?

Don't get me wrong - several scumbags and bad/mal practices were exposed on the programme and I'm glad they were, but I don't think we're at as much risk as the programme makers would have us believe.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 19:40
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You should not believe all the information that was issued about what weapons were used in the 9/11 incidents. There was probably a certain amount of manipulation of the truth to cover the fact that US security was lax, prior to 9/11, on domestic flights as to both what could be carried on, and what could be placed on the aircraft for later use.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 20:13
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It was clear from the program that the audit process (eg testing the security service provided to ensure compliance) wasn't working or if it was the results of the audit were being ignored. As I understand it the airlines pay for the security that featured in the program. I suspect this is at the root of the problem - Airlines don't want passengers inconvenienced and planes delayed by security searches so they have no real incentive to audit properly. They just care about what they are charged to supply the minimium legal standard. Sounds like someone else should be doing the auditing. Time for a regulator to step in if there isn't one already.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 20:39
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Completely innocently I carried one of those plastic cigarette lighters filled with butane through security at Manchester, Barbados (twice), Kingston Jamaica, Montego Bay, back to Barbados and finally to Manchester and it was never spotted.

I don't smoke but my partner had put it in my hand luggage with the intention of using it landside then disposing of it. Completely forgot about it in a side compartment of the bag!!!

Now we had perfume confiscated in Barbados and Jamaica which we know was sold on the black market ('customs' officials seen dividing the spoils in the womens' toilets), our bags opened and possessions robbed in Barbados and Puerta Plata, but the one item which could have caused a nasty incident was never noticed.

I feel bad about admitting we took this lighter on board, but it serves to prove the point.

Incidentally, a few weeks ago one of those lighters started leaking butane in our lounge. It just brought home how dangerous they can be!

As someone mentioned earlier, in MAN the airport authority decided to reduce security costs by cutting the wages. There was a hue and cry at the time.

But I know it's easy to bring drugs etc into the country (not personally I hasten to add!!!). Lots of people do it every day and they're never detected. It's a sham.

I know of drug squad officers who smoke 'weed', so who cares anyway?!

C'est la vie!

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Old 5th Jun 2007, 21:21
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The finger must also be pointed at the head of 'security' at BHX. This person has failed spectacularly to perform in their duty. They have not properly excercised a system of quality control. Irrespective of which outsourced company is actually performing the task of security, it should be being done to the standards laid down locally by... the head of BHX 'security.'
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 22:24
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Firstly I think it is unfair to tar every ICTS employee with the same brush, I am sure there are still people who take pride in there work and had nothing to do with the featured cowboys.

Secondly ICTS do and have for at least a month provide front line security at BHX! Interestingly today were refusing to allow anyone to take digital cameras through staff gate!
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 22:37
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Travelled with a pocket knife (approx. 7cm blade I'd guess) in my photo backpack on seven flights in 2006, airports included LHR, ZRH, STN, FAO and CAG (Cagliari). Staff was always that focused on my lenses (I'm hiding explosives in them after all ), they never ought to check the pockets. Got it taken away by the officers at Cagliari on the 7th flight finally, was interesting ( and shocking !!! ) to see how often I was able to take it onboard.
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 22:49
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I certainly won't be carrying any rush bags for anyone that's for sure.

You KNOW when you are carrying Rush Bags.?? How.??
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Old 5th Jun 2007, 23:03
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BHX Today

Red Wing's re Digital Camera's they have always refused to allow people to take these through unless you have a permit to do so, took mine through earlier, was asked to show pass & then let through . No Problems.

Interestingly saw 3 of the people who were shown on the prog last night, still at work. 1 of whom was filmed flat out, was on the Int Pier reading a paper (will they never learn!!). also heard that staff coming in on the bus seemed pleased that more did not come out about what go's on, the mind boggles???????????
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Old 6th Jun 2007, 00:31
  #40 (permalink)  
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I certainly won't be carrying any rush bags for anyone that's for sure.

You KNOW when you are carrying Rush Bags.?? How.??
I guess, when he has to sign the Rush Bag manifest that tells him what method was used to screen the bags, the number and rush tag numbers etc.

or what were you implying?
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