My "ground handlers" will be made redundant!!:rolleyes:
hope their not members of UNITE;:ouch:

What is wrong with EROL - pray tell!

http://www.abpic.co.uk/images/images/1096535M.jpg

G-EROL Stapleford 1st March 2008

Earl

Past Gazelles:

http://www.abpic.co.uk/images/images/1156418M.jpg

G-BBHU (later to become G-EROL) at Plymouth 2 June 1984 for the Transat race

http://www.abpic.co.uk/images/images/1080997M.jpg

G-SFTH of Blades Helicopters (formerly owned by Specialist Flight Training)
Dagenham 13 July 1986 conducting pleasure flights.
Are those the 'pop-outs' for the Zell? (Nice .. not!)

http://www.abpic.co.uk/images/images/1118479M.jpg

G-BAGJ at Denham 20 June 1977 (Is that the old BHAB logo on the door?
If so, who in their right mind would want to put that on their aircraft?)

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviatio.../7/1498774.jpg

G-BAZL of Twyford Moors Helicopters ??!!! at Greenham Common July 1974

Apologies if this is elsewhere (I have had a search but can't immediately find it). I understand ex-mil Permit aircraft are restricted in terms of operating outside the UK. I can see that homebuilt PTF aircraft have been granted exemptions by some European countries. What's the score as far as the Gazelle is concerned?

One of two foreign registered Gazelle's operated by Mark Weir of the Honistor Slate mine......he commutes to work in it most day's and has bags of experiance of operating them. If your interested I suggest you give him a call at the mine, he's a great guy and full of enthusiasmn for the Gazelle.....:cool::cool::cool::cool:

Quote:

---

Is it still a requirement for the blades to be 'parked' for public transport pax access/egress?

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Please explain?

YBB
http://www.icelandexpress.is/is/uplo...h-flag-67x.jpg

My question is straightforward: For public transport operations in the SA341/2 are you required to stop the main blades when passengers enter or leave the aircraft (due to the low clearance - similar to the Brantly). Y/N?

Earl

earl

bazl still flys in uk under g register on a different registration number
sfth went to serbia and was flying in the uk on its serbian registration
bagj was in a aircraft museum in sunderland after being the water for a while
erol ?? i thought mw had it but someone on here seems to know something more ???

blade parking - depends on opps manual and type of undercaridge[ high or low skids ]

AFAIK

Earl of Rochester: Are Gazelles licenced to fly public transport ops in GB? I thought they were all either privately owned or permit to fly ex mil? I'm probably thrown by the designator SA341/2 and subconciously tagged on the N2 bit (ex mil).
I'm sure you are right.

Anyway....if it is public transport, your Ops manual will tell you what to do in this regard won't it? You do have an AOC?

Failing that - after 3000 hrs on type, I would VERY strongly suggest that stopping the blades before passengers embark/disembark is probably the wisest thing any pilot could do in a Gazelle. The chances of a tip strike are inexorably high.

tc
there are still quite a number of civil gazelles on the uk register some on aoc mw has some i believe
all civil made 341/2 gazelles are useable for pt subject to being on a AOC


341g astazou 111a engine CIVIL
341b,c,d,e astazou 111n2 [uk mil]
341f astazou 111C engine [ french military ]

342j astazou XIVH engine CIVIL
342 l,m,h astazou XIVH/m engine Various militarys

earl
i dont own a 600 anymore i have a gazelle
i just quickly checked the flight manual i could not find any reference to stopping blades but i always do except on engineering runs
you may find its in the opps manual for AOC work it certainly should be

i did once see a gazelle in maint that was started with the door open, it took the door clean off

it may also be the reason why they changed the clutch in the 340 prototype to the type we have today in the 341/2

I did my pplh conversion onto Gazelles a number of years ago and the company I did it with had 2 Gazelles (both streched machines ) they used for AOC work and I would do ground handling for them on occaisions. I asked if the rotors would be stopped for loadind and unloading of pax and the pilots said no they would tilt cyclic to right as I lead pax in and out of aircraft on left side. Very experienced pilot ,but obviously I did brief pax to keep low going in and out of machine.
R

earl

i have never tried opening the door fully when rotors are running full chat but certainly when starting the rotors flap up and down also would depend which way the cyclic was angled and the wind direction

E of R - Dear chap, the issue with the doors is a bit more complex and less than obvious to most. The door is quite large and held on the forward frame by two hinges. These hinges take a lot of force if the door is opened in an uncontrolled manner. For example if the wind takes it. I have seen front perspex cracks and holes and frame deformation as a direct result of the door blowing open and because it was not done so in a controlled manner. Also, the door hinge assembly is prone to deformation in such circumstances. On the inside there is a stub bar to hold the door when opening but its not tough enough to use to close on its own. You have to twist in the seat and with your right hand grab the rear leather handle, with your left hand grab the lower sill with the slide window open and pull to close securely. It is nearly impossible to do with the cyclic between yer knees rotors running without tilting the disc and/or seriously pulling a few ligaments. The cyclic is also very sloppy in its movement characteristics [no friction] which makes the potential for bother worse.

If the wind/turbulence necessary is present, the risk of hitting the door is very real and if on any ground other than flat then the risk is increased severely. The blades can drop down to waist height between 1 to 12 position in the worst case. That has happened to me a few times, but with doors closed.

I'd suggest that embarking/disembarking with rotors running should only be done in cases of extreme necessity, on flat ground, little or no risk of local turbulence and minimal wind - which should be on the nose only. If you have an experienced/briefed assistant to 'marshal' and supervise pax then that would help to negate a lot of concerns.

Also as a side issue but related, if the forward door is not correctly closed and likely to pop open after take off, with and degree of forward speed, the rear door on that side is likely to 'bang open' [if the lower or upper bolts are not correct in operation or the link rod is deformed] and disappear to the rear. Top tip, rear pax harness outboard floor retaining fastener [STBD] can be left so it is impinging on the rear door lower corner. This will deform the top and bottom front locating pins connecting rod rendering the rear door insecure even with the open/close horizontal lever showing correct position.

i dont know if they have ever been available

there is a peice of wire on the rear doors which stops the doors opening too far

E of R: There has never been a 'door hinge' nor has there - to my knowledge - any hint of such a thing. If you think about it carefully, there is no need. Seating position - better than most Ac IMO adjustable seat and pedals enables a nice and comfortable resting position for the right wrist and enables 'delicate' control. The only problem is the height of the seat back and the harness restraint. There is a tendency to sit incorrectly and hunched up and that causes problems. Being low to the ground is a double edged sword, EOL you really need to be comfortable with the actual height rather than perceived, I see many people hover taxi ing about at a height that will certainly ensure a complete wrap up in the event of a failure.

Earl,FAT-A, remember the last time you were in Paris,and picked up the Hooker in the Ferrari,and then.....
Well ,a Gazelle is exactly the same,you wanna go back for more...every day...
There are a few `downsides`,but you won`t regret it,as long as the wife/partner etc doesn`t know about it....
I started test -flying Gaz`s in `71,last flew one in 73`,but she is still there as the one I wanna meet again,just like that `hooker in....

Compared with the Gazelle, how does the 500 handle in flight?

Earl

The 500 probably is more agile than a 341 as a tail rotor is more effective than a fenestron. The 500 gives you more feel as there are no hydraulics but that is only if you keep it in trim. 341 seats are awful if you are tall, hunches you up too much, rear pax hate the lack of knee room. 500 better pilot position if you have descent seat squabs ( aero oregon) back of 500 has better knee room but awful vis and headroom due to transmission. 500 is way cheaper to run as they are still made and use less fuel. 500 just has the edge on straight line speed 130 v 135 although both machines will tell you they don't like you pulling that much power. I m sure others with more experience on type will differ ( I have 1500 on a 500 and about 500 on a 341)
AS for doors on a 341, when at Wallop we always did rotors running changes, have done 3 Silverstone's with Cheque Air using gazelles always did rotors running changes never a problem.

Having said all the above both were designed in the 60's and will outfly anything with a more recent design, what does that say about the " industry":ugh:

EoR,

What is with this 'Zell' business??? :=

No-one I know has ever, but never, called the Gazelle in that manner. Gaz maybe, and often some unprintable epithets, but yours is a new one :hmm: