UAE SAR 139 Crash

[megan]

It’s ‘Inshallah’, by the way

It is and it isn't, SAS's spelling is also accepted, along with "Inchallah", perhaps not by a Arab scholar, but they appear on the web, books etc.

[Cows getting bigger]

Chaps, this is the UAE (where I fly a lot) and not Saudi, Kuwait or one of the other more stringent states. Painting one Islamic state the same colour as another is just plain wrong; it’s like saying Amish, Mormons and New Yorkers all have the same outlook as the are all American Christians.

My mother-in-law was an Irish Catholic and she would often use the phrase ‘God Willing’. Think on that whilst considering the bigotry.

[Ascend Charlie]

Hey Evil, you reckon we know the pilots?

[Evil Twin]

Possible Charlie, quite possible. And worse, the attitude displayed would lead to them flying into a wire they knew was there unfortunately

[Evil Twin]

Originally Posted by Ed Winchester

Wow. A lot of your posts are worth reading, Sasless. But quantity does not equal quality. And that last post smacks of ignorant racism and a lack of respect for fellow aviators. Sad.

Belief isn't a race Ed.

[Ed Winchester]

Originally Posted by Evil Twin

Belief isn't a race Ed.

I’ll edit my post, thank you for educating me.

[Bell_ringer]

Originally Posted by [email protected]

-the cause of more conflicts, arguments and lives lost than anything else in history -

Football comes in a close second

[SASless]

Crab,

Sam Clemens....aka Mark Twain had some very interesting views of religion.

Take a stroll down through some of them at the link below.

I very much embrace Twain's views on the topic....but then I did read all of his writings over the Years...books, letters, and performances.

Hal Holbrook did a great Impersonation of Twain that can be found at various place as a Video.


Mark Twain quotations - Religion


Let's not turn this into a discussion suitable for Jet Blast.....as we all should remember four people died in a very tragic manner....four people drawn from our community of Helicopter Pilots and Crew Members.

[[email protected]]

Very much with you regarding Twain's thoughts Sas

Something went wrong in that cockpit to lead to the wirestrike - distraction, disorientation, task focus - so many possible causes getting in the way of the prime function - fly the aircraft!

[SandBlaster214]

First, and as with any tragic accident such as this, heartfelt condolences to the families and friends and prayers the crew are at peace according to their belief(s). Second, I hope this isn't too far a drift from the thrust of the thread and/ or it doesn't cast a disparaging light on the crew or anyone else involved - it isn't intended to, but Crab activated the few of my remaining brain cells and I felt compelled to opine.

...so many possible causes getting in the way of the prime function - fly the aircraft!

Couldn't agree more, Crab. I still hang on to something passed on to me by an old friend and colleague. We were discussing simple ways of instilling that same "fly the aircraft" first mentality in the FNGs that seemed to have a growing fascination and fixation on the new whizbang gadgets and gizmos starting to appear (this was 1981 and I was picking up a new 212). He told me he still used the old and simplistic "CAR" acronym to make his point:

C: CONTROL the aircraft, A: ANALYSE the situation and R: RESOLVE/ REACT. He claimed, no matter what the situation, from the time you blast off til you walk off into the sunset while the rotors slowly coast down, you have to do things in that order, because; once you lose control - you're probably going to lose. Next, if you react before you analyse - in essence,
you're shooting in the dark, and while you may get lucky, chances are you're probably going to lose - especially in more advanced, multi-engine aircraft where your reactions may be an answer to multiple choice questions. Bottom line...

​​​​​​​

...fly the aircraft!

Now, I realize I'm an old hammerhead with mad cow disease and strong opinions and, notwithstanding a major catastrophic failure, sometimes situations aren't "that simple" but, and then again, maybe they are.

[212man]

Not at all. Not just us either: http://www.havkom.se/assets/reports/RL-2016_11e.pdf. In the absence of a “whoa, what was that?” Sudden positive g sensation, what would prompt you to stuff the nose down?

[gulliBell]

Originally Posted by [email protected]

..Something went wrong in that cockpit to lead to the wirestrike..

They had the luxury of 2 pilots and a navigator onboard, so you'd think they'd be able to navigate themselves around the obstacle that was printed on the map. Maybe the crew composition was part of the problem. Nothing crystallizes the senses more, flying single pilot, when you're the only bunny there to fly, navigate, communicate, and bottle wash, etc. Being responsible for everything, and not assuming somebody else is doing something he's not, keeps you wide eyed and bushy tailed and on your toes: nobody else to blame when something goes pear shaped.

[SASless]

212man......there are three AI's on that instrument panel.....why would one not take a peek at the old fashioned thing in the center of the panel and see which two of the three agree?

[megan]

Agree with Crab on this entirely. Totally avoidable tragedy

Trouble is, at the end of the day ALL accidents/incidents are totally avoidable. Am adverse to comments denigrating a crew, if we are honest with ourselves we have all made cock ups that could have, if circumstances were a little different, resulted in a tragic outcome. I've got my own wire story, and only because the Gods smiled did I come through with no damage to aircraft or body. You're only as good as your last flight, irrespective of hours or experience.

[gulliBell]

Originally Posted by megan

..Am adverse to comments denigrating a crew...you're only as good as your last flight, irrespective of hours or experience.

I guess that crew wasn't so good then as their last flight met about their demise.

(assuming they inadvertently flew into a known obstacle)

[Cyclic Hotline]

The entire sequence makes me wonder whether they were so fixated on identifying and avoiding the wires that they knew where there, that in searching for them they failed to spot them and instead inadvertently flew directly into them. Any pilot will attest to the difficulty (or even impossibility) of identifying known wires without the normal cues such as pylons or other landmark structures. In such a massive 3D space they may have been almost impossible to see, especially if you become focused on where you believe they are, rather than where they actually are. Even four sets of trained eyes is no guarantee of the outcome.

[Raffles S.A.]

Did they have a wirestrike kit fitted?

[gulliBell]

by the looks of it, yes...

[megan]

I guess that crew wasn't so good then as their last flight met about their demise

You're the pot calling the kettle gulli. Like the rest of us, you've done some extremely stupid things, and had them filmed I'm told.

[gulliBell]

Originally Posted by megan

You're the pot calling the kettle gulli. Like the rest of us, you've done some extremely stupid things, and had them filmed I'm told.

That's right...I almost flew the Prime Minister of PNG into the only power line within a thousand miles....lucky for me his security buffoon in the back saw it and said something about it in time for me to do something about it.