SAR S-92 Missing Ireland
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It is a very sad story. Experiences and well known crew who were appreciated by all their peers. My sympathies to their collegues anf families.
Many of you are asking why they did an approach to BlackRock when in fact they wanted to take fuel at BlackSod. I think because of the weather, the ceiling was to low to do any kind of approach at Blacksod, therefore the crew elected to do an approach similar to a NDB ARA at BlackRock, and then proceed VFR/NVG to Blacksod. The reason they didn't do the similar approach at Blacksod is normally a NDB ARA have to be at a certain distance from shore to comply with obstacles clearance (between 10 n.m. and 14n.m.). For me it show that way the crew knew exactly what they were doing.
My two cents.
FH
Many of you are asking why they did an approach to BlackRock when in fact they wanted to take fuel at BlackSod. I think because of the weather, the ceiling was to low to do any kind of approach at Blacksod, therefore the crew elected to do an approach similar to a NDB ARA at BlackRock, and then proceed VFR/NVG to Blacksod. The reason they didn't do the similar approach at Blacksod is normally a NDB ARA have to be at a certain distance from shore to comply with obstacles clearance (between 10 n.m. and 14n.m.). For me it show that way the crew knew exactly what they were doing.
My two cents.
FH
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Questions on Survival Vests
As a former SAR pilot and RCC worker I was wondering if anyone can help with these questions regarding the survival vests worn by Irish CG crew:
What type survival beacon(s)/radios are carried in the vests?
I thought I saw on one posting that their survival beacon is a manual activation type; is that correct? Or is it an automatic type that activates upon immersion?
Is the inflatable part of the vest equipped with an AIS Man Overboard type beacon that activates upon inflation?
Replies to the thread ok with me or you can send it privately to me.
My condolences to all; especially to the families.
What type survival beacon(s)/radios are carried in the vests?
I thought I saw on one posting that their survival beacon is a manual activation type; is that correct? Or is it an automatic type that activates upon immersion?
Is the inflatable part of the vest equipped with an AIS Man Overboard type beacon that activates upon inflation?
Replies to the thread ok with me or you can send it privately to me.
My condolences to all; especially to the families.
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Hi Flying Head,
How come they never flew near BlackSOD though if this was the case?
Looking at AIS data there were about 5nm south of BlackSOD on track to BlackROCK. At no point on ATC or Coast Guard frequency did they say that they were approaching BlackROCK to get visual. 2 minutes before the crash as they commenced the 180 degrees turn the said that they were approaching BlackSOD. This indicates to me that the crew may have thought that they were approaching BlackSOD instead.
Just my interpretation of the evidence so far and I'm sure I could be far from the truth.
How come they never flew near BlackSOD though if this was the case?
Looking at AIS data there were about 5nm south of BlackSOD on track to BlackROCK. At no point on ATC or Coast Guard frequency did they say that they were approaching BlackROCK to get visual. 2 minutes before the crash as they commenced the 180 degrees turn the said that they were approaching BlackSOD. This indicates to me that the crew may have thought that they were approaching BlackSOD instead.
Just my interpretation of the evidence so far and I'm sure I could be far from the truth.
Flying Head - it maybe that they were using a legacy procedure that pre-dated the S-92, something that they used to do in that area in the S-61.
The S-92 is far more capable and could have easily conducted a letdown without routing via Blackrock but maybe it was just what they were used to doing.
I start to wonder if the AIS track West of Blackrock is just an anomaly and that they never went that far away from the rock before water impact - if there really was that much damage to the aircraft after hitting the rock then it would seem to have to render it unflyable.
As for the survival aspects, it is certainly possible to release your harness and egress the aircraft yet drown on the way to the surface - I don't know if Dara's lifejacket was inflated or not.
The S-92 is far more capable and could have easily conducted a letdown without routing via Blackrock but maybe it was just what they were used to doing.
I start to wonder if the AIS track West of Blackrock is just an anomaly and that they never went that far away from the rock before water impact - if there really was that much damage to the aircraft after hitting the rock then it would seem to have to render it unflyable.
As for the survival aspects, it is certainly possible to release your harness and egress the aircraft yet drown on the way to the surface - I don't know if Dara's lifejacket was inflated or not.
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I was just wondering could the Coastguard Controllers at Malin Head or Valentia who may be looking at Rescue 116 on their live AIS screens have contacted them on Marine Frequency and asked them why they were at Blackrock and not Blacksod or would they not get involved when they are going to land
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Hi GJOYT, if you know the weather is to low at Blacksod, why fly over, or like CRAB said maybe a pre dated procedure have been used. I think at this stage all theory are valid to a certain point. I hope the CVR/FDR will answer most of the questions!
Cheers
FH
Cheers
FH
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Seems we are presuming that there is no weather reporting at Blacksod - when I asked this some time ago no-one responded. Given that this is one of the few refuelling points on the north west coast and the presumably frequent poor weather, this is surely a major omission, the modest cost of which must be justified in the future. Furthermore, does anyone know if there was any ground to air RT at Blacksod? It's hard to believe a simple hand held receiver was not in use, but there again I have seen no reports of comms here.
And then we come to the critical issue of navigation. Given that there is a significant chance that this aircraft was not where its crew thought it was, I am astonished to gather from some posts that there is a possibility this S92 did not have a moving map display in the cockpit? Is this really the case? It seems incredible if so that a $20m aircraft can have less such kit than most single engined VFR helis. And such an omission may well be a major contributory factor in this accident.
And then we come to the critical issue of navigation. Given that there is a significant chance that this aircraft was not where its crew thought it was, I am astonished to gather from some posts that there is a possibility this S92 did not have a moving map display in the cockpit? Is this really the case? It seems incredible if so that a $20m aircraft can have less such kit than most single engined VFR helis. And such an omission may well be a major contributory factor in this accident.
Last edited by rotorspeed; 21st Mar 2017 at 20:35.
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There is weather reporting at Blacksod and the comms are marine VHF, I have heard other Helicopters going in for fuel at other times asking for the latest weather and visibility as they are coming in,there is also a remotely operated Coastguard Station at nearby Belmullet operated by Malin Head Coastguard Station
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Blacksod has an automatic weather station 10 miles from the lighthouse. It used to be at the lighthouse and it was the Blacksod Lighthouse forecast that they relied on to give the Go-ahead for the D-Day landings.
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There is weather reporting at Blacksod and the comms are marine VHF, I have heard other Helicopters going in for fuel at other times asking for the latest weather and visibility as they are coming in,there is also a remotely operated Coastguard Station at nearby Belmullet operated by Malin Head Coastguard Station
Coastal Reports - Met Éireann - The Irish Meteorological Service Online
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