EC135 -v- MD902
 

I'd like to canvass opinion from those of you who have substantial operational experience of both of these types. I have a good working knowledge of the specifications and have several contacts who operate one or the other but few fly both.

Police/EMS experience is particularly welcome as is any opinion from observers/medics who operate in both.

That boils down to about 2 TRE's then!!!If your looking at experience on both (and substantial at that). Are they watching this thread?

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Thermal runaway.

[This message has been edited by Thomas coupling (edited 19 May 2001).]

Droopy, Hi, welcome to pprune.
I posed the same topic last year. Got a few pros and cons from 135 drivers, but the silence from 902 users was deafening. It'll be interesting to see the responses this time. Are you, perchance, thinking of trading in your old model? Ours(135) is ordered and hopefully should arrive next summer.

there was a letter in rotor and wing from MCAlpines Marketing manager (surely an unbiased source !) Pointing out that while the 902 meets CAT A requirements is is not cleared for flight in IMC by the CAA. Is this a temporary restriction ?.

wigeon,
regarding the restriction on the 902, I do not know if this is true, but our machine (first with PW207E) does have the new GE3000 EFIS standby - basically it will show ALL the info on both other EFIS displays on the one instrument, but as a police operation we do not use it - VFR only. Maybe a TRE on both types can sort it???

Droopy,

I have got about 400 hours in Police 135s and am due to do the 902 conversion in July. Once I have built up a bit of experience in that, again in the Police role, I'd be happy to give you an unbiased opinion of the two types, from a simple police pilot's perspective.

Kipper

Dare I throw into the pot the Bolkow 117?

Would be interested to hear back from all.
I've flown none of them...but am drawn to believe that the 117 is the tool for EMS work.

Mighty Gem; thank you. I thought you were going for 2003?

Roofus; I agree that the 117/EC145 is the best general purpose airframe for the emergency services market but it's just that but too far beyond the budget of an average provincial force like ours; undeniably it would be my choice for a well funded combined Police/HEMS operation [ no offence to the 3 UK units that are already doing a good job of this].

Let's set aside two points as they're for us to decide alone:- 1] that the economies of scale of existing maintenance provision will play a part in influencing type and 2] you pays your extra couple of hundred thousand for the 902 and you gets your extra payload.

Some examples of operational questions are:- Is the ride in the back of the 135 really that rough? Are the 902 pedal movements in a turbulent hover really that great? Has anyone got valid experience of both IFR avionic systems? What do you really think of the left seat in the 902 having the collective there? etc etc etc, I could go on for ages. hmm...

I wouldn't have said that pedal movements in a 902 were excessive in turbulence (to be honest, they just feel normal..now.) The space in the back of a 902 is excellent but to be fair the space in the back of a 135 looks pretty good. The ride in the back of a 135 I can't comment on but I'm sure plenty will. Our observers are split about 50/50 on the ride in the back of the 902, half are fine, the other half state that after about an hour in the back of the 902 they feel a bit sick, especially if they have been head down at the observer station.
Operations and visibility from the front two seats are second to none
The port collective being left in has not yet caused us a problem
The IFR fit in the 902 (current CAA problems excepted) is excellent,the efis has all the bells and whistles you could want and the AP couples in with it very nicely, come the day when GPS approaches are approved it will even do that for you as well! Without doubt, the major drawback for the 902 is the exchange rate/price.

I would recommend the 117 for EMS work but not police flying, due to the poor downward visibility. The 145 (or C2) looks a better bet as it appears to have the 135 nose.