Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Rotorheads
Reload this Page >

Helicopter down outside Leicester City Football Club

Rotorheads A haven for helicopter professionals to discuss the things that affect them

Helicopter down outside Leicester City Football Club

Old 18th Dec 2018, 21:44
  #1141 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: USA
Age: 55
Posts: 464
Received 43 Likes on 29 Posts
Originally Posted by nodrama


55% reservoir quantity
Thanks ND - also, do you know if hot fluid is the only time an EP permits closing the main 1(2) SOV ?
Sir Korsky is offline  
Old 19th Dec 2018, 07:55
  #1142 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 321
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Sir Korsky
Thanks ND - also, do you know if hot fluid is the only time an EP permits closing the main 1(2) SOV ?
OPC ? 🙂

EP instructs main SOV closure for high fluid temperature and low fluid quantity (providing other system is serviceable)
nodrama is offline  
Old 19th Dec 2018, 12:34
  #1143 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Midlands
Posts: 136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by nodrama


Part of the above is incorrect (I was watching the football, pathetic penalty shoot-out). The nut on the servo end of the pitch control rod doesnít get touched during an actuator replacement. It is part of the hyd actuator component and assembled/ locked at manufacture of the component.
Yes, understood. That bit is clearly shown in the bulletin Figures.

In spite of the football, it was still a good explanation!
Pozidrive is offline  
Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:16
  #1144 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: USA
Age: 55
Posts: 464
Received 43 Likes on 29 Posts
Originally Posted by nodrama


OPC ? 🙂

Not quite, but thanks again for your answer. I'm just interested in evolution/progression of Augusta design logic.
Sir Korsky is offline  
Old 18th Jun 2020, 16:54
  #1145 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Boston
Age: 73
Posts: 443
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Have not seen any updates on investigation. Wondering if I missed something posted elsewhere.
Not sure when updates would be expected.
thanks
MurphyWasRight is offline  
Old 19th Jun 2020, 06:16
  #1146 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Manchester
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by MurphyWasRight
Have not seen any updates on investigation. Wondering if I missed something posted elsewhere.
Not sure when updates would be expected.
thanks
​​​​​​Still under investigation no new updates from the aaib since October, not even been changed to finalizing, they must be struggling with something in my opinion.

WuW

Last edited by W u W; 19th Jun 2020 at 16:26.
W u W is offline  
Old 19th Jun 2020, 16:22
  #1147 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 2,956
Received 17 Likes on 11 Posts
I suspect that Covid 19 hasnít helped with the speed of their investigations.
Bravo73 is offline  
Old 20th Jun 2020, 10:12
  #1148 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: UK
Age: 66
Posts: 919
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by W u W
​​​​​​Still under investigation no new updates from the aaib since October, not even been changed to finalizing, they must be struggling with something in my opinion.

WuW
Perhaps they are just baffled by how a heavily regulated supposedly ultra safe Cat A take off profile with all those engines can still manage to crash and burn...
chopjock is offline  
Old 20th Jun 2020, 13:42
  #1149 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Manchester
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by chopjock
Perhaps they are just baffled by how a heavily regulated supposedly ultra safe Cat A take off profile with all those engines can still manage to crash and burn...
Perhaps you are right chop, I have followed you for awhile, I can't help but think this is one rare instance that hindsight quick thinking thought processes couldn't of turned this pilot into a hero , I try to stay in the background on this forum, this thread gets to me, RIP to all involved.

WuW


Last edited by W u W; 25th Jun 2020 at 16:46.
W u W is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 00:14
  #1150 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Here
Posts: 961
Received 3 Likes on 2 Posts
Is this not the one where the tail rotor bearing failed resulting in the tail rotor not rotating anymore? What went wrong is known. The causal chain is not (yet public).
jimjim1 is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 00:25
  #1151 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NEW YORK
Posts: 1,352
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by chopjock
Perhaps they are just baffled by how a heavily regulated supposedly ultra safe Cat A take off profile with all those engines can still manage to crash and burn...

Exactly. Having a well supported private aircraft kill everyone on board during a routine takeoff does not inspire confidence.
Evidently there was no obvious design defect, so the investigators are now clutching at straws.
etudiant is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 08:02
  #1152 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: London
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by etudiant
Evidently there was no obvious design defect, so the investigators are now clutching at straws.
Your ‘Evidently’ interests me. What evidence are you referring to?
Monty Niveau is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 08:08
  #1153 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Manchester
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by jimjim1
Is this not the one where the tail rotor bearing failed resulting in the tail rotor not rotating anymore? What went wrong is known. The causal chain is not (yet public).
​​​​​I believe TR did not lose rpm but went full pitch. The chain of how that happened is all in this thread.

They could be clutching at straws struggling to try work out how a simple component (duplex bearing) can fail in away that's not been seen before and lead to such a catastrophic loss of control and what could be done to prevent it again. Just a opinion

WuW
W u W is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 08:58
  #1154 (permalink)  

Avoid imitations
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 14,572
Received 412 Likes on 217 Posts
Originally Posted by jimjim1
Is this not the one where the tail rotor bearing failed resulting in the tail rotor not rotating anymore? What went wrong is known. The causal chain is not (yet public).
No, it was a tail rotor control failure. The tail rotor continued turning but the blades ran to full negative pitch, which is worse than a failed tail rotor drive.
ShyTorque is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 09:38
  #1155 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: EGDC
Posts: 10,317
Received 622 Likes on 270 Posts
Perhaps they are just baffled by how a heavily regulated supposedly ultra safe Cat A take off profile with all those engines can still manage to crash and burn...
poor maintenance procedures will get you whatever other protections you put in place.

crab@SAAvn.co.uk is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 11:05
  #1156 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Den Haag
Age: 57
Posts: 6,244
Received 330 Likes on 183 Posts
Originally Posted by [email protected]
poor maintenance procedures will get you whatever other protections you put in place.
letís see if this component was ever touched after it left the factory - pretty low hours I think.
212man is online now  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 20:50
  #1157 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: London
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Well, none of the above should take anything like as long as the enormously expensive AAIB are taking. And I invite those who think, unhesitatingly, to defend the organisation, to pause for once and consider the facts.
Monty Niveau is offline  
Old 21st Jun 2020, 21:49
  #1158 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: EGDC
Posts: 10,317
Received 622 Likes on 270 Posts
letís see if this component was ever touched after it left the factory - pretty low hours I think.
That leaves you with poor design or incorrect installation - nothing you can do as a pilot will affect those.
crab@SAAvn.co.uk is offline  
Old 23rd Jun 2020, 07:59
  #1159 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: England & Scotland
Age: 63
Posts: 1,413
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Monty N

Slightly naive comment, as it is not just the technical members of the AAIB who determine when a report is released. I can think of delayed reports in the past where it has not been the AAIB or the investigation that were the problem, it was the lawyers for the party who appears to be "at fault" and thereby facing financial and reputational consequences, who then tried every avenue to "water down" the report findings before publication.

This particular airframe was one of the first in production, and it had reasonable use. One might therefore expect any issues in design, original build or maintenance scheduling to become apparent on an airframe like this. The information released so far indicates that a duplex bearing in the tail rotor control control mechanism failed and AW issued a service bulletin requiring this part to be checked in all 169 & 189 back in 2018. I guess that both AW and the AAIB know the result of that check, but to my knowledge that result has not been published. It would be interesting to hear from any owner or mechanic who can say what this check found.
John R81 is offline  
Old 23rd Jun 2020, 09:06
  #1160 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NEW YORK
Posts: 1,352
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by Monty Niveau
Your ĎEvidentlyí interests me. What evidence are you referring to?
The type was not grounded, nor was there any immediate service bulletin, as would have been expected had there been an obvious issue.
The cause, a duplex bearing failure, did get a service bulletin as noted by Jahn R81, as a result of the investigation.
etudiant is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.