R44 Down at Hayward Exc Airport Pilot killed Student injured
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From what I've heard from those who do offshore risk assessments, that is, everything associated with offshore from drilling to production to whatever else, getting too and from the offshore installation by helicopter is the riskiest aspect of the whole shooting match. Whether helmets are worn or not.
This was during the period when the new owner (non-aviation guy) decided that all the managers had to have MBA's - which pretty much ruled out anyone who knew anything about helicopters.
A bunch of us just starting wearing them anyway.
And as SASLESS mentioned, helmets go a long way to reducing hearing damage.
The importance of head protection in every career or recreational pursuit is well known.
It took a long time to make them mandatory (in some parts of the world) on bikes, it is the reason cars have tons of airbags (the side airbag was invented after they worked out people were dieing of head injuries from side impacts).
In those days it was uncool to wear helmets on bikes, in some cases it still is considered uncool, but if you are prepared to humiliate yourself on a Harley with all that leather and tassels then a helmet is the least of your worries.
In recreational flying and training, helmets have the same problem, no one wants to be seen in one, hot environments and no air-conditioning don't help.
There is also the the thinking that accidents are few and far between and a good helmet costs a few flight hours so why waste the flight time.
The culture isn't going to change until regs require it, and I doubt regulators will as there just aren't enough people affected to justify it.
Perhaps insurance companies may start insisting on one being worn.
It took a long time to make them mandatory (in some parts of the world) on bikes, it is the reason cars have tons of airbags (the side airbag was invented after they worked out people were dieing of head injuries from side impacts).
In those days it was uncool to wear helmets on bikes, in some cases it still is considered uncool, but if you are prepared to humiliate yourself on a Harley with all that leather and tassels then a helmet is the least of your worries.
In recreational flying and training, helmets have the same problem, no one wants to be seen in one, hot environments and no air-conditioning don't help.
There is also the the thinking that accidents are few and far between and a good helmet costs a few flight hours so why waste the flight time.
The culture isn't going to change until regs require it, and I doubt regulators will as there just aren't enough people affected to justify it.
Perhaps insurance companies may start insisting on one being worn.
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I always wear a helmet, even for short maintenance flights. Mind you most of my flying is longline ops particularly drill moves. It’s 33c on the drill job I’m on at the moment, but having a proper fitting helmet I don’t feel any discomfort Feel totally naked without it. What price do you put on a head injury.
Why should regulations require helmet usage? Shouldn't certain decisions be left up to the people who will be affected by them?
This has been the case with pretty much every safety initiative since the dawn of time, as people, especially businesses, will avoid change because it is either inconvenient or it carries a cost.
There are still plenty of people that avoid seatbelts (and in aircraft, harnesses).
Last edited by Bell_ringer; 19th Jul 2019 at 08:34.
If being focussing on Safety First, Safest way always & good Airmanship, which includes wearing a Helmet gives You a swollen head, then I'm guilty of the first bits, but not the swollen head, been wearing XL for decades, thank You
Just do it!
Helmets are such a funny thing. Like many things we do it's all about perceived risk vs. real risk, ones' own personal limits for risk, and even about public perception and peer pressure.
For example, I, personally, would NEVER ride a motorcycle on the street without a full face helmet. NEVER. And I have proven to be religious about this, as I used to do the motorcycle work commute thing. And I don't have to, because I live where there are no helmet laws (thank goodness!) But I don't bother to put one on if I take a small dirtbike for a leisurely buzz up one of my trails in the woods. And I despise helmets for bicycling. I will freely admit to this bizarre behavior. From a safety standpoint I should wear an appropriate helmet for all of those activities. But I don't because I feel the risk/reward ratio tilts in the favor of no helmet for me except when on a street bike. The reward is, admittedly, likely to be considered a poor trade-off by many: a feeling of freedom, more physical comfort, better visibility, etc. And yet it tilts back the other way when riding a motorcycle on the street. I can't give you a purely logical argument for how and why I draw the line on helmets, only that I do, even being very well acquainted with the risks for all of these activities, as I was an EMT on a municipal ambulance service for eight years and saw all manner of non-helmet related injuries.
There is also public perception and peer pressure at play. Riding a sportbike and wearing a helmet is considered completely normal in the US. Riding a Harley and wearing a full face helmet not so much. Stupid? You bet. But people like to fit in. Luckily I'm a sportbike kind of guy!
Looking at helicopters, particularly small helicopters like the R44, I would certainly find the the use of a helmet uncomfortable. That alone stops me right there. I have made a risk/reward decision and it came down on the side of "no helmet". Maybe that's stupid, but it's my choice (until some nanny-state yahoo creates legislation--please, please don't do that!) And there would be potential perception issues that would cause some colleagues to find it pretentious and some passengers to worry, but those are lesser and less valid factors. But some people put a high value on "fitting in".
Finally we come to the money issue. Anyone coming up through the US civilian helicopter training world is well familiar with budding pilots who live hand to mouth, eat only Ramen noodles, wear ripped and dirty clothes, because nearly all of their money is being spent on helicopter instruction. These are the folks borrowing school headsets. They legitimately are not going to pony up for a $2500 helmet. Every dime goes to pay for helicopter and instructor time. This applies to many newly-minted CFIs, too.
So, since I can't fly a turbine, don't have a helmet and aren't wearing Nomex, I guess I should just stay in bed? OK, being a little snarky there. You can even get killed in bed
But, seriously, while it is perfectly reasonable to point out that we would all be safer with helmets, please recognize that it is not something that everyone wants to do, and please don't MAKE us do it if we don't want to unless we work for you and you demand it. That's fine, your playground, your rules. But otherwise...
All I can say is that my risk/reward line is drawn where I choose to draw it, even knowing and understanding all of the risks, and understanding that wearing a helmet is much safer (and I can afford one, a GOOD one, for every activity, too). It's a complex, personal decision that is not fully driven by logic.
For example, I, personally, would NEVER ride a motorcycle on the street without a full face helmet. NEVER. And I have proven to be religious about this, as I used to do the motorcycle work commute thing. And I don't have to, because I live where there are no helmet laws (thank goodness!) But I don't bother to put one on if I take a small dirtbike for a leisurely buzz up one of my trails in the woods. And I despise helmets for bicycling. I will freely admit to this bizarre behavior. From a safety standpoint I should wear an appropriate helmet for all of those activities. But I don't because I feel the risk/reward ratio tilts in the favor of no helmet for me except when on a street bike. The reward is, admittedly, likely to be considered a poor trade-off by many: a feeling of freedom, more physical comfort, better visibility, etc. And yet it tilts back the other way when riding a motorcycle on the street. I can't give you a purely logical argument for how and why I draw the line on helmets, only that I do, even being very well acquainted with the risks for all of these activities, as I was an EMT on a municipal ambulance service for eight years and saw all manner of non-helmet related injuries.
There is also public perception and peer pressure at play. Riding a sportbike and wearing a helmet is considered completely normal in the US. Riding a Harley and wearing a full face helmet not so much. Stupid? You bet. But people like to fit in. Luckily I'm a sportbike kind of guy!
Looking at helicopters, particularly small helicopters like the R44, I would certainly find the the use of a helmet uncomfortable. That alone stops me right there. I have made a risk/reward decision and it came down on the side of "no helmet". Maybe that's stupid, but it's my choice (until some nanny-state yahoo creates legislation--please, please don't do that!) And there would be potential perception issues that would cause some colleagues to find it pretentious and some passengers to worry, but those are lesser and less valid factors. But some people put a high value on "fitting in".
Finally we come to the money issue. Anyone coming up through the US civilian helicopter training world is well familiar with budding pilots who live hand to mouth, eat only Ramen noodles, wear ripped and dirty clothes, because nearly all of their money is being spent on helicopter instruction. These are the folks borrowing school headsets. They legitimately are not going to pony up for a $2500 helmet. Every dime goes to pay for helicopter and instructor time. This applies to many newly-minted CFIs, too.
So, since I can't fly a turbine, don't have a helmet and aren't wearing Nomex, I guess I should just stay in bed? OK, being a little snarky there. You can even get killed in bed
But, seriously, while it is perfectly reasonable to point out that we would all be safer with helmets, please recognize that it is not something that everyone wants to do, and please don't MAKE us do it if we don't want to unless we work for you and you demand it. That's fine, your playground, your rules. But otherwise...All I can say is that my risk/reward line is drawn where I choose to draw it, even knowing and understanding all of the risks, and understanding that wearing a helmet is much safer (and I can afford one, a GOOD one, for every activity, too). It's a complex, personal decision that is not fully driven by logic.
Dirt Bike riding without a crash hat is just silly. I ride mostly Mountain Bikes these days for exercise & man ow man I've lost the number of prangs I've had both on petrol powered & leg powered bikes...dented plenty of Helmets, broken a couple of fingers, lost a bitta bark from legs & but. Can they be a pain wearing? Yes sure, but nothing compared to the head/brain injuries I'd have suffered if I didn't wear one. Once upon a time seat-belts weren't even installed in cars, then later when they were, wearing was an option? Now we have pre-tensioners, air-bags, hefty fines for not wearing blah, blah, blah....Nuff said, safety is an evolving thing that all comes from blood being spilt. I on occasion ride a friends soft-tail Harley, with full-face black Helmet with an scull painted on it, yaaar damn Kool
Shoes can be uncomfortable as well as life-vests, yet You wear......why? Could it be for SAFETY or because it's required by law or company, maybe all of the above.....hmmmmm
Personal inconvenience & choice hey? How about it's in the company SOP's, insurance company requirement, fire department mandate etc. How many Utility, Ag, Seismic, Film, Long-line/VR, Police, EMS(Ozz), Military Pilot's fly as they please naked of their Helmet? NONE, there is a reason for this....statistics! Statistics have proven time & time again Your chance of a survival in a crash is greatly increased if You've donned the Dome onto thy head....Arguing about this is, is living in denial, just do it! Skip the weekend beers & movies, do some overtime, get a temporary second job & just factor it in; because You Love Life & respect Yourself enough to do the right thing, even if it's not a regulation (yet) (I have 2 Friends who survived crashes due to wearing a Helmet, the massive dent left in the Helmet from the AS350 grab-handle would have surely killed him or left him severely brain damaged. But he was smart enough to wear one even though it wasn't required & he is still flying today) Luck or being smart?
Enough ranting from me, have a great weekend!
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Interesting R44 article with statistics
Source: https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-...n-helicopters/
"The Robinson R44, the world’s best-selling civilian helicopter, has a long history of deadly crashes."
"The Robinson R44, the world’s best-selling civilian helicopter, has a long history of deadly crashes."
The abc7 news footage has a patch of ground in front of the wreckage blurred out as if there is a body there. I wonder if one of those on board was ejected during the crash sequence?
At one point (years ago), pilots in the offshore industry were discouraged by aviation advisors from wearing helmets (and virtually none wore them). For the reason being, if the passengers saw pilots wearing a flight helmet, they'd want to wear one also. Meaning, one provided to them for free and not bought by them. Easier for pilots not to wear them than supply one of correct fit for each passenger. Anyway, that was the thought process.
Re helmets I'm reminded of a story told at the sim. S-76 crashed for reasons I forget, and ended up rolled somewhat to the left, making it difficult for the co-pilot to get out. Captain exited and helped others to extricate the co-pilot, 45 minutes after the crash the Captain collapsed and was not able to be revived. When the aircraft hit on its left side his head had hit the broom closet inflicting an injury that was not readily apparent. Then there was the 412 in Alaska that had a blade pitch link separate and the vibrations put the crews heads through the overhead window, along with being bashed against the door pillar, fortunately wearing helmets. Me? I'd wear a helmet from choice and did wear one in the offshore in the latter days, I spent the $850. Good friend flew a Beech Baron into the side of a hill at night, was not wearing the shoulder strap and head hit the instrument panel. Bled to death and his body still warm when the wreckage was found six hours later. Held the round the world speed record in the Baron for a period of time.
A brain surgeon lecturing on road safety was of the private opinion that helmets should be worn in cars, for that was the source of the majority of his income. Could you see that becoming mandated? Not likely. The choice is yours when defining the level of risk you are willing to accept. A USAF pilot who got badly burnt following an overrun in a T-33 made a career of lecturing crews to wear natural fibre clothing as he had suffered badly from synthetic fibre burns. It's the little things that can change your life for ever.
Megan, helmets are significantly more expensive these days!
Gentex in the USA run about $US1600, Australian prices for the Alpha have gone ballistic with a runout sale from McDermotts up around $A2,500. I sold my Alpha and the fellow who bought it was more than happy as he was looking at >$A3,000 for what he wanted, new.
Gentex in the USA run about $US1600, Australian prices for the Alpha have gone ballistic with a runout sale from McDermotts up around $A2,500. I sold my Alpha and the fellow who bought it was more than happy as he was looking at >$A3,000 for what he wanted, new.
Alpha Eagle (owned by Gentex these days), and the Gentex HGU-56 are both around $2000 USD ex USA, in a dual visor configuration with the usual mic/earphone set-up.
Looking at at least 4 for the company now. Mandatory for our company ops shortly. I have always worn one regardless, other than early on while doing tourist ops.
What is your life worth? Everyone to their own though.
Looking at at least 4 for the company now. Mandatory for our company ops shortly. I have always worn one regardless, other than early on while doing tourist ops.
What is your life worth? Everyone to their own though.
The choice is yours when defining the level of risk you are willing to accept. A USAF pilot who got badly burnt following an overrun in a T-33 made a career of lecturing crews to wear natural fibre clothing as he had suffered badly from synthetic fibre burns. It's the little things that can change your life for ever.
It was a very good presentation as he was very entertaining while discussing a very serious topic....his dry sense of humor was very enjoyable.
Helmets are an excellent asset when it comes to head trauma events.
Many years ago I laid a motorcycle down at highway speed....killed the motorcycle in the process...and only got a few patches or road rash on me...but dented the Helmet on something hard like the concrete curb but no injury to my noggin.
I bought a new helmet as the other was no longer usable due to the "crush" damage to the interior cushioning material.....about two weeks later....I killed a Deer while riding to work before daylight. Again no damage to me despite my having head butted the Deer as the bike and I simultaneously hit the Deer.
Helmets will save your life....period.
Add NVG's and a Battery Pack...and you might encounter a situation where all that added weight could cause a serious or fatal neck/spinal cord injury however.
Partially to blame on the low adoption of helmets is the difficulty choosing and obtaining one in many parts or the world. At EUR 2,000 or more a shot you want to try for size and comfort. In our part of the world, I am not aware of a single place where you can do that.
This year I was in the market for a MSA350 helmet (as it was highly recommended by some of the Ppruners here). As I was travelling to Europe, I wrote to MSA Europe headoffice in Berlin, no response. Later I was going to the US. I contacted MSA US, and was told that the MSA350 helicopter helmet was only sold by MSA Singapore and was not available in the States.
This year I was in the market for a MSA350 helmet (as it was highly recommended by some of the Ppruners here). As I was travelling to Europe, I wrote to MSA Europe headoffice in Berlin, no response. Later I was going to the US. I contacted MSA US, and was told that the MSA350 helicopter helmet was only sold by MSA Singapore and was not available in the States.
This thread needs a little balance. I don’t wear a helmet. Offshore, instructing, fires, corporate, utility. I wore one EMS ‘cause it was required by contract (at our cost). Awkward to pack around for carry-on only baggage when touring. Is it safer to wear one? Sure, I have a whole row of helmets on a shelf, one for kiteboarding, one for road biking, one for mountain biking, two for motorcycle, one for skiing, etc.etc. In today’s world they should just graft one on your head at birth and be done with it. I’d wear one in helicopters east coast offshore just for the comfort standing out on the deck with a November 40 knot gale and sideways sleet. Or SAR/EMS if I needed somewhere to hang the NVG. Otherwise just leave me and vast majority of pilots alone. And you can go ahead and wear one anytime you want, in a car, in a 172, walking down hardwood stairs in wool socks.....
I agree, it is personal choice, and I'm not for more regulation, however due to where we fly, I have made it mandatory for our company.
We will supply a new helmet at no cost to our pilots, which after a reasonable period of employment they will get to keep.
We will supply a new helmet at no cost to our pilots, which after a reasonable period of employment they will get to keep.
I have a whole row of helmets on a shelf, one for kiteboarding, one for road biking, one for mountain biking, two for motorcycle, one for skiing
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-mick
