ATC... Bollockings for all
Join Date: Dec 2003
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Ha ha,
i still don't have a clue to be honest even with the addition of no one likes you. You mentioned in a post from Dec 06 that you were flightdeck but got involved in CC recruitment. Was that a slight fib on your part.
Rgds.
i still don't have a clue to be honest even with the addition of no one likes you. You mentioned in a post from Dec 06 that you were flightdeck but got involved in CC recruitment. Was that a slight fib on your part.
Rgds.
Join Date: Jun 2004
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Funny old thing.
There I was, along with many others on here who start a normal discussion involving a perceived flight safety issue and now it turns out it was ' just a good old wind up'. Well blow me down with a feather. I thought for a minute it might have involved peoples lives so i'll step down from my sanctimonious high horse and stick with Jet Blast. That's where the real jokes are, eh? Why does that always seem to happen when somebody finally realises the majority view is against them.
Come on out to the Middle East Mr. Monarch Man. Face saving has been perfected off to a fine art out here! You'll fit in just great.
There I was, along with many others on here who start a normal discussion involving a perceived flight safety issue and now it turns out it was ' just a good old wind up'. Well blow me down with a feather. I thought for a minute it might have involved peoples lives so i'll step down from my sanctimonious high horse and stick with Jet Blast. That's where the real jokes are, eh? Why does that always seem to happen when somebody finally realises the majority view is against them.
Come on out to the Middle East Mr. Monarch Man. Face saving has been perfected off to a fine art out here! You'll fit in just great.
Come on out to the Middle East Mr. Monarch Man. Face saving has been perfected off to a fine art out here! You'll fit in just great.
You can keep the mideast, as it happens EK turned me down, something
to do with poor R/T standards and a lack of airmanship.
still don't have a clue to be honest even with the addition of no one likes you. You mentioned in a post from Dec 06 that you were flightdeck but got involved in CC recruitment.
Last edited by Monarch Man; 1st Mar 2007 at 23:00.
Join Date: Oct 2001
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...And add circuit direction
APE got it right!
Wonder what Monarch Man would make of a Mil Airfield that told him to join 24 right HAND?
And, come to think of it, how would he handle VFR circuit joining instructions to a parallel runway situation (if the mil ever got a place with parallels!) “join, 24 Right, right hand, QFE etc”.
On another thought; picture the scene with a 24L, right hand!
For the avoidance of doubt, I am being mischievous.
Wonder what Monarch Man would make of a Mil Airfield that told him to join 24 right HAND?
And, come to think of it, how would he handle VFR circuit joining instructions to a parallel runway situation (if the mil ever got a place with parallels!) “join, 24 Right, right hand, QFE etc”.
On another thought; picture the scene with a 24L, right hand!
For the avoidance of doubt, I am being mischievous.
One thought for Monarch Man. There is no such thing as anonymity on the net, just varying degrees of effort & skill to discover who and where you are.
If he does work for Monarch, he knows how good the IT Department is, so either way, he's unlikely to be worried!
from MM,
Phraseology is not the big safety net people seem to be convinced of
Odd use of english I know; however, every little helps and correct phraseology can help avoid confusion which on the whole can't be bad thing.
Nor can a little refresher every now and then, just to remind oneself what correct phraseology is (it does change sometimes.)
Phraseology is not the big safety net people seem to be convinced of
Odd use of english I know; however, every little helps and correct phraseology can help avoid confusion which on the whole can't be bad thing.
Nor can a little refresher every now and then, just to remind oneself what correct phraseology is (it does change sometimes.)
Join Date: Dec 2004
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If he doesn't work for Monarch, he doesn't have to worry.
I've only made a few posts so I don't feel the need to order a Personal Title and help support PPRuNe
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This really is getting pathetic. Keep going guys. I reckon less than 24 hours to getting this thread shut down with all that anonymous bravado. I'm sure Monarch are really worried that some anonymous PPruner is not going to fly with them because of his paranoia over someones user name. 
The Analog Kid
Join Date: Aug 2004
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You reckon, Cargo Boy? A quick trawl of El Reg throws up:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/10...blog_grounded/
along with a variety of similar stories.
Personally I find MM's "refuse to stop digging until I have to use the wind-up defence" attitude scary enough. We don't have standard RT in paragliding but even there people have learnt that sloppiness literally kills. Anyone with even the remotest understanding of how the brain works can see through the "there's only one ILS" argument in a split second.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/10...blog_grounded/
along with a variety of similar stories.
Personally I find MM's "refuse to stop digging until I have to use the wind-up defence" attitude scary enough. We don't have standard RT in paragliding but even there people have learnt that sloppiness literally kills. Anyone with even the remotest understanding of how the brain works can see through the "there's only one ILS" argument in a split second.
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Wake up a bit guys....you are dealing with a wind-up merchant.
For your info, since June 2006 when this "Monarch Man" registered, there is not one single entry in the private monarch forum from this character....which with a mouth as large as his, is somewhat unusual is it not?
This thread is ridiculous and I'm suprised it hasn't been locked by now as you all plainly aren't interested in the topic title - just tit for tat one-upmanships.
Grow up guys.
For your info, since June 2006 when this "Monarch Man" registered, there is not one single entry in the private monarch forum from this character....which with a mouth as large as his, is somewhat unusual is it not?
This thread is ridiculous and I'm suprised it hasn't been locked by now as you all plainly aren't interested in the topic title - just tit for tat one-upmanships.
Grow up guys.
Given MM seems to be on here every two minutes, I doubt whether he is even a pilot, certainly can't fly much.
If he is with MON, then it does make you think twice about booking to fly with his outfit.
If he is with MON, then it does make you think twice about booking to fly with his outfit.
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Man Tower
Quote:
As of 7th July 2007, Manchester Airport's runway assignments will be changed in relation to the Magnetic Compass bearings. The current headings for the runways are 054° and 234° with assignments 06L/24R and 06R/24L respectively (11/1/07). The new runway changes will mean the new assignments will be 05L/23R and 05R/23L respectively.
Guess dummies & toys will really get thrown out of the pram when this is implemented
Tower "Cowboy 555 cleared to cross 23Right at Golf one and hold at Victor one"
Cowboy 555 "OK"
Tower "Cowboy 555 please read back your crossing clearance"
Cowboy 555 "No, stop being petty"
Tower "
"!!!
As of 7th July 2007, Manchester Airport's runway assignments will be changed in relation to the Magnetic Compass bearings. The current headings for the runways are 054° and 234° with assignments 06L/24R and 06R/24L respectively (11/1/07). The new runway changes will mean the new assignments will be 05L/23R and 05R/23L respectively.
Guess dummies & toys will really get thrown out of the pram when this is implemented
Tower "Cowboy 555 cleared to cross 23Right at Golf one and hold at Victor one"
Cowboy 555 "OK"
Tower "Cowboy 555 please read back your crossing clearance"
Cowboy 555 "No, stop being petty"
Tower "
"!!!
Join Date: Mar 2005
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If you do get some leave or time off to reflect on your standards of CRM, you may wish to look at the following link: http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP413.PDF
Happy bedtime reading!
Happy bedtime reading!
aka Capt PPRuNe
Join Date: May 1995
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Unfortunately too many posters on this thread appear to miss the point of someone playing the devils advocate and really do appear to take some of it too seriously. It also appears to me that a lot of those that are getting quite upset on this thread are, but not exclusively so, not professional pilots or ATC people.
In view of the amount of upset that the interdiction by non-professionals has had on a few of the more easily upset professionals, I think that it is probably time to put this thread to bed. Having operated in and out of Manchester for well over ten years, all I can say is that they are a fine bunch of controllers and always enjoyed expeditious arrivals when arriving from the west. If they've decided to have a crackdown on non standard or irregular RT then good luck to them. It never hurts to be reminded from time to time about the correct way to say something.
Why so many on here should get so upset about it though, I have no idea. Is it only me that has noticed a marked improvement from some of the US carriers pilots that operate into MAN in their RT? Perhaps all that repetition until they get it right does work after all.
Before I make a final decision on whether this thread really should close, perhaps some of the pedants who have taken so much umbrage on here should spend a bit more time in the USA at the busiest airports and listen to how they manage to move so much heavy metal around without them all coming into physical contact with each other or falling out of the sky. I'm not condoning the fact that there is a definite lack of standardisation in the USA but some posters on here would have us believe that the perfectionism that they crave when it comes to RT must be observed by everyone else or else there will be a big disaster. It just ain't so.
In view of the amount of upset that the interdiction by non-professionals has had on a few of the more easily upset professionals, I think that it is probably time to put this thread to bed. Having operated in and out of Manchester for well over ten years, all I can say is that they are a fine bunch of controllers and always enjoyed expeditious arrivals when arriving from the west. If they've decided to have a crackdown on non standard or irregular RT then good luck to them. It never hurts to be reminded from time to time about the correct way to say something.
Why so many on here should get so upset about it though, I have no idea. Is it only me that has noticed a marked improvement from some of the US carriers pilots that operate into MAN in their RT? Perhaps all that repetition until they get it right does work after all.
Before I make a final decision on whether this thread really should close, perhaps some of the pedants who have taken so much umbrage on here should spend a bit more time in the USA at the busiest airports and listen to how they manage to move so much heavy metal around without them all coming into physical contact with each other or falling out of the sky. I'm not condoning the fact that there is a definite lack of standardisation in the USA but some posters on here would have us believe that the perfectionism that they crave when it comes to RT must be observed by everyone else or else there will be a big disaster. It just ain't so.
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Just a quick minor hijack:
CAP413: "Runway 24R cleared to land c/s".
Back to topic... Personally, as a GA wannabe doing ATPL groundschool, I've got enough time in my life to add a runway designator if required.
I always thought the reply to a clearance to land was not 'cleared to land callsign xxx' but ' Land 24R Callsign xxx'
Perhaps someone might confirm
Perhaps someone might confirm
Back to topic... Personally, as a GA wannabe doing ATPL groundschool, I've got enough time in my life to add a runway designator if required.
Speaking as an individual who is in reality, a bit of a pragmatist, a student of flight safety, and on a personal level, someone with a passion for getting things right, I feel an explanation for my position is required.
First and foremost, I will happily hold my hand up and say that I have deliberately played the devils advocate. The thread topic in itself had already elicited some emotive responses before I contributed, and along the way I made various representations from a personal perspective. Again however I must reiterate that these are personal opinions and not the position of the company that bears part of my user name.
There are those of you on here that have been particularly vitriolic in your condemnation of my comments, I can only conclude that whilst your views are in contravention of mine, they have served to highlight certain common misconceptions of the processes that we utilize to improve flight safety, and as a general observation, miss the opportunity to view "bigger picture".
Danny eloquently makes his point, you may not think that certain area's are open for debate, but if you close your mind to the fact that we can learn from other methods and ideas, then we are consigning ourselves to mediocrity.
Who says we do things in the UK better and safer than anywhere else?
That is my final contribution to this thread, and I have to say I am disappointed by several posters on here who chose to send me personally insulting private messages.
First and foremost, I will happily hold my hand up and say that I have deliberately played the devils advocate. The thread topic in itself had already elicited some emotive responses before I contributed, and along the way I made various representations from a personal perspective. Again however I must reiterate that these are personal opinions and not the position of the company that bears part of my user name.
There are those of you on here that have been particularly vitriolic in your condemnation of my comments, I can only conclude that whilst your views are in contravention of mine, they have served to highlight certain common misconceptions of the processes that we utilize to improve flight safety, and as a general observation, miss the opportunity to view "bigger picture".
Danny eloquently makes his point, you may not think that certain area's are open for debate, but if you close your mind to the fact that we can learn from other methods and ideas, then we are consigning ourselves to mediocrity.
Who says we do things in the UK better and safer than anywhere else?
That is my final contribution to this thread, and I have to say I am disappointed by several posters on here who chose to send me personally insulting private messages.
thanks