easyJet Recrutment
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I think the ATP Accademy is a disgrace, the briefing for the sim ride is non-existent and the way they used to fleece the wannabees in the old days is something to believed.
I really can't believe that the airlines still use them, they really arew the old boys network justifying their existence and I really pity anybody having to be sent there to have to get a job.
I really can't believe that the airlines still use them, they really arew the old boys network justifying their existence and I really pity anybody having to be sent there to have to get a job.
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A question from a non-pilot. I take it that the sims was carried out by FlightSafetyBoeing at Luton. Are the examiners and instructors employees of easyjet or FlightSafetyBoeing?
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: LTN man ]
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: LTN man ]
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: LTN man ]
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: LTN man ]
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ltn man wrong! they are out of house instructors of a fixed base sim in Southampton a company called ATP. They have this simulator set to STUN, impossible to fly properly, 45 minute raw data mini OPC. Myself and a colleague from Europe B737 qualified 2000 hours on type and myself 757/767 were the only two in the morning (combined total hours 10000hours) yes and we can fly aeroplanes , the two canditates in the afternoon also lucked out.Both of us flew ok but a little scrappy in parts but YOU could not trim the bitch!! After the sim ride they did not talk to us they disappeared in another room with security locking and left us to find our own way out.Finished the day before at Luton at 6pm all was good , thumbs up to the EASYJET part of the recruitment very professional, however
Friday afternoon 6.30 pm M1,M25 yes you can picture it we arrived in Southampton 10.30pm started studying the profiles 11pm bed at 3 am could not keep my eyes open any more. Up at 7.30am sim at 8 am. Absolute bollocks!! Good luck to Easyjet if they keep using these clowns as part of their recruiting. They should be using their own check captains to asses pilots not some crusty BA haz beens who think they are Gods gift to aviation and therefore everybody must fly the crapped out sim to perfection!!These guys at the end of the day DO NOT know what Easyjets' requirements are, only the training captains do.Anyway commiserations to everyone on my day and to you all, at least I have a good job (even though i will be an old man before i see a left hand seat.) Easyjet if you are watching ****CAN these morons and do the assesments yourself otherwise your expansion plans are null and void.Good luck to all who are successful as i am sure there will be.
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: lets go nads ]
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: lets go nads ]
Friday afternoon 6.30 pm M1,M25 yes you can picture it we arrived in Southampton 10.30pm started studying the profiles 11pm bed at 3 am could not keep my eyes open any more. Up at 7.30am sim at 8 am. Absolute bollocks!! Good luck to Easyjet if they keep using these clowns as part of their recruiting. They should be using their own check captains to asses pilots not some crusty BA haz beens who think they are Gods gift to aviation and therefore everybody must fly the crapped out sim to perfection!!These guys at the end of the day DO NOT know what Easyjets' requirements are, only the training captains do.Anyway commiserations to everyone on my day and to you all, at least I have a good job (even though i will be an old man before i see a left hand seat.) Easyjet if you are watching ****CAN these morons and do the assesments yourself otherwise your expansion plans are null and void.Good luck to all who are successful as i am sure there will be.
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: lets go nads ]
[ 09 August 2001: Message edited by: lets go nads ]
Lets Go Nads,
That is identical to the guys I know who have been to the chop ride session. Totally shattered by the time comes to fly the box, having had no time to learn the power settings etc for the profiles, immediately followed by arrogant ex-BA God of Aviation!!!
Not really much of a chance eh???
EasyJet if you are viewing this thread... lose the crusty old b*ggers at SOU and do it yourself. You'll get the right candidates for the job, and probably not waste so much money chopping guys who are without doubt perfectly qualified for your requirements.
That is identical to the guys I know who have been to the chop ride session. Totally shattered by the time comes to fly the box, having had no time to learn the power settings etc for the profiles, immediately followed by arrogant ex-BA God of Aviation!!!
Not really much of a chance eh???
EasyJet if you are viewing this thread... lose the crusty old b*ggers at SOU and do it yourself. You'll get the right candidates for the job, and probably not waste so much money chopping guys who are without doubt perfectly qualified for your requirements.
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Gypsy....Sorry but it IS true, have just spoken to two very experienced guys who were chopped on Saturday. One flew a two hour detail, the other, a one hour forty five minutes detail, these guys are very sharp one of them scored the highest ever score recorded at Easy during the assessments....something stinks... I will be temporarily withdrawing my application until it returns to in-house.
Any one from Easy management care to comment.
Any one from Easy management care to comment.
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Surly easyjet should at least have a member of their flight deck monitoring the proceeding, then at least there will be a fair assment as to what their requirements are!
I heard one of the Captains evolved has the highest score on the current format for the aptitude tests that they have had, if this is the case then again what exactly is easy looking for? By the way Assment is spelt the way I mean it!!!
I heard one of the Captains evolved has the highest score on the current format for the aptitude tests that they have had, if this is the case then again what exactly is easy looking for? By the way Assment is spelt the way I mean it!!!
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I did a successful check for Easy before Christmas. It was at Burgess Hill and was a fairly pleasant experience! The instructor was from Storm Aviation. Seems to have all gone a bit wrong lately. I know the two guys concerned in this thread very well and all things being equal, if they can't pass such an assessment then nobody from their airline will. Looks like the BFS base will take a lot longer to set up than EASY thought.
Just another number
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roland
I was very sorry to hear about your problem. All airlines, as well as monitoring the performance of their pilots, also keep a close eye on their instructors and checkers. Several UK airlines use computer based records, where the average grades awarded by each individual instructor can be monitored. If it is noticed that one particular instructor seems to always be rostered with below average pupils, then the situation can be investigated. Regular standards checks are also carried out on all instructors.
However, the situation is not quite so straightforward when an outside agency is used for either training or checking. After a while, the airline gets to know the strengths and weaknesses of the agencies' instructors, but it is very difficult to do anything about it. I can assure you that it won't take long for Easyjet to get this guys number, if in fact it is he who has the problem.
I suggest that you write to Easyjet and explain exactly what went on. However, I suggest that you avoid any emotive language, and do not blame anyone else for your problems. I have met some of their senior trainers and they are a very professional group of people who, I'm sure, will listen to reason.
Best Wishes
Airclues
[ 10 August 2001: Message edited by: Captain Airclues ]
I was very sorry to hear about your problem. All airlines, as well as monitoring the performance of their pilots, also keep a close eye on their instructors and checkers. Several UK airlines use computer based records, where the average grades awarded by each individual instructor can be monitored. If it is noticed that one particular instructor seems to always be rostered with below average pupils, then the situation can be investigated. Regular standards checks are also carried out on all instructors.
However, the situation is not quite so straightforward when an outside agency is used for either training or checking. After a while, the airline gets to know the strengths and weaknesses of the agencies' instructors, but it is very difficult to do anything about it. I can assure you that it won't take long for Easyjet to get this guys number, if in fact it is he who has the problem.
I suggest that you write to Easyjet and explain exactly what went on. However, I suggest that you avoid any emotive language, and do not blame anyone else for your problems. I have met some of their senior trainers and they are a very professional group of people who, I'm sure, will listen to reason.
Best Wishes
Airclues
[ 10 August 2001: Message edited by: Captain Airclues ]
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I have recently completed my type conversion course with easyJet. I found the training, both with The ATP Academy and easyJet, was generally carried out to a very high standard.
Having read the previous posts submitted by those pilots who were not successful at the simulator assessment stage, it seems that a general lack of suitable preparation and understanding of the exercise may have been a contributory factor.
easyJet do not assess flying ability in isolation at the simulator stage. The company has a limited time to assess flying ability, CRM and general airmanship during the exercise, all of which are applicable to the safe operation of their aircraft.
These facts were made clear to me by other pilots who had previously undertaken the simulator assessment .
A few simple tips:
Learn the profiles - there is no time at the pre-simulator briefing to digest all the information if you do not already understand the principles (it is not for me to tell you where to find the information. If you are serious about a career with this airline you will find it out for yourself, as I did)
If you have a long way to travel, use your common sense - stay in a local hotel the night before. £50.00 in hotel bills is a small price to pay when set against the chance of a career flying jet aircraft.
Do not think that low-cost = low quality and that you will 'fly' through the sim. check. Although the exercise was carried out (by an easyJet training captain) in a relaxed manner, they do expect a good standard of operation. Naturally, if you have not flown a swept wing aircraft before some allowance will be made - it was in my case.
There are no tricks in the selection procedure (in my experience), but easyJet expect you to be as professional in your preparation and performance as they are in their assessment of your ability.
This is my own brief opinion, take it or leave it. However I do now have the B737-300/800 on my licence.
Good luck to you all!
Having read the previous posts submitted by those pilots who were not successful at the simulator assessment stage, it seems that a general lack of suitable preparation and understanding of the exercise may have been a contributory factor.
easyJet do not assess flying ability in isolation at the simulator stage. The company has a limited time to assess flying ability, CRM and general airmanship during the exercise, all of which are applicable to the safe operation of their aircraft.
These facts were made clear to me by other pilots who had previously undertaken the simulator assessment .
A few simple tips:
Learn the profiles - there is no time at the pre-simulator briefing to digest all the information if you do not already understand the principles (it is not for me to tell you where to find the information. If you are serious about a career with this airline you will find it out for yourself, as I did)
If you have a long way to travel, use your common sense - stay in a local hotel the night before. £50.00 in hotel bills is a small price to pay when set against the chance of a career flying jet aircraft.
Do not think that low-cost = low quality and that you will 'fly' through the sim. check. Although the exercise was carried out (by an easyJet training captain) in a relaxed manner, they do expect a good standard of operation. Naturally, if you have not flown a swept wing aircraft before some allowance will be made - it was in my case.
There are no tricks in the selection procedure (in my experience), but easyJet expect you to be as professional in your preparation and performance as they are in their assessment of your ability.
This is my own brief opinion, take it or leave it. However I do now have the B737-300/800 on my licence.
Good luck to you all!
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Katy, a word of warning to you!! Be careful with what you say. I think that people prepare in a variety of ways for interviews and sim rides. Some more efficiently than others. No doubt some of your points are valid, however so are those of some of the aggrieved. YOUR lack of experience MAY have been an advantage to you more than you can imagine, as the expectation of the examiner is certainly far lower. To then conclude that the other guys must have failed in other areas too is rather judgemental for somebody of your low experience. No, I am not a failed Easyjet applicant. Thankfully I have an excellent job with a major carrier. My post is merely to say that during the different interviews I went to for a variety of airlines, I saw an amazing difference of requirements, aptitude tests, skill tests and interview questions, and that NO airline can say it gets the right people for the job over 50% of the time.
Well done to anyone just hired, and good luck and keep trying everything you can to everyone else!
Well done to anyone just hired, and good luck and keep trying everything you can to everyone else!
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Big Buddha,
I was one of those wannabees and like many others I do not feel as if the ATP Academy took advantage. A type rating plus a jet job without having to put my hand in my pocket I can't see what is wrong about that?!
6 months on a reduced salary for all the above is a small price to pay.
Bokkie449.
I was one of those wannabees and like many others I do not feel as if the ATP Academy took advantage. A type rating plus a jet job without having to put my hand in my pocket I can't see what is wrong about that?!
6 months on a reduced salary for all the above is a small price to pay.
Bokkie449.
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Guys,
I have also recently gone on line at Easy. My sim was done at East Midlands (Coalville) by a very nice guy from Storm Aviation. All very laid back and informal - I recall he said he was there to 'get us the job, not stop us getting the job'. I am sorry to hear so many people are not happy with the set up down at the ATP Academy. My course completed groundschool and fixed base sim there and I have to say it was first class training all the way. The fixed base sim is
probably not the best place to assess someone for employment - it cerainly does not behave like the full sim - but that's a fixed base sim for you! I agree with the comments above re booking accomodation prior to a sim ride. I booked in at a Travelodge on the M1 as my report was 0500......
Perhaps the management should review using a fixed base sim for assessments - there are obviously a lot of experienced people not happy with it. Best of luck to all trying to get into Easyjet - it will not suit the moaners and groaners but from what I can see it's going to be a major player in Europe and so far, I am impressed.
[ 10 August 2001: Message edited by: Stabtrim ]
I have also recently gone on line at Easy. My sim was done at East Midlands (Coalville) by a very nice guy from Storm Aviation. All very laid back and informal - I recall he said he was there to 'get us the job, not stop us getting the job'. I am sorry to hear so many people are not happy with the set up down at the ATP Academy. My course completed groundschool and fixed base sim there and I have to say it was first class training all the way. The fixed base sim is
probably not the best place to assess someone for employment - it cerainly does not behave like the full sim - but that's a fixed base sim for you! I agree with the comments above re booking accomodation prior to a sim ride. I booked in at a Travelodge on the M1 as my report was 0500......
Perhaps the management should review using a fixed base sim for assessments - there are obviously a lot of experienced people not happy with it. Best of luck to all trying to get into Easyjet - it will not suit the moaners and groaners but from what I can see it's going to be a major player in Europe and so far, I am impressed.
[ 10 August 2001: Message edited by: Stabtrim ]
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Katy, you have some valid points, however, if you read the original post carefully I think you'll find they are not relevant to this particular thread.Also, Easyjet have now changed their selection procedure markedly from when you and I went through it.
I also have no problem with the ATP Academy..been there, done that. It would appear the finger is pointing towards a renegade instructor.
I also have no problem with the ATP Academy..been there, done that. It would appear the finger is pointing towards a renegade instructor.
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Oh dear, cannot resist this one.
Carlos Vandango says he has no problem with the ATP Academy, then:
I too would put my hand up to having in the past had no problems whatsoever with this organisation. In fact, I would describe it as operating at the very highest standards possible. The fact that one of its checkers might appear to some to be too harsh, or even not particularly friendly, is of no consequence whatsoever. High standards are essential in our industry, and high standards are certainly required at ATP. There should be many more ATP Academies everywhere. Our industry would be so much the better for it. Well done to CC and his team. More power to you all, and keep up the excellent work.
Carlos Vandango says he has no problem with the ATP Academy, then:
It would appear the finger is pointing towards a renegade instructor.
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I cannot believe that the Sim ride was so long for a non type rated person. I did mine back in Oct with a EZY TRE at Coalville (EMA).
I got airborne, flew about for a couple of minutes to get a bit of a feel, then some GH, climb, turns, changes of speed and configuration, then climbing/decending turns combined with IAS changes. We then did a procedural ILS to go arround. Then a 'no drills' engine failure. At that point I got the flight director back (all raw data until then) for a procedural ILS to land.
It was pretty demanding but not impossible even for someone like me who had never sat in a Boeing before. They want people to pass but a decent standard of basic flying skill is essential.
Regarding the B737 procedures trainer at Marchwood used by ATP Academy, I cannot believe that it could be used to assess any kind of handling skill. It was'nt that great as a proc trainer. It was designed to train in basic procedures and in automatic flight, never handling.
Hopefully EZY is not loosing good guys through bad assessing. We need good people.
Generally, sounds like I agree with Stabtrim!
[ 11 August 2001: Message edited by: Mr Moustache ]
I got airborne, flew about for a couple of minutes to get a bit of a feel, then some GH, climb, turns, changes of speed and configuration, then climbing/decending turns combined with IAS changes. We then did a procedural ILS to go arround. Then a 'no drills' engine failure. At that point I got the flight director back (all raw data until then) for a procedural ILS to land.
It was pretty demanding but not impossible even for someone like me who had never sat in a Boeing before. They want people to pass but a decent standard of basic flying skill is essential.
Regarding the B737 procedures trainer at Marchwood used by ATP Academy, I cannot believe that it could be used to assess any kind of handling skill. It was'nt that great as a proc trainer. It was designed to train in basic procedures and in automatic flight, never handling.
Hopefully EZY is not loosing good guys through bad assessing. We need good people.
Generally, sounds like I agree with Stabtrim!
[ 11 August 2001: Message edited by: Mr Moustache ]
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Ah, the execrable tilii returns. You know, the one who recently said:
What a pity he is not a man of his word!!!
I do not wish to participate on this site and will now remove it from my computer.
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In many instances personality factors, demeanor and appearance play a larger role in recruiters' minds than pure flying skills.
Obviously an explanation of why lesser experienced pilots get hired.
Been there, done that.
Obviously an explanation of why lesser experienced pilots get hired.
Been there, done that.
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Raw Data
What I actually said was:
And your immediate reply included the following:
So much then for men who keep their words.
[ 11 August 2001: Message edited by: tilii ]
What I actually said was:
While the likes of Raw Data and The Guvnor are permitted to constantly debase any reasoned discourse, I do not wish to participate on this site and will now remove it from my computer.
Tell you what tilii, and I'm being serious now, shall we start again, this time promising not to lower ourselves to insulting each other, but stick to reasoned debate? We could even agree to disagree like adults. It's a brave new world!!!
As I obviously got to you, I apologise unreservedly for my terminology and inference. I'm sure you're a nice chap really. Buy you a beer sometime?
As I obviously got to you, I apologise unreservedly for my terminology and inference. I'm sure you're a nice chap really. Buy you a beer sometime?
[ 11 August 2001: Message edited by: tilii ]