Polish HEMS EC135 almost losing it on landing
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Originally Posted by Sidestick_n_Rudder
(Post 10684541)
Great pilot job with recovery...but what is wrong with Holly fenestron and Airbus H135? |
Nothing wrong with the helicopter
looks like a downwind approach and turning into wind in the high hover. Fenestron dont like wind from some angles - lots of pedal movement necessary to do it smoothly. would better have flown a turn with speed, still, he got away with it and has a story to tell and others can learn |
If that was yesterday or today and the windspeeds in Poland were anywere near what we had in Germany, no wonder he nearly lost it. That fenestron and fin offers a huge surface for crosswinds. If he was even downwind in these winds, he's lucky he didn't crash it.
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Originally Posted by muermel
(Post 10684652)
If that was yesterday or today and the windspeeds in Poland were anywere near what we had in Germany, no wonder he nearly lost it. That fenestron and fin offers a huge surface for crosswinds. If he was even downwind in these winds, he's lucky he didn't crash it.
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Approach was with 250-260 heading wind from 230 at 15 kt ... The video is from mirror so to make it real You should see it also in mirror...
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Originally Posted by topik22
(Post 10684688)
Approach was with 250-260 heading wind from 230 at 15 kt ... The video is from mirror so to make it real You should see it also in mirror...
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Not sure which way the wind was blowing, but it sure looks like a classic case of http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/m...ar/ac90-95.pdf, albeit with things spinning in the EU direction instead of the US direction.
Great recovery. |
Originally Posted by aa777888
(Post 10684700)
Not sure which way the wind was blowing, but it sure looks like a classic case of http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/m...ar/ac90-95.pdf, albeit with things spinning in the EU direction instead of the US direction.
Great recovery. |
Someone with a video camera on every flight
Interesting footage and no assumptions made here as I have no idea of the circumstances. An ops director once told me "Assume that the authorities, Chief Pilot, Director of Ops and Safety Director are watching every take off and every landing". With social media it is so very true. Every 'boring' or 'routine' flight, is a good flight.
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Originally Posted by Autonomous Collectiv
(Post 10684717)
The 135 rotates in the conventional way as does the 145 i.e. anti-clockwise, NOT the same as other Airbus Helicopter product. I have had to reverse it down taxiways or completely sideways in strong winds.
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Originally Posted by aa777888
(Post 10684800)
Well that's damn interesting. How do we account for the left yaw, then?
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Originally Posted by topik22
(Post 10684688)
Approach was with 250-260 heading wind from 230 at 15 kt ... The video is from mirror so to make it real You should see it also in mirror...
with 15 knots of wind? Manageable - but you have to anticipate that wind from about 30-45 degree out of centerline, regardless if it is from the front or back, might give some wobble due to disturbed airflow around the fenestron. No way to hurry through an outside landing- Proper assessment of the landing site, how to approach and how to depart later shouldn’t be rushed. As you can see here, instead of landing and helping time will be wasted for paperwork (luckily only) |
Originally Posted by Hot and Hi
(Post 10684851)
Mirror image inverts apparent direction of yaw.
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Big DC windbreak
That mahoosive distribution centre opposite would I suspect create some interesting dynamics and that coupled with little bit of fenestron stall - looks like it induced a little sphincter twitch..... still good recovery and fly away to calm the nerves.... remember this happening in a gazelle in Germany many moons ago - never seen an airtrooper run so fast 🤣🤣
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Fenestron stall doesn't exist.
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https://assets.publishing.service.go...TURP_01-92.pdf |
Originally Posted by Jetscream 32
(Post 10685331)
Glad that you seem to have better knowledge than the AAIB - they seem to think it existed and so did we 89-95 - BAOR / NI / Op Granby
https://assets.publishing.service.go...TURP_01-92.pdf just inappropriate Pedal movement with Fenestron you have - non linear - longer travel |
I've had a couple of vinos, probably missed something, but where are people getting wind speed and direction from that video?
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Glad that you seem to have better knowledge than the AAIB - they seem to think it existed and so did we 89-95 - BAOR / NI / Op Granby The whole construct of Fenestron Stall was demolished when Aerospatiale demonstrated recovery from in excess of 120 deg/sec left yaw with full right pedal and it stopped perfectly (albeit with the little red Tq light flashing). It was later understood that Fenestrons have different handling characteristics to conventional TRs and need prompt and sometimes large pedal movements to control undemanded yaw where the pilot has got behind the curve regarding actual pedal position compared with required pedal position, |
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