Flying Training - Helicentre Aviation?
 

Would anyone be willing to share their experiences of training with or generally dealing with Helicentre Aviation?

I'm considering undertaking flying training there and they have a significant online presence when compared to other training providers, where they talk about their connections with industry (Bristow in particular) and scholarships amongst other things, which other training providers don't talk about at all. Is Helicentre Aviation the only place that has these links and opportunities or is it just that they are the only place the publishes it online?

When digging a bit deeper, I noticed that they have pretty poor feedback on glassdoor - not ideal when they could be my employer one day! I was also hoping to get any views or opinions on this too, as if I trained there one option would be to instruct there once I'd got my FI and I don't want to be put off by one or two bad reviews.

Thanks all!

Looking at glassdoor you are talking about three reviews out of how many students they have had ??? Not everyone is going to be happy.

I went last year to get my PPL(H). Before I could start I had to pass the Pilot Selection day course. Three parts:-
Flying - passed 4/5
Maths Test- 100% in about a quarter of the time allowed.
A "computer game" - failed miserablely. Told to take my money else where!
Arrogant would be my description of them.

Although I want to learn about both the life there as an instructor and as a student, the 3 reviews are from former employees rather than students, so I was looking at the glassdoor reviews specifically with regards to potentially instructing there as a job afterwards rather than learning there. A company of their size maybe has around 10 instructors, so getting 2 bad reviews with the former employees saying that they have "no care for the staff at all" and that someone feels that they are the "least trustworthy people I have come across" since 2020 doesn't look good from the outside!

I would say pretty good. As 'The Punter' above says, there aren't many schools that would actually turn you away - Most just want to see your chequebook. That isn't arrogance, that's wanting to keep their success rate high and trying to avoid foreseeable problems.

The North Sea seem to like Helicentre students - Their graduates seem to do well and are ready to go straight into North Sea roles, which I guess means they'll be good for other companies too. Bristow have taken on about 8 of their graduates or instructors in the recent past, with CHC also taking a few.

I can't think of any other schools that have that level of size or success rate.

It could also be viewed as showing integrity - not wishing to waste the time and money of potential clients who they don't believe have the innate aptitude. Those same (or very similar) "computer games" are also used for selecting Military and sponsored civillian pilots, so they do have some provenance......

Edit to say I see Bob beat me to it, with similar sentiments!

If you would like to see a sad example of what can happen when you just throw money at a school to get a licence, read this:https://assets.publishing.service.go...990_G-SHBB.pdf

What "game" would they expect an applicant to play?

Isn't that the whole point of the scholarschip deal Bristow and Helicentre have..?

I hope that you're not also planning on having a large training loan which will require paying back:

https://uk.indeed.com/viewjob?jk=8bd2d08f483dfa16

Hi Willypete
The screen was split into 4 quarters.
One quarter was ATC giving instrutions in heavily accented english.
A "pacman" style game.
The old space invaders game.
In the last one the airplane started in the middle of the quarter screen, objects appeared from the left side of the sceen and using the up/down keys on the numerical side of the keyboard I had to avoid them, all while not being "eaten", shooting down UFO's and having ATC telling me to turn on to heading 265 from 085.

The reasoning behind it is to see how one copes' with pressure.
Pressure to me would trying to autorotate a Robbie:} or be a Dr in AAE

Back to the trading screen

I had always thought that a salary of £20k-24k was common for instructors, after all they're essentially "using" the school to build up their hours before jumping ship to a better gig! Is this a particularly low salary, even for instructors?

Unfortunately here lies a problem. They know people are desperate for hours hours hours so they pay peanuts. It happens across the globe in this industry.

Good luck in following your dream, many pitfalls and lessons to be had.

I would say they are a very good option. You have a decent chance of getting work at the end if you get either an FI rating or IR with them. And you get to meet and hang out with other students who are on the same path - don't underestimate the importance of this. It's hard work and you'll have ups and downs.

I've spoken to a couple of students who went there and they had positive things to say.

I spoke to Helicentre when I was looking at a school to do my CPL and I felt they were overly salesy which put me off. You have to attend a pilot selection day, which you pay for, in order to be able to book onto the course. You get time in a Cabri for that so it's not a complete waste but if you get told no thanks at the end of it, and then go to another school which operates R22's then your Cabri time was a bit of a waste.

Because they are able to offer instructing work or entry to the North Sea if you train with them, you pay several hundred quid for the pilot selection day in order to be considered. But either way it's fair enough and who cares about a few hundred quid in the grand scheme of things.

I think they only use the Cabri for PPL/CPL training which is a great machine albeit more expensive than the R22 so if cost is a factor, then bear that in mind. They have a number of Cabri's so availability shouldn't be an issue.

Not sure of your current flying level, but if you're at the very beginning then consider their integrated course. It means you only do the one skills test, rather than two (one for the PPL and one for CPL). Plus you're on a tried and tested path to your CPL ticket, with useful well-organised hour building along the way.

I'm interested to hear more about the fact that you have a good chance of getting work afterwards. Is this due to their connections or the quality of student they produce? There's lots of talk about their good links and people getting good work but what does that actually mean for me as a potential student?

I understand your opinion on them being quite salesy, I get a similar impression. I'm a bit concerned that their integrated path isn't necessarily "tried and tested", it seems they've only had 1 course complete thus far and some of those were Bristow cadets, but haven't seen or heard much from the rest of the course which does make me wonder. For a school that seems to get so many pupils and people say is a bit of a factory, you don't hear much about those that haven't gone to Bristow on their scheme! Where are they all now - joining the pool of not very employable low hour CPL holders?

I think that most people are able to learn to fly a Helicopter
The point of a selection is to obtain a reasonable insurance that the student will reach the standard within the budget. Some people will need more training than others, it does not mean that they will be unsafe.
What I think is innate is more attitude than aptitude. Knowledge requires dedication and hard work, Skill requires training, the expensive part, but Attitude is difficult to change.

The problem with an integrated course is that once you're in, your stuck in it. If the training is not good or delayed, what can you do? They can even demand that you pay for extra training if they decide at their discretion that you need it, or else they don't sign you off for the skill test. If they file for bankruptcy, you loose everything. So before signing in do your home work, try to speak to as many former students as you can, etc.
You can be sure that the salesperson will tell you all about the good things, and will leave to you only bad things to discover.

Integrated pitfall, as mentioned - you get no paperwork until the end of the course, not even a PPL.

The Intergrated path is the chosen route for the Oil & Gas industry. They (oil companies) demand Integrated Training or you need to have hours and experience under your belt before joining - I think the requirement is 500 Hours, which ties in with the current job advertisements. But the standard Catch 22 - Low hours, no job - And if you haven't got a job, how do you get the hours. The integrated training allows the offshore helicopter operators to get around this problem and provides the highest quality of professional full time training.

The integrated path is probably the cheapest route also, as it requires less hours than modular. It is professionally well accepted and would be a good route into any job, but you are still going to have to have realistic expectations about your first role in industry. Oil & Gas will employ direct from training with an integrated course. You may also get a Co-Pilot role in some onshore operations, safety pilot etc, but it can be difficult to build hours. Taking a role as an instructor is always a good way to gain hours and experience, but you can feel like you're still a bit out of your depth - Teaching others while you are still learning yourself!

If you have doubts about the Integrated Course, just go with the modular. It will cost you more and take longer, but you can pay as you are going along which can be an advantage if you don't have the money to pay up front - And how many of us do. I'd be surprised if your training on the integrated course wouldn't count for anything, or allow you to drop down to modular course if there was an issue. Not sure where that theory comes from. You will still have to gain hours from somewhere before gaining employment in most careers, so you might be limiting yourself, depending on your end goal. You asked about originally about becoming an instructor, so if that is your aspiration, the modular course is fine, and if you perform in your training, the whole course is like one long audition and job interview!

Good luck

On paper initially, the integrated route certainly has its advantages. What doesn't make sense to me is whether Oil & Gas companies actually want to take those that have rolled straight off an integrated course and immediately done an ME/IR? I'm told that this is a good option but I can't see it - surely the operators would much rather take those that have got 500-1500 hours instead!

And it's a lot of money to cough up for an ME/IR, is there any chance that the operators may fully or partially pay for an ideal candidate to get their ME/IR?

From my understanding, the 2 main options are to get a CPL, fork out for an ME/IR and hope to get into a co-pilot seat offshore with <250 hours, or get a CPL and then an FI rating and gain experience that way before hoping to pick up other work like VFR charter/tours/survey etc? Both seem to have their advantages and disadvantages!

I think that it’s probably time to resurrect Camp Freddie’s old formula (although I suspect that the numbers have changed slightly over the years):

https://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/25...ml#post2690422


(BTW, where is Camp Freddie these days?)

The unfortunate and uncontrollable side of all of this is timing. If the North Sea is in a slump or just not hiring then there’s no jobs, not for the 5000hr North Sea pilot, and not for the 250 hour CPLH holder fishing for work, regardless of which school you went to.

If the North Sea need people, jobs aplenty, especially if you’re in good books with a school that has the connections to get you in a Copilot position with low hours. I’ve even see them pay for your whole MEIR so long as you take a 3yr pay cut from the standard FO salary.

This is the risk any new commercial pilot takes, when it comes to whether or not helicentre is a good place to work? I’m sure it’s fine, you’ll find that there will be people that will complain about any job and employer in the industry. Absolutely nowhere is perfect, you won’t find it.

Will you work for them for the rest of your career? By the sounds of it you’d prefer to use them as a stepping stone, like many do to progress into other sectors, fly bigger things, have a bigger wallet. So if it’s a temporary post anyway, you’re just getting what you want out of it, a low time job that gives you the hours and they’re getting the same, a cheap pilot that will probably leave within 2 years which is good, because they want to hire the next FI student to keep the factory churning and advertise that you could be hired at the end of your course.

They are a school with a solid success record, a proven network into the wider industry and have a history of safe operation. I wouldn’t recommend you delve into the archives of pprune to see what has been said about some of the big companies in the North Sea, otherwise you may be put off of this career before it’s even started!

"On paper initially, the integrated route certainly has its advantages. What doesn't make sense to me is whether Oil & Gas companies actually want to take those that have rolled straight off an integrated course and immediately done an ME/IR? I'm told that this is a good option but I can't see it - surely the operators would much rather take those that have got 500-1500 hours instead!"



The offshore operators are totally happy with minimum hours, straight off an Integrated CPL and subsequent IR with maybe 150 hours in your logbook. - That is how they got their pilots for many years in the 70's, 80's and 90's. You are easy to train, cheap to employ, and haven't picked up lots of bad habits. I think it Is probably the favoured route into offshore. If you are holding out for someone to sponsor your ME/IR, I worry you maybe waiting a long time. The offshore operators will either have to be very short of pilots, or making lots of money, or ideally both. Don't assume that this route is a realistic expectation. Like full CPL sponsorship, it will only be offered in very small numbers and the competition for those positions is high.

Like others have said, timing is essential and sadly can't be predicted. Coming off the 'production line' with minimal hours and an Integrated CPL and self funded IR will make you very employable in a good market where there is a shortage of pilots. Otherwise, whether you've gone Integrated or Modular, look for two years as an FI at the end to build the time required, but the FI course costs could be the investment you need to pay for the Instrument Rating. You just have to keep assessing the market as you are going through your training, to see if you need to go the IR route where jobs are available, or are there sponsorships available, or should you just hold out for a while, become an instructor, or see if one if you can pick up any work as a low hour pilot.

The market will keep changing, but you would be in a very small pool. Don't think there have been many people training over the last few years

Don't you need 250h TT to become an instructor?

Thanks. Makes sense, kind of.

Thank you for your inputs, it's really helpful. It sounds like if you've got the CPL, the IR and the timing is right then you can jump into a co-pilot seat offshore just fine. If not then you've wasted your money on the IR, which is not to be taken lightly as I gather they're about £55k! With the offshore companies, is there any reason why Helicentre seem to be obsessed with Bristow - are they regarded as the best operator or are they all similar?

Sounds like instructing at Helicentre could be fine if I'm happy to accept being paid less than instructors at other flight schools, but I'd be likely to build a lot of hours in a fairly short space of time what with it being a factory so I would only be there for about 2 years - probably more hours than I would build instructing elsewhere across the country and I gather this is the "standard" route to take. The glassdoor reviews and what I'm hearing on the grape vine suggest that as a school, Helicentre are generally more expensive to train at and that people seem to have a very mixed opinion of them, which is definitely something I'll bear in mind as I dig deeper and I'll certainly be asking them lots of questions.

I believe you need to have 250 hours to get the FI rating, so you can start the training at approx. 220 hours, something else to consider as you only get 135 hours with their integrated course which means you need to build ~80 hours before you can start training to be an instructor!

It's funny how you'll do anything to get hours when you're at the entry end of the business, and at the other end you'll do anything to get out of going flying. :O

I guess it's wisdom or something.

All pretty similar, maybe slightly different pay scales but not by much.

If Helicentre were aligned with any of the other companies it would be exactly the same.

I notice that their integrated course is only 12 months. Isn´t it 18-24 months most other places? Very fast paced and intense then, or did they just remove unnecessary slack?

Here is another helicopter job that is currently being advertised for the same salary (£20k): https://uk.indeed.com/viewjob?jk=f1f079a01134ab0f

The major difference is that the Ops assistant won't have spent £70-100k before getting the job.

£ 20k blimey better off getting your LGV licence earning on average £ 45k driving and use the money to fund your Cpl over a few years with a steady job and job security

When Bristow had their own school it was 12 months.

Alright, didn´t know/remember. I looked into integrated RW ages ago, but went modular FW instead. Still, isn´t 12 months a tight schedule? Anyone here did it in that kind of time and recommend?

It's pretty damn tight considering you have to do all the theory in that time as well. You could easily spend a year full time just on the theory alone.

If you end up going down the integrated route I would advise starting the study well before you begin the course.

I did a 12 month integrated and thought it was fine, although I’m sure it’s not for everyone.

That's why I chose modular - much quicker than integrated. That's a lie of course, I chose modular because I'm not an idiot. 💲🔥

Hi all, hasn't time flown! Just thought I'd chime in with an update.

After much deliberation, I decided to begin my training elsewhere. I had a lot of messages from various people across the industry with horror stories of dealing with them, and have reached out to several current and old students there and have heard similar stories again. Firing instructors for standing up to tyrannical management in cases where flight safety is concerned, lying to students with regards to future jobs, making up and spreading terrible stories about students to recruiters in the industry to ruin the student's reputation, and needlessly telling capable students to pay for more hours - in some cases taking a card machine out to a rotors running aircraft!

In my personal interactions with them, like a previous poster mentioned, I found their very salesy attitude was off-putting, and combined with their crazy prices and non-optional add-ons totalling thousands of pounds by the time I would've finished training, I decided my money would be far better spent elsewhere.

I know that there will be happy people that have gone through the school and succeeded, but from my impression it seems that for every one of those happy people there are several others feeling very hard done by that have changed school because they had enough. I have decided not to take this gamble!

So what happened next?
 

Where did you train, and where have you got to?

I suspect there is no smoke without fire, from the detractors, and they have discovered how small the industry is (and their naivety) in the process!

Given what I've said, I'm sure you can understand that I don't want to give too much away as to who I am for fear of being hunted down! I'll reveal that I'm happily working through my training and will hopefully be out the other side within a year or two.