T2B,

P3 air not sealing correctly can cause stagnated starts, but in this instance the fault appears to lie in the start electro valve.

I've just had a quick wizz through the troubleshooting manual to confirm.

Where is the aircraft based, maybe I can supply hands on help.

RWB2

I'll PM you :ok:

Sorted!
 

Well, after a month of investigation, the problem seems to have been the T4.5 thermo couple probes...

The engineers looked at the master control box, starter relays, the starter, electro start valves, FCU, lubrication pump, fuel valves, injectors, etc..

The problem was eventually found to be one or more of the T4 probes sending false temperature readings to the VEMD. During the start, despite apparently taking T4 up to 800 oC (and higher on occasion, for a few seconds), it was actually much cooler and it was this that caused the stagnation, usually at around 36% Ng.

A new T4.5 harness (obviously, you need to buy all 4 new probes...) and she's now back to form.

Just a heads up, in case other EC120s show similar symptoms - you might save yourself a few $000s on fruitless investigation. This intermittent problem originally affected only 1 in 10 starts, but it got progressively worse until it was happening 7 times out of 10 and usually only when cold. Thanks for all the suggestions :ok:

Electrical charging problem
 

So, intermittent problem has begun where the generator still works in both start / charge mode but intermittently no current is getting through to the battery. This gives "MAster Caution: Gen" and shortly afterwards the "Master Caution: Electronics". On/Off toggle GEN and ELEC RESET are not effective, though land and shut-down, it might come back fine.

I understand that the control of voltage flow to / from the battery is governed by the box behind the fuse panel in the cargo hold. This has 5 boards.

1. Anyone else had this problem?
2. Which of the boards / relays shoudl we investigate?
3. Does Eurocopter swap or fix individual boards?

Any other thoughts / ideas also welcome. We have checked all the wires and connections. Battery cap recently checked and is fine.

Thanks

EC120 throttle
 

How many positions does the EC120 throttle have?

Three?

Off - Start position(white line) - Flight

or there is another position for idle? if not what is the value of NG for idle ?

thank you...it seems strange but I can not understand it from the manual..

White mark is the position for starting. As you start you accelerate the throttle from starting throttle position to ground idle, the idle pin kicks in (N1 approx. 60%).

And the answer to #124 is.......

The whole electrical control box goes back as an exchange item. £5k. However, it did cure the problem.

Floats AD
 

The EASA issued item boils down to this:

EASA AD 2011-0185 (Part I & Part II) (Modification of floatation gear) due at 1213.1 A/F hours or 17/02/2013

The only problem is, when contacting Eurocopter they say "speak to Zodiac, we don't have the parts" and Zodiac says "we can fit your request into the line schedule for early March 2013". And both Eurocopter and Zodiac say "this is not an AOG matter, as you can fly without floats". That really depends on the type of work your machine is doing! From 17th of the month I am losing hours/income.

:ugh::ugh::ugh:

Does anyone else fancy joining an effort to ask EASA to extend the deadline to a point when the parts might actually be available? After all, the floats still work (recent inflation check)

Lane 2 on my VEMD has an intermittent fault whereby the output from the computer doesn't quite make it to the screen in a coherent form, which displays a snowstorm of interference - as though it can't quite 'lock on' to the right channel. The computer itself is working fine and all the data can be read through Lane 1. It's probably just a dodgy 2 cent diode that's corrupts the image output signal.

Exchange unit, sir? that'll be £5k please :ouch:

If you think maintenance is expensive, try having a crash.

Not the nicest of replies RW.....

Toptobottom, just a quick explanation that might shed some light. Screen 1 is the visual display of processor 1 and screen 2 the visual display of processor 2- 2 seperate computers. They each receive the primary info incase of a failure so you retain the primary info from the other processor. Each processor then have additional tasks ie 1 calculates the FLI and 2 The power check. So by excluding screen 2 you are excluding processor 2 which probably means processor 2 is gone. Unfortunately the processors can only be replaced by Thales thus the service exchange.

Exchange VEMD unit- 5k? that seems quite reasonable, the EDU we have in the A119 which is basically the same as the VEMD just not as well thought out, costs 55k per screen as a unit exchange, and if you think eurocopter are slow with the parts, you ain't seen nothing yet! We have been through 8 EDUs in 900hrs. :ugh:

VP - thanks for the info. The problem with my unit is that 'processor 2' is always working fine. It survives all the diagnostics tests and thinks it's displaying the info correctly. If I turn it off, screen 1 can scroll through all the primary info e.g. Ts & Ps, voltages, FLI, etc. on Screen 1 and when I keep screen 2 on and scroll, it will perform all the different functions perfectly, including a power check - it's just that you can't see it...

Whatsarunway - 8 EDUs in 900 hours?! Surely, that's a warranty job though? Even Agusta must realise that isn't acceptable?! 55k and huge waiting lists also aren't acceptable, but they know we don't have a choice... :mad:

Any one elaborate or correct my recent rumour that Eurocopter is set to scrap the B2 keep the B3e and turn the screws up on the power for the ec120 ( how much I don't know) so that it can actually lift full pax and fuel in the same universe

Interesting rumour. If they are listening to the market, they'd better scrap the B3e and go back to the B3+ - nobody wants to have a B3e after the trouble they had with it.

Bell did a mistake when ending their 206 (well, ok, everything has an end of life) but why should Eurocopter stop the B2 when there still is a market for it?

Looking for ec120 maneuvers guide
 

Just picked up an ec120 for our fleet of aircraft and am looking for a maneuver guide to help in setting up a profile guide for training our pilots. Any help in this arena would be appreciated.

Maintenance Program
 

I have to write a maintenance program (EASA country) for an EC120. I hope to have covered all of the airframe items and the national requirements but I'm still short of the engine items as I don't have access to the Turbomeca Manuals yet.

Could somebody please provide me with the required inspection items of the Arius 2F engine?

Thanks in advance.

New to EC120 hints
 

Having read all I can in past posts regarding operating Ec120 just wondering if there is any thing new out there with regards to;
Starting hints
Do the blades last full life ( seems lots for sale have blade change)
Load carrying rule of thumb
VMED operation, dependability
Pilot removal of dual controls( how easy is this)
Thanks in advance

As350nut lets see.
Starting hints: Firstly ensure you disconnect batt after shutdown so you have good batt for start. Secondly, simply follow the correct 120 post SB start procedure-line up the white lines and she goes no issues.
Blades life time: In my experience depend on environment, but if they are maintained correctly even if they dont look nice they last long. Do not paint them every 100hrs to look nice and they will sand erode to a point within limits and stay there, paint them especially with the incorrect chemicals and procedure and the paint and rubber strip will come off. Big problem and exchange req.
VEMD: reliable but make sure if you do replace it you get compatable software unit
Dual Controls: Easy but a locking required on the collective, cyclic and pedals just pins and dont forget the dummy plug on collective must be installed if you remove the duals. Our AMO gave us a illustration and we had to fit and remove 3 times incl the locking and then gave us AMO authorisation to fit and remove.