GA helicopters.
 

hi my first post on the rotorheads,
6 months ago I sold my lovely airplane, since that time I have flown quite often on helicopters. Now I'm looking into training on an helicopters but there are something that stop me.
Is there any member of the forum that fly helicopters just for leisure? what is the tipically type of flying ? Local bimble or tuoring? On longer touring is there any differance from a fixed wing flying at the same speed?

There are many helicopter pilots on here with private licences and the type of flying largely depends on whether the aircraft is hired from a local school, whether the pilot is hour building for commercial licences, or whether they own their own aircraft.

You don't say where you're based - the training varies from country to country.

On the whole, helicopters tend to be a bit slower than fixed wing so if long tours is what you're after, you'd probably need to have your own helicopter.

Cheers

Whirls

Sorry I always forget that, il live in Buckinghamshire not so far from wycombe.

I fly helicopters just for fun and it is great. I had a fixed wing licence and kept both licences current for a while but one day realised that helicopters have so much more to offer.

Yes, I know they they do go a bit slower ( my R44 can only manage 112kts!) and they do not have the range (after 2.5hrs in most helicopters you want to take a break anyway) but the big advantage is that you can, in many cases, go direct to your destination and not to a nearby airfield and then get a taxi.
I have flown through the Swiss Alps, countless times to France, and a few times to Germany and Belgium as well as much of the UK.

From High Wycombe you could be down in, say, Rock/Padstow/Eden Project in Cornwall in about 1 hour 40 minutes in an R44.

Helicopter pilots are generally a very sociable bunch and new recruits are always welcome.

Helicopters are simply GREAT!!! :ok: this is my first post on PPrune!!! I'm an Italian ATP Student Pilot...Planes are fantastic but i think helicopters have an edge over!!! :P...Of course they have some "little" problems in range :} ...but if u fly whit an helicopter u can see things that u don't see on a plane...Remember...XD u can do hovering!!!..
After said that...I LOVE ALL flying machines... Bye ALL

At the risk of starting a flame war I would venture to say that I am not sure that an helicopter can be securely flown as a leisure... At least that was my conclusion after approx 500 piston hours within 8 years. No major accident or even incident but it's such a demanding occupation if you really care to do it right...

Yes....u have right...there a lot of risk in a heli single engine piston...more than an airplane... :P...mmm I don t know...because I think they are on the same level (whit engine emergency :P), planes have space problem...helicopters have time problem...but all machines have "good and bad" side...

Why's that then? Is a 250 hour commercial pilot less likely to have an accident than a 1,000 hour private pilot? As long as a pilot is properly trained and has the right attitude (pun intended), then there is no reason why a private pilot can't fly just as safely.

Cheers

Whirls

Well for me it just took too much of my time and intellect to be considered as a hobby. There is no place for casual flying in these machines - it's either 100% commitment or nothing. Not that I did not enjoy it but at the end of the day was either pro or not at all. Personally flying a nice GA plane is much easier - although there is obviously no more place for contemplacy.
Just my 2c

I am a PPL and I find the 100% committment / involvement one of the most enjoyable elements of hobby flying. I can certainly guarantee not to be thinking about the day job when flying.

Many people ride motorcycles for leisure, and less than 100% concentration is more likely to end badly (in my view) than almost any other activity.

Hobby flying from Redhill base: sometimes I just go up for an hour or so to practice. Trips to Weston Heli day, Hull (landed in the garden of the hotel for a 2 day visit), Cholmondly Pagent of Power (Cheshire). I intend to run up to the Scottish Highlands next year - let planning commence!

John

All,

Why exactly can't you fly a helicopter purely for fun/leisure? I own a Jet Ranger, fly approximately 4 times each end every week, and although a lot of my trips are business related, they are not commercial trips.

I would venture to say that I am far more experienced and 'qualified' than some CPL pilots who don't fly regularly enough or undertake the type of trips that I do.

Joel:ok:

I wonder if this thread got off on the wrong tack. Perhaps flying helicopters for pleasure might have been more appropriate term. Flying for leisure implies a more casual attitude.

Perhaps this is what set "atakacs" off on his reprimand, although by his own admission it took him 8 years and 500 flying hours before he came to the conclusion that flying helicopters is a serious business and not to be taken lightly.

Or perhaps he is one one those small bunch of commercial pilots who like to belittle PPLs and air their superior knowledge.

Or perhaps he is tweaking our tails.

Or perhaps I am tweaking his.

Pleasure - Yep!
 

I am a PPL and fly, mostly turbine, for pleasure. I take it seriously and have been told, on numerous occasions, that my flying is as good as many commecial pilots. Love the full touch down autos at Proficiency check time!

It's a matter of attitude and devotion. Not commercial or private.

I'm a PPL(H), fly turbines and pistons, doing about 200 piston hours p.a. - a chunk of those purely for pleasure. Like John R81, if I've had a bad day at the office, I'll sometimes go for a fly for the sheer hell of it, do some practice or just go somewhere to escape the day job (last night, I ticked off another of my little goals: seeing my own moonshadow on top of the clouds :ok:). Like JTobias, I'm always hungry to learn more and I look forward to my regular trips with a more experienced pilot - I always pick up some new nugget of info.

I take great pride in my flying and, having been flown by 'professionals' (sic) on several occasions (and at the risk of sounding cocky), I am pleased to confirm my flying skills are at least as good as the vast majority of CPLs! Qualifications mean bugger all when you're in the air if preparation, attitude, conscientiousness, respect, empathy and professionalism are neglected!

As for IceKid's "there a lot of risk in a heli single engine piston...", what a load of :mad:!! In the event of an engine failure, I'd much rather be in a single engined heli than a single engined plank. I can land just about anywhere in a heli instead of needing a long, thin, unobstructed runway :uhoh:!

Geez, how did you get to be on top of the clouds? :}

Cheers

Whirls

How very dare you!
 

Well, really Whirls - shame on you - I have no idea what you're implying :E Obviously, it was a very tiny, isolated, single, almost invisible whisp of cloud which appeared from nowhere in otherwise perfect 9999s. If you'd have blinked, you'd have missed it :p

I'm not implying; you're inferring :}

Cheers

Whirls

I'm pleased to read that we have a real ace amongst us.

A Flying Ace or a Grammatical Ace :ok: :}

Cheers

Whirls

Have you guys who do all this PPL flying ever thought about doing your CPL? Just for the hell of it and maybe to learn some more, etc. Not necessarily to work as a commercial pilot!

I am starting to do my CPL for several reasons...

First as I have not done a lot of flying these last years (though I am in the process of addressing that), I find the training very helpful in keeping not just proficient, but focused on flying and some of the more tedious parts of theory one would not normally keep current on after you get your ppl, and to be in a situation with interaction with professional pilots to learn from their (sage) advice.

As a renter having a commercial license helps with certain insurance problems, from what aircraft you can hire, particularly turbines, limits on what you can do (the whole reason I got my helicopter license was so that I did not have to land on a 10,000' runway) and hopefully if/when I buy to reduce my insurance premiums.

Oh, and I also want to wear those fancy gold bars on my polo shirt :p

Whirls - I'm always ready to learn so I looked up the difference in a dictionary :8, still don't really get the distinction though :O: I think I'll stick to the flying...

"Infer –verb (used with object) 1. to derive by reasoning; conclude or judge from premises or evidence: They inferred his displeasure from his cool tone of voice.
2. (of facts, circumstances, statements, etc.) to indicate or involve as a conclusion; lead to.
3. to guess; speculate; surmise.
4. to hint; imply; suggest."

"Imply –verb (used with object), -plied, -ply⋅ing. 1. to indicate or suggest without being explicitly stated: His words implied a lack of faith.
2. (of words) to signify or mean.
3. to involve as a necessary circumstance: Speech implies a speaker.
4. Obsolete. to enfold."

The irony of my last post was obviously lost on ShyTorque. I'm not a real flying ace; i wouldn't be so hungry to learn if I was that arrogant. Trans Lift's got me thinking though - I'm going to make enquiries about a CPL course (time and money permitting...); I'd like some Gold bars too :ok:

TTB

If I imply something, it means I am making a suggestion.

If I infer something, it means I interpret a suggestion from something said by you which may or may not be the correct interpretation.

Does that help?

Cheers

Whirls

Well, I'm not ashamed to admit I've learned something today. I'm not stupid, but at almost 50 years old, I hadn't realised that to infer meant to interpret a suggestion; I always thought to infer was to make a suggestion :O. A fairly fundamental distinction that would explain my confusion. So you don't just learn about helis on PPRuNe :ok:

Thank you Whirls!

My pleasure TTB, can I help with any other queries ? :}

Cheers

Whirls

Or simply if I imply something through what or how I say it, you may infer it to mean something :}

As I understand it, provided you have a valid night rating and have successfully applied to have the restriction of being in sight of the surface lifted then you may legally fly VFR on top, day or night. Always provided that you ascended in the clear and that it is clear at your destination.

What about being above 1 isolated small cloud and clearly in sight of the surface?

Moon off to the left, one could off to the right and below, shadow on cloud but clear of cloud, in sight of surface

What about.... or am I now obsessing????

Actually, no, it wasn't at all lost on me, despite the attempt to camouflage it with BS.

Perhaps the irony of MY post was lost on yourself. I tried to avoid the use of this smilie :rolleyes:

CPL(H) and private flying
 

Heh - I hold a CPL, and an FI rating to boot.

As you probably guessed, I'm not flying professionally - my day job just got a lot more rewarding, and now I only fly for fun, which isn't a bad way to be.

I enjoyed the CPL - the extra theory stretched me, and the instruction wasn't wasted either.

The FI stretched me even further - to the limit of my flying skills, and I haven't had the opportunity to do anything beyond trial lessons with actual students. Although they and I very much enjoyed doing this, I can't see myself maintaining the FI, particularly in the current economic climate.

There are plenty of excellent schools who will eagerly take your money and train you to a higher level, and you'll find your flying more rewarding as a result.

Hope this helps!
Benet

ShyTorque - not sure what the "...despite the attempt to camouflage it with BS" comment was a reference to. Apologies if you were offended in some way.

northpoint - re. your comment "...successfully applied to have the restriction of being in sight of the surface lifted". I've never heard of applying to have that restriction lifted. Can you elaborate?

John R81 - try here for a refresher on UK VMC minima (pages 4/5) :ok:

TTB

All,

I'm considering doing my CPL just for the hell of it as I'm certain that my flying is at CPL standards. (Yes it will most definitely need tweaking to ensure that it ticks ALL the boxes as I have no doubt there will be some bad habits etc in my current flying technique.)

I really have no desire whatsoever to fly as a profession, but I simply want to be a better pilot and I guess that's the only way to really do it. I need to get my head around the time I will need to put aside for the ground school studying.

In terms of theory I have a short attention span and usually just want to get onto the practical stuff, so that's my problem. We'll see.

Joel :ok:

Joel,

I might be mistaken since it has been 14 years since I did my CPL but it was two months classroom work to pass the exams followed by 5-6 hours of mock and real GFT as for improving your skill you would spend you money better by doing a mountain flying course followed by an undersling course followed by a fire fighting course and first and fore most since you own a Jetranger a factory course. You seem to have the money and this is what I would do if I had the wonga.

But maybe you can ask Dennis Kenyon to impart his wisdom to you for a couple of hours or other well respected commercial pilots.

I know though what you mean and I believe we do lack a general training support which one would like to do outside the OPC. Gary is doing a good thing with his Flight Safety aspect but I would also like a general handling aspect for which there is not always time ore money during or after the OPC.

I hope I am making sense.

TTB
 

I'm not sure that it is still possible to get the restriction for being in sight of the surface lifted. It certainly was possible if you had a CAA licence, as opposed to JAR licence. Once you had a night rating you asked the CAA to re-issue your licence with the restriction removed and you were then legal to go VFR on top. I don't think it is possible to do this any longer now that CAA only issue JAR licences.

Brilliant Stuff,

I've done a Mountain Flying course and I regularly do continuation training (in fact I'm doing a day of it tomorrow) with an ex-military instructor who puts me through my paces.

I can do a distance learning CPPL course, which a good friend of mine has just completed, so that was a consideration. There is no really good reason for me to do a CPL (H) other than to improve my game.

I certainly wouldn't mind doing some training in the USA with Bell. I've spoken to a couple of pals who are CPL pilots and instructors who have suggested I do it - if only for the aforementioned reasons.

As I own a JetBox and fly regularly the flying element isn't going to cost me that much extra and If I do a distance learning course I reckon I can get the theory and exams out of the way for about £5k.

I've not made my mind up yet and I'm in no hurry. I have to say that I would really love to get my FI(H) ticket - which needs a CPL (H) these days.

Anyway, I'm considering my options. Thanks for the input.

Joel :ok:

Only if you want to be paid for it :} although either way, you need at least CPL(H) theory.

Cheers

Whirls

JTobias
I have just scraped through the CPL theory (fixed wing) and I would argue that very few people have a shorter attention span than I and especially when it comes to a lot of seemingly pointless material. I stretched it over the maximum 18 months from start to finish although this was not helped by having to spend 5/6 months of the year abroad. I did the distance learning through GTS in Bournemouth and can't recommend them highly enough. I only did it to obtain the FI rating in an effort to help out my local club but that was before the dreaded credit crunch when instructors were thin on the ground. To be honest improving my own standards may have had some bearing on it as well.
I also am at the PPL H license flight test stage although the numbers would need to come up before I would consider the helicopter FI.
If you have the time I would go for the CPL as the Irish would say if your not in you can't lose.
Solar

Well the Bell factory course I am told is top notch and does teach you a lot about the 206. This is all I can add.

And no I haven't done it myself I and I don't work for them either.

BS / Solar,

Thanks for you input. I'm considering doing both over the next 18 months.

Thanks, Joel:ok:

PPL to CPL?
 

Yes, getting a CPL(H) just for the heck of it is on my list. Had it planned for my 50th birthday but there was not enough time. Gearing up for it now, though! I'll get the one and only CPL(H) distance course if it can be teamed with my favourite flight school. Capt Paco?