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FADEC engine control

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FADEC engine control

Old 31st Dec 2016, 06:59
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FADEC engine control

I am having to compile an instructor technical pilot briefing and was wondering if anyone out knew what the first Helicopter type was that was fitted with a FADEC (or single channel EECU) engine control was?

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Old 31st Dec 2016, 09:11
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I think it maybe rotorway which may surprise some
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 09:49
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A good way to start your instructor technical pilot briefing might be to say that no helicopter has FADEC and explain why not
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 09:57
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While some 365ns3,ec155 and 139 have partial FADEC with a manual backup throttle.I thought the 92 was full FADEC.
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 10:38
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Way back then in the 1990´s, Eurocopter brought out their EC135´s with FADEC...

Looks like R&R were the first to work on a prototype:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FADEC
 
Old 31st Dec 2016, 10:44
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Lowfat.

The EC155 has no manual throttles at all. It's FADEC with an engine switch - OFF / IDLE / FLY. No manual reversion. The only "backup" available is to use the FADEC from the other engine.

OH
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 13:04
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S-76B (1984) - PT6B-36
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 13:47
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FADEC is one of those functions which is commonly misunderstood. In spite of what some manufacturer advertising brochures seem to say, many supposedly FADEC-equipped helicopters are not, which leads to this misunderstanding.
Real FADEC means that there is no secondary (back-up) engine control such as throttle levers (ECLs) or twist grips. All engine control is automatic, including failure modes.
Basically, if it has a single-channel EECU (or equivalent) it must have back-up controls since the engine fuel flow can only be controlled by the pilot in the event of a automatic control malfunction.
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 15:22
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Any engine control that has a reversion to manual or assisted manual is not completely FADEC.
Early Bell products were the 407 and the 430 with variants of the Allison (now RR) 250 (I believe the C-47 and C-40 respectively), they both had a reversion to fixed mode and via push button could be controlled via twist grip (single channel).
AW139 and AW119 use the PT-6, and are EEC rather than FADEC.
The AW189 with the T700 (or CT7) is fully dual channel FADEC.
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 15:40
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Exactly.

S76B is not FADEC since it has manual back-up.

I do not know of any PT-6 with FADEC but welcome information on one which is.
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 16:01
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Originally Posted by SilsoeSid
A good way to start your instructor technical pilot briefing might be to say that no helicopter has FADEC and explain why not
Why don't you give us the reason rather than veiled hints, so we can all benefit from your unbounded wisdom?
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 16:07
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What about the Westland Wessex or Whirlwind for EECU?
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 16:33
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Originally Posted by lowfat
...partial FADEC...
Wouldn't that be PADEC?
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 16:46
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PADEC....

Pilot Actuated Destructive Engine Control.
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 16:50
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I know a few of those.
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 18:53
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Originally Posted by obnoxio f*ckwit
Why don't you give us the reason rather than veiled hints, so we can all benefit from your unbounded wisdom?
... or you could read the three posts prior to your contribution
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 20:33
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think the EC175 is a full fadec pt6e

so im at about 3 helicopters with proper fadec... 155 s92 and ec175.

so im thinking the 155 is first true Fadec Helicopter
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 20:38
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Silso,
AW189, H175, S-92 are all two-channel full FADEC with no reversion to manual.
He read them and we explained the difference between single and dual channel FADEC control.
So, they do exist.
Now what's your explanation?
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 20:58
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H145 Dual Channel full FADEC as well... no manual controls.
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Old 31st Dec 2016, 21:37
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That's fine totti thanks, clearly I've misunderstood the FA part of the system, especially looking at the failure side of things.

FADEC Fail, close down engine?
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