Kobe Bryant killed in S76 crash

[MarcK]

91.155(a)
For helicopters:
Day 1⁄2 statute mile Clear of clouds

91.157 (Special VFR) eliminates the visibility requirement, but they were not SVFR.

Amdt. 91-330A, 79 FR 41125, July 15, 2014

[Musician]

Originally Posted by Arnie Madsen

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Interesting to note impact scene from the NTSB video posted by Airbubba ..... the main rotor blades appear to be at the initial impact site and the remainder of the fuselage bounced and landed a bit farther away ...... could that indicate inverted flight at impact ??
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From Ms Homendy's second media briefing as uploaded to the NTSBgov youtube channel, I understood that the debris field is 500-600 ft long, and is comprised of tail, impact crater at ~1080ft alt, hillcrest, fuselage, main rotor.

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50

This pilot was likely very used to all of the ins and outs, and nuances, of the LA flying area: the traffic density, the way the fog rolls in, when and how, major and minor roads ...
He was in an around it for years.
So what made this flight different?
It is unfortunate that there isn't a CVR or FDR for the NTSB to consult.
I'll be interested to see what they come up with.

I was about to ask if this helicopter had a CVR/FDR (but figured I should go back a few pages to see if it was already answered).
Which sort of begs the question, why not? I would think any aircraft that is being operated "for hire" should be so equipped...

[Musician]

METAR for Camarillo
In his conversation with ATC, the pilot mentions that he wants to fly to Camarillo, the airport there is under 10 miles from Bryant's Mamba Sports Academy, where the passengers were alledgedly headed. From the METARs, it looks like if they'd gotten there, they could've landed?

Data at: 1800 UTC 26 Jan 2020
METAR for: KCMA (Camarillo Arpt, CA, US)
Text: KCMA 261755Z 03003KT 4SM HZ OVC017 15/11 A3019 RMK AO2 SLP233 T01500106 10150 20117 53017
Temperature: 15.0°C ( 59°F) Dewpoint: 10.6°C ( 51°F) [RH = 75%] Pressure (altimeter): 30.19 inches Hg (1022.4 mb) [Sea level pressure: 1023.3 mb]
Winds: from the NNE (30 degrees) at 3 MPH (3 knots; 1.5 m/s)
Visibility: 4 sm ( 6 km)
Ceiling: 1700 feet AGL
Clouds: overcast cloud deck at 1700 feet AGL
Weather: HZ (haze)

Text: KCMA 261705Z 08007KT 4SM HZ OVC016 14/11 A3017 RMK AO2 T01390106
Temperature: 13.9°C ( 57°F) Dewpoint: 10.6°C ( 51°F) [RH = 80%] Pressure (altimeter): 30.17 inches Hg (1021.8 mb)
Winds: from the E (80 degrees) at 8 MPH (7 knots; 3.6 m/s)
Visibility: 4 sm ( 6 km) Ceiling: 1600 feet AGL
Clouds: overcast cloud deck at 1600 feet AGL
Weather: HZ (haze)

Text: KCMA 261655Z 08008KT 4SM HZ OVC014 14/11 A3017 RMK AO2 SLP225 T01390106
Temperature: 13.9°C ( 57°F) Dewpoint: 10.6°C ( 51°F) [RH = 80%] Pressure (altimeter): 30.17 inches Hg (1021.8 mb) [Sea level pressure: 1022.5 mb]
Winds: from the E (80 degrees) at 9 MPH (8 knots; 4.1 m/s)
Visibility: 4 sm ( 6 km)
Ceiling: 1400 feet AGL
Clouds: overcast cloud deck at 1400 feet AGL
Weather: HZ (haze)

Text: KCMA 261555Z 07003KT 4SM HZ OVC013 14/11 A3016 RMK AO2 SLP221 T01390106
Temperature: 13.9°C ( 57°F) Dewpoint: 10.6°C ( 51°F) [RH = 80%] Pressure (altimeter): 30.16 inches Hg (1021.4 mb) [Sea level pressure: 1022.1 mb]
Winds: from the ENE (70 degrees) at 3 MPH (3 knots; 1.5 m/s)
Visibility: 4 sm ( 6 km)
Ceiling: 1300 feet AGL
Clouds: overcast cloud deck at 1300 feet AGL
Weather: HZ (haze)

1705Z is 9:05am, 1755Z is 9:55am LA time, I believe. The flight started at 9:06 and ended at ~9:45.

[Hedge36]

Originally Posted by tdracer

I was about to ask if this helicopter had a CVR/FDR (but figured I should go back a few pages to see if it was already answered).
Which sort of begs the question, why not? I would think any aircraft that is being operated "for hire" should be so equipped...

But since it isn't required, the money is not spent.

[Musician]

From the NTSB briefing just now, it emerged that N72EX was operated as a part 135 VFR charter. The NTSB does not yet know how well the IFR instruments in the helicopter were maintained (but they have retrieved the maintenance records and other paperwork carried on the aircraft).

I believe that part 135 helicopter pilots are (were?) supposed to be trained in recovery from inadvertant instrument metereological conditions (IIMC).
https://www.faa.gov/documentlibrary/...n_8900.437.pdf
Is that actually being done regularly?

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by Hedge36

But since it isn't required, the money is not spent.

Why isn't it required on a for-hire aircraft? We're not talking a small, inexpensive GA aircraft - we're talking a good sized, multi-million dollar helicopter that's being used to haul paying passengers - why would this be any different than a small regional jet?

[malabo]

You Tube

NTSB update


and flight path visualization. NTSB stated aircraft had climbed to 2300’ on a southerly heading before descending steeply to impact in a left bank at 1100’.

You Tube

[Airbubba]

Some notes from NTSB Member Homendy's latest media conference.

All significant components of the aircraft have been located at the crash site indicating that the helo was intact upon impact with terrain.

An iPad and a cellphone were recovered but it is not known if they belonged to the pilot.

Investigators flew the final part of the flight path with a drone to collect data.

The wreckage has been removed by a recovery crew and will be trucked to a secure location for further analysis. The site has been turned over to local authorities.

There was a 3 pm conference call with the families to update them on the progress and procedure of the investigation. No names or details of the call will be released.

The pilot listed 8200 hours total time on his July 2019 medical application. He had 1250 hours in the S-76 and had been with Island Express for ten years. He flew SNA-CMA the day before the accident but took a more direct route.

The descent rate of the helicopter prior to impact was greater than 2000 feet per minute. It impacted in a descending left bank.

In ten days a preliminary report will be issued, a final report in 10-18 months. Emergency recommendations will be issued prior if warranted.

The NTSB has previously recommended that all turbine powered rotorcraft with six or more seats be required to have Terrain Awareness and Warning System (TAWS).

The NTSB has also recommended that all Part 91 and Part 135 rotorcraft be required to have a CVR and FDR.

The FAA did not adopt either recommendation.

The helicopter missed the top of the hill it hit by 20 or 30 feet but there are other hills around so no conclusion should be drawn from that observation.

[Gomrath]

Originally Posted by kenish

Thanks for the clarifications to my post. You were very close to the location and time of the crash. It was unusually damp here in Orange County too; as mentioned I was mountain biking. We started in dense fog around 1000MSL and broke out of the top at around 1300 where it was 20+ mile visibility but under a higher broken layer. Sounds like the ground fog layer was a lot thicker in your area.

It was foggy and quite grim and had been that way since dawn, so it wasn't a case of the weather deteriorating since the pilot left SNA.
VNY and BUR were IMC. I would have expected CMA to not have been much better as it sits in the Camarillo plain. Scud running would not have been wise on that 15 mile stretch of the 101 with 2000 foot peaks so close..
​​​​​​

[Gomelgo]

There is audio of the last seconds of the flight before impact via nest camera.
it is on twitter under Bill Melugin, with Fox LA who retweeted him. I can’t post links yet.

Twitter

[Airbubba]

Here's the NTSB video release of the Tuesday media briefing.

You Tube

[neville_nobody]

What is the point of being a high net worth individual owning a multi million dollar twin turbine helicopter to then sign up with a VFR only operator?

[Bell_ringer]

Did he own it? The owner is listed as Island express holding corp of which the operator is a subsidiary.

[Musician]

The Sikorsky S-76B helicopter that Bryant's group was flying in was built in 1991. It was initially owned by the state of Illinois, but the state auctioned it off in the summer of 2015 for $515,161.

The winning bid came from a user named "Jimbagge1" — and Jim Bagge is an executive at Island Express Holding, a California company that holds the FAA registration for the helicopter: N72EX.

Source: https://www.npr.org/2020/01/27/80010...t-and-8-others

[Squawk7700]

Originally Posted by neville_nobody

What is the point of being a high net worth individual owning a multi million dollar twin turbine helicopter to then sign up with a VFR only operator?

Because these things make little difference in the end...

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www....al-crash%3famp

[Bell_ringer]

What was Bryant’s aviation background? You’re assuming that because he was a sportsman with cash that he should be aware. For most, a helicopter is a helicopter.
Remember what happened with the Sala crash?

[SLFMS]

Not speculating here but many have said if it was inadvertant IMC as the pilot was trained he should have had no issue transiting to instruments and climbing to MSA.
I had a flight in a fully serviceable IFR helicopter where I had flown though an uncomfortable weather band. Upon exiting the band I experienced a single auto pilot failure which rendered the flight director unusable. The only real option in the location with no suitable landing sites was to return to base and try to fly VFR under the weather.
​​​Unfortunately the visibility was about the worst I've experienced with a combination of heavy drizzle low cloud and fading light.
The area I knew very well and was comfortable flying around. A plan was made including the minimum altitude I would descend to as well as a plan for IIMC.
I call in this instance advertant IMC as it really wasn't unexpected when we flew into cloud.

What surprised me was how difficult it was to transition onto instruments even though I knew it was coming. Initial SOPs followed, climb initiated everything was harder as no FD (something we did train for) but getting on the instruments was hard, I was stressed and found picking up the scan difficult as well as setting stable attitudes. Now I had to talk on the radio pretty quickly then I noticed after climbing 300ft I'd flattened off and had missed it, only for seconds maybe 10-20 but it all counts below the MSA.

​​

My point is trained or not, transitioning to an IFR scan isn't always easy. Even where I had been IMC 25 minutes before. We are all human and what may be simple one day or easy in a SIM session can be difficult on the next.
It was a real unpleasant surprise how difficult it was on that day. We were not in any danger from terrain but I knew I was behind the aircraft and quickly trying to catch up.

I think it's quiet feasible an experienced IFR pilot in an IFR helicopter can come unstuck performing what would seem a simple manoeuver.

Note, I'm not saying or implying this is what happened rather am making a general statement in regards to IIMC.

[[email protected]]

Instrument flying in cloud is a very perishable skill and requires recency not just currency - especially for the situation when you hadn't planned on doing it but suddenly find yourself there.

You are right SLMFS - it is a tricky transition, especially if it happens in a turn - that can be very disorientating.

It would be interesting to know when the pilot had last flown proper IMC (ie not under a hood)

If you're not prepared to transfer to instruments and fly IFR - DON'T go scud running!

[Search&Rescue]

Originally Posted by [email protected]

Instrument flying in cloud is a very perishable skill and requires recency not just currency - especially for the situation when you hadn't planned on doing it but suddenly find yourself there.

You are right SLMFS - it is a tricky transition, especially if it happens in a turn - that can be very disorientating.

It would be interesting to know when the pilot had last flown proper IMC (ie not under a hood)

If you're not prepared to transfer to instruments and fly IFR - DON'T go scud running!

Totally agree Crab. Quick decisions sometimes... VMC or IMC? If it was IIMC and the pilot (or somebody) suddenly saw ”ground reference”... it would have been very tricky to divert back to VMC with that IAS and high turn rate for a left ”U-turn”. Especially when flying single pilot...