Leave helicopter rotor running
Avoid imitations
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Ascend, in view of this being a national emergency it does seemed strange logic not to go to the temporary extra trouble (or perhaps, extra expense?) of having ground crew available.
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I did it in Ireland at a remote fuel store, walking around the nose of the B206, slipped on wet grass, grabbed out at anything to stop myself falling, and ended up grabbing the pitot tube (obviously not on purpose...). End result, was muddy trousers, 3rd degree burns to my hand, and still having to complete the flight as tasked. I decided that quite a few holes in the 'Swiss-Cheese' had lined up that day, and never did it again.
I saw similar to this in NZ. We were on holiday and had just parked on a corner of the public car park at an airfield (my young sons wanted to look at the aircraft; it was a wet and windy day so we stayed in the car). As we stopped, a single Squirrel landed ten metres from us on the airport grass, adjacent to an unlocked gate in the one metre high fence. The pilot put the rotors to idle then to my increasing surprise got out...
(SNIP)
...Because it was a gusty day I soon became concerned that the rotors might flap and strike the tail boom, or worse. I reversed my car away to put a bit more space between us..
(SNIP)
...Because it was a gusty day I soon became concerned that the rotors might flap and strike the tail boom, or worse. I reversed my car away to put a bit more space between us..
Whenever I read stuff like this I always laugh and think, "Don't people understand how a rotor works...how the cyclic works? Do they actually think that an immobilized cyclic will allow the rotor to flap all over the place with no control? Have they ever been sitting in an idling helicopter and had that happen?"
Helicopter pilots...especially helicopter pilots...should understand that the whole cyclic/swash plate thingee is specifically designed to control the tip-path plane. If the tip-path plane is displaced, it is the position of the cyclic (and the flapping/feathering design of our rotor systems) that brings it back to its original setting. It's pretty simple: if the cyclic doesn't move, the tip-path plane won't move. Or won't move much. In 11,000+ hours, I've never once...not once been sitting in an idling helicopter and had the rotor do something strange in response to "a gust of wind." Yeah, sometimes a "big ship" would land next to me and the rotor would momentarily get a little goofy, but it always sorted itself out in a revolution or two...certainly by the time I grabbed the controls. Never have I had to make any inputs to correct my wildly diverging tip-path plane. Because it doesn't happen...if the cyclic doesn't move.
It is a paranoid myth to think that in an idling helicopter with the cyclic secured, the rotor will react inappropriately to a rogue "gust of wind." It just does not happen.
Set it down on solid ground, put it in IDLE, lock the controls, and then do what you gotta do. If it's never spontaneously exploded, rolled over, or beaten itself to death with you inside of it, it's not going to do any of those things with you absent.
I have a friend who tells a hilarious story about coming back to base after a day of (unspecified) utility flying. His passenger happened to be a chick from the government...let's say "agency" he was contracted to that day. According to him, she was hot and he was trying to impress her. But on the way back to base, he started to feel this...you know...urge. Normally, he would've just set it down in a remote area, of which there were plenty in that part of the U.S., and then gotten out to do his business. But according to the rules they were operating under, the chick *had* to be back at base by sundown, and they were already pushing it. So my friend held it. They get back to base. He lands, frictions everything down, leaves it running and tells her to just stay put. Then he hops out and runs...and I mean RUNS inside the hangar...and *almost* makes it to the men's room. Luckily, he's wearing a flight suit over his clothes, so it was merely a matter of disposing of the soiled items (to be retrieved later). But there was still some still-urgent business to take care of. All of this took time. And while it's happening, he knows that his helicopter is still out on the ramp, idling away, with a non-pilot chick in the passenger seat, wondering where the hell (NAME REDACTED) went? Ahh, first impressions! Eventually...finally!...he came back, shut the thing down and sent her on her way. Normally, he would've asked her out for drinks/dinner, but by then he just wasn't "in the mood." And I don't blame him.
His helicopter did not explode. They don't do that.
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When flying offshore to oil rigs in the Gulf of Mexico on windy days, a shut down was impossible. Even with a rotor brake, a slow turning rotor would flap and hit the tailboom of a Bell 47, Bell 206, Bell 205, Hughes 500, etc. Several times a day helicopters land on unmanned fuel platforms, sometimes with passengers, and the pilot gets out and self refuels with the engine at idle. This has been the norm for over 50 years.
Avoid imitations
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FH1100,
I’ve been flying rotary wing since 1979 and with as many hours as yourself I do have some small knowledge of how helicopters work. But thanks for your concern.
I’ve been flying rotary wing since 1979 and with as many hours as yourself I do have some small knowledge of how helicopters work. But thanks for your concern.
if the cyclic doesn't move, the tip-path plane won't move.
Try to transition from a hover into slow forward flight, just by initially adding some forward stick, but then bring it back to the middle and don't let it move. You start to move forward. Then the nose will flap up, you will stop moving forward, and then start moving backward, until the disc flaps away from the (tail)wind, the nose pitches down, you move forward again, the nose flaps up, and after one more cycle, the aircraft has crashed.
Because you did not move the cyclic.
it always sorted itself out in a revolution or two...certainly by the time I grabbed the controls.
Blades can indeed flap at low RPM, every rotorcraft pilot should know that, but I don't see how that would cause the helicopter to lift up unless the wind is REALLY strong. With the collective down, the blade pitch is 0 and the blades are generating no lift. Centripetal force is straightening the blades, not aerodynamic lift. An idling helicopter generates basically no downward air. People can enter/exit an idling helicopter easily without feeling like they're in a hurricane because it's not blowing air downwards, hence not generating lift.
Likewise a parked airplane generates no lift. However there have been occasions where extremely strong winds have actually made upwind-facing airplanes go airborne if they're not tied down, so the same could happen to an idling helicopter, but that would have to be a really strong wind of the sort you would never fly in anyway.
That said, personally I wouldn't ever be comfortable leaving an unattended helicopter running, but then again I'm not even comfortable leaving a car running unattended.
Likewise a parked airplane generates no lift. However there have been occasions where extremely strong winds have actually made upwind-facing airplanes go airborne if they're not tied down, so the same could happen to an idling helicopter, but that would have to be a really strong wind of the sort you would never fly in anyway.
That said, personally I wouldn't ever be comfortable leaving an unattended helicopter running, but then again I'm not even comfortable leaving a car running unattended.
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Many years ago I flew helicopters (B206, AS350) and we were allowed to leave the seat when :
1. The engine was at idle
2. Weather conditions were suitable
3. collective friction/lock was on
4. Cyclic friction on
5. and not mentioned above .. HYDRAULICS OFF ( due possible runaway)
I. Duke
1. The engine was at idle
2. Weather conditions were suitable
3. collective friction/lock was on
4. Cyclic friction on
5. and not mentioned above .. HYDRAULICS OFF ( due possible runaway)
I. Duke
When you are out in the bush fighting fires, there is no capacity for carrying another person in the aircraft - otherwise you are dropping 90kg less water. And when you are directed to go to another fire, and then refuel at a bunch of drums sitting there by themselves, you aren't able to get your ground crew to gallop over to this new place to pump your fuel for you.
essential to the safety of the helicopter or of the persons on, or in the vicinity of, the helicopter;
3.3 Unless subsection 7 of Civil Aviation Order section 95.7 applies, a pilot with a licence that is valid for the helicopter must, at all times, be at the controls of the helicopter while refuelling is carried out.
7 Exemption from general requirement for pilot to be at controls
7.1 If the condition set out in paragraph 7.2 is complied with, a helicopter is exempt from compliance with subregulation 225 (1) (but not subregulation 225 (2)) and subregulation 230 (2) of the regulations.
7.2 The exemption given by paragraph 7.1, in relation to a helicopter, is subject to the condition that a pilot must, from the time of starting the engine or engines until the time of stopping the engine or engines at the end of the flight, be at the controls of the helicopter unless:
(a) the helicopter is fitted with skid type landing gear; and
(b) the helicopter is fitted with a serviceable means of locking the cyclic and collective controls; and
(c) if a passenger occupies a control seat fitted with fully or partially functioning controls or is seated in a position where he or she is able to interfere with such controls, the controls are locked and the pilot is satisfied that the passenger will not interfere with the controls; and
(d) the pilot considers that his or her absence from the cockpit is essential to the safety of the helicopter or of the persons on, or in the vicinity of, the helicopter; and
(e) the pilot remains in the immediate vicinity of the helicopter.
7.1 If the condition set out in paragraph 7.2 is complied with, a helicopter is exempt from compliance with subregulation 225 (1) (but not subregulation 225 (2)) and subregulation 230 (2) of the regulations.
7.2 The exemption given by paragraph 7.1, in relation to a helicopter, is subject to the condition that a pilot must, from the time of starting the engine or engines until the time of stopping the engine or engines at the end of the flight, be at the controls of the helicopter unless:
(a) the helicopter is fitted with skid type landing gear; and
(b) the helicopter is fitted with a serviceable means of locking the cyclic and collective controls; and
(c) if a passenger occupies a control seat fitted with fully or partially functioning controls or is seated in a position where he or she is able to interfere with such controls, the controls are locked and the pilot is satisfied that the passenger will not interfere with the controls; and
(d) the pilot considers that his or her absence from the cockpit is essential to the safety of the helicopter or of the persons on, or in the vicinity of, the helicopter; and
(e) the pilot remains in the immediate vicinity of the helicopter.
“The pilot considers” and the conditions of 95.7 override 20.10 as it sez.
“Safety of the helicopter” would come under not allowing some ******** to refuel it.
“Safety of the helicopter” would come under not allowing some ******** to refuel it.
If you had a prearranged fuel dump, the operator should have a refueller on the ground.
The fuel was put there by the local BP supplier, who would travel between dumps, replacing empty drums. He didn't have people to be left at each site in case a chopper dropped in. He left a pump and testing kit at each dump. Nice guy, he did it off his own bat, this was in the 9os before the whole show was a lot better organised. Shane Fitzsimmons was just another nice guy in the fire service, he didn't know he would be Commissioner down the track.
Avoid imitations
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I’ve often wondered how “the obvious” emergency of a fire when self refuelling a running helicopter would be dealt with.
Possibly why some have regulated the presence of a suitable fire crew. But that costs money unfortunately and nothing ruins the profitability of an organisation than wasting money on unnecessary safety precautions.
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You just take that little handheld fire cylinder and wave it about a bit. Problem sorted
Possibly why some have regulated the presence of a suitable fire crew. But that costs money unfortunately and nothing ruins the profitability of an organisation than wasting money on unnecessary safety precautions.
Possibly why some have regulated the presence of a suitable fire crew. But that costs money unfortunately and nothing ruins the profitability of an organisation than wasting money on unnecessary safety precautions.
Even if you have a pilot at the controls and the thing catches fire, what are you going to do? Take off with a burning helicopter, or hop out and wave that little hand held fire extinguisher around until it runs out, then watch the thing burn.... Considering a 30,000ltr fuel tanker only needs a couple of 9kg bottles while they are refuelling a petrol station, and that somehow makes them "safe", with NO fire crew around, and lots of idiots driving cars and motorbikes around them, i don't think that hot refuelling a helicopter is any more dangerous...
while we have all heard of helicopters going for a fly by themselves, even if it is because the pilot got out with the rotor at 100%!!!
how many of you guys can recall a JetA1 fuelled machine catching fire while hot refuelling?
how many of you guys can recall a JetA1 fuelled machine catching fire while hot refuelling?
So, even cold refuelling while wearing protective gear is dangerous.
Assess the risk, do the job if the risk is low enough to warrant it. For the risk-averse, there is a nice safe office job in the government somewhere.
If it is integral to an operation, why a trained ground crew member can't be used does not make much sense.
Aircraft have procedures for fire management, how would a pilot external to the aircraft be able to quickly follow them?
I could imagine trying to explain that one to the insurance company, but then it is illegal here, so there is ground grew with a semi-decent method of extinguishing, or delaying the fire.
Bell-Ringer, in a small business of 3 pilots, where do we find a ground crew to park out in the boonies next to some fuel drums to wait hours for an aircraft to perhaps drop in? Plenty of dumps to choose from, use the nearest one to where your water source is. Our machines got moved around from fire to fire, maybe leaving your imaginary fuel helper without a ride home, and the fuel truck driver didn't have a pile of people to leave in the bush either.
Perhaps you have not operated on a fire, hmmm? This was in the 90s, Mister Banks. Using B206 with 500 lt Bambi buckets. Things are a bit different now, but then it was a huge learning curve. People have managed to get the RFS into a much better way of working with operators.
All very well to sit back and spout HR-developed plans that cover every eventuality with rose petals, but it's a bit like war - as soon as the first shot is fired, the plan turns to dust.
But one thing really got my goat. At Silverdale, in the Blue Mountains, there was a large staging base with fuel, and support people providing sandwiches and drinks. One particular operator would leave the aircraft turning and burning while the pilots sat under a tree having their lunch, and billing the RFS for the engine time. THAT was offside. Blow the whistle, Ref.
Perhaps you have not operated on a fire, hmmm? This was in the 90s, Mister Banks. Using B206 with 500 lt Bambi buckets. Things are a bit different now, but then it was a huge learning curve. People have managed to get the RFS into a much better way of working with operators.
All very well to sit back and spout HR-developed plans that cover every eventuality with rose petals, but it's a bit like war - as soon as the first shot is fired, the plan turns to dust.
But one thing really got my goat. At Silverdale, in the Blue Mountains, there was a large staging base with fuel, and support people providing sandwiches and drinks. One particular operator would leave the aircraft turning and burning while the pilots sat under a tree having their lunch, and billing the RFS for the engine time. THAT was offside. Blow the whistle, Ref.
how many of you guys can recall a JetA1 fuelled machine catching fire while hot refuelling
Assess the risk, do the job if the risk is low enough to warrant it. For the risk-averse, there is a nice safe office job in the government somewhere
A rare event, but undertaken safely if the necessary precautions are taken. Never saw a helo refuelled while shut down in Vietnam, it was always hot refuelling, seeing a line of mortars walking down the POL line was one incentive. Was not aware of any untoward events until reading this report today.
Many years ago I flew helicopters (B206, AS350) and we were allowed to leave the seat when :
1. The engine was at idle
2. Weather conditions were suitable
3. collective friction/lock was on
4. Cyclic friction on
5. and not mentioned above .. HYDRAULICS OFF ( due possible runaway)
I. Duke
1. The engine was at idle
2. Weather conditions were suitable
3. collective friction/lock was on
4. Cyclic friction on
5. and not mentioned above .. HYDRAULICS OFF ( due possible runaway)
I. Duke
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