Help for Westland Scout & Wasp book
Hi Sloppy link
I think we are at cross purposes, I saw the UK serials entry and I believe that to be wrong.
I recall the aircraft crashing as a result of jackstall not as a result of the anti coll beacon wiring issue. Furthermore I believe the accident sadly included fatalities not as reported elsewhere no fatalities. I am sure that at some point I did find an accident report that covered the fatal crash but I cant find it. Hence my confusion as to whether I have the correct serial number.
I did find this which refers to a stall but no details
http://www.hampshireairfields.co.uk/hancrash.html
Also this which refers to a stall and the light issue but does not mention an accident in connection with the light.
http://www.flyingmarines.com/3BAS_En...zelle_IFTU.htm
I think we are at cross purposes, I saw the UK serials entry and I believe that to be wrong.
I recall the aircraft crashing as a result of jackstall not as a result of the anti coll beacon wiring issue. Furthermore I believe the accident sadly included fatalities not as reported elsewhere no fatalities. I am sure that at some point I did find an accident report that covered the fatal crash but I cant find it. Hence my confusion as to whether I have the correct serial number.
I did find this which refers to a stall but no details
http://www.hampshireairfields.co.uk/hancrash.html
Also this which refers to a stall and the light issue but does not mention an accident in connection with the light.
http://www.flyingmarines.com/3BAS_En...zelle_IFTU.htm
Last edited by ericferret; 17th Sep 2016 at 21:39.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
SS;
[post with links to photos]
sl;
Regardless, archives do not show Scout in UN livery, armed with this information, we'll search again. That said, we are all volunteers and if we get it wrong, it is sometimes because we are looking in the wrong place or others have information and they haven't offered it or we haven't asked the right person. Record keeping from that time isn't an Excel spreadsheet with a Ctrl+F function.
Being proved wrong sometimes throws up more questions than it solves!
slb;
It took some searching
Definitely a Scout with UN colours
Obituary Lieutenant-Colonel-Allan-Corner
SLB
sl;
That, is an outstanding effort SLB, do you live near MW, we could do with that level of historical corpoarate knowledge. Meanwhile, I'll get the young pups back on to it. It'll cost a lot of Jaffa Cakes!
[post with links to photos]
sl;
Regardless, archives do not show Scout in UN livery, armed with this information, we'll search again. That said, we are all volunteers and if we get it wrong, it is sometimes because we are looking in the wrong place or others have information and they haven't offered it or we haven't asked the right person. Record keeping from that time isn't an Excel spreadsheet with a Ctrl+F function.
Being proved wrong sometimes throws up more questions than it solves!
slb;
It took some searching
Definitely a Scout with UN colours
Obituary Lieutenant-Colonel-Allan-Corner
SLB
sl;
That, is an outstanding effort SLB, do you live near MW, we could do with that level of historical corpoarate knowledge. Meanwhile, I'll get the young pups back on to it. It'll cost a lot of Jaffa Cakes!
Previous info & links removed, have this pic on me, happy hunting for all the other pictures
What is really annoying is to read a sequence of posts like this after finding and posting the information requested in the thread starting post. If you followed the information given on earlier posts you would have found pictures such as this;
Previous info & links removed, have this pic on me, happy hunting for all the other pictures
Previous info & links removed, have this pic on me, happy hunting for all the other pictures
Moving on, XW850 accident attributed to jackstall.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
That's a shame, we are going to miss your, polite, courteous and self-effacing posts.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Moving on, XW850 accident attributed to jackstall.
Experts eh!
Odd really as I believe that this accident had three fatalities.
Further to this I have information that suggests that the jack stall theory may well have been incorrect.
Further to this I have information that suggests that the jack stall theory may well have been incorrect.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
XW850 accident not attributed to wiring.
Archives, on initial search, had no records. Stand by for further.
Archives, on initial search, had no records. Stand by for further.
I recall the official report being brought up when I had a cockpit electrical fire/smoke incident in a Gazelle involving the anti col switch wiring.
The cause of mine was the extra kit added to the central instrument panel compressing the spring dampers and causing the wires to chafe and short, slightly different but similar department as the Fordingbridge incident.
I think that the accident to XW850 has become confused with the wiring incident.
Although I have not been able to find confirmation of it. I believe XW850 crashed after the pilot took avoiding action to prevent a collision with a Wessex. During that action the cyclic froze and the aircraft struck the ground resulting in the three back seaters being killed.
The accident was subsequently attributed to Jack stall and a modification to incorporate a hydraulic accumulator was embodied.
I accept that the report stands as by the time further information came to light the wreckage was long gone and so no direct link could be established.
Circa 1976 the sister ship XW851 was undergoing a major inspection at 70 Workshops. During that inspection a manufacturing defect was identified which involved
the stick friction at the base of the pilots stick. This defect caused the stick to jam solidly and no amount of force would allow it move rearwards. At the time a signal was sent to all squadrons operating the Gazelle to carry out an immediate inspection. I suppose there must be a record of that somewhere in Aircraft Branch or whatever it is called these days. One officer within 70 at that time was a Major Southern who I believe had been involved in the original crash investigation. He felt that the defect in 851 mirrored the pilots report from the 850 accident.
I have always wondered if anybody ever spoke to 850's pilot about this finding.
I recall that some doubt was thrown on his version of events and a positive finding of this nature may have been welcome.
This defect could actually remain dormant for years as a combination of friction setting and stick movement were required to induce the jam. At the time there was little contact between the military and the civilian world and no Airworthiness Directive was ever issued for civilian aircraft although they came off the same production line using similar parts. It is actually possible that even after all this time the defect could still be
present in some aircraft.
I am hoping that the three servicemen killed in the accident will be remembered on the forthcomming Memorial Wall at The Museum of Army Flying
The Memorial Wall
During this period a number of Air Techs were killed both in Northern Ireland and Germany.
Although I have not been able to find confirmation of it. I believe XW850 crashed after the pilot took avoiding action to prevent a collision with a Wessex. During that action the cyclic froze and the aircraft struck the ground resulting in the three back seaters being killed.
The accident was subsequently attributed to Jack stall and a modification to incorporate a hydraulic accumulator was embodied.
I accept that the report stands as by the time further information came to light the wreckage was long gone and so no direct link could be established.
Circa 1976 the sister ship XW851 was undergoing a major inspection at 70 Workshops. During that inspection a manufacturing defect was identified which involved
the stick friction at the base of the pilots stick. This defect caused the stick to jam solidly and no amount of force would allow it move rearwards. At the time a signal was sent to all squadrons operating the Gazelle to carry out an immediate inspection. I suppose there must be a record of that somewhere in Aircraft Branch or whatever it is called these days. One officer within 70 at that time was a Major Southern who I believe had been involved in the original crash investigation. He felt that the defect in 851 mirrored the pilots report from the 850 accident.
I have always wondered if anybody ever spoke to 850's pilot about this finding.
I recall that some doubt was thrown on his version of events and a positive finding of this nature may have been welcome.
This defect could actually remain dormant for years as a combination of friction setting and stick movement were required to induce the jam. At the time there was little contact between the military and the civilian world and no Airworthiness Directive was ever issued for civilian aircraft although they came off the same production line using similar parts. It is actually possible that even after all this time the defect could still be
present in some aircraft.
I am hoping that the three servicemen killed in the accident will be remembered on the forthcomming Memorial Wall at The Museum of Army Flying
The Memorial Wall
During this period a number of Air Techs were killed both in Northern Ireland and Germany.
To actually get back on topic for a while there is another small mystery involving the Scout. According to the link
UK Serials
Scout XV135 an ex 660 Sqdn Soest aircraft was scrapped in the Far East in the 80's.
However prior to 1979 a stripped out Scout fuselage lay on the fire dump at Middle Wallop.
Poking around I noticed that the anti slip walkway in the cockpit doors was outlined in a non standard orange paint. The only aircraft I had ever seen like that was XV135. All the panels had been removed, these would normally have the identification stencilled on them. However one panel remained thrown into the bottom of the aircraft, a panel from a tailboom. Stencilled on it was XV135.
A time machine would help at this point!!!
UK Serials
Scout XV135 an ex 660 Sqdn Soest aircraft was scrapped in the Far East in the 80's.
However prior to 1979 a stripped out Scout fuselage lay on the fire dump at Middle Wallop.
Poking around I noticed that the anti slip walkway in the cockpit doors was outlined in a non standard orange paint. The only aircraft I had ever seen like that was XV135. All the panels had been removed, these would normally have the identification stencilled on them. However one panel remained thrown into the bottom of the aircraft, a panel from a tailboom. Stencilled on it was XV135.
A time machine would help at this point!!!
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Well done guys - we got there in the end and proved that Scouts did operate in Cyprus in UN markings. Now the next question is, did these markings last long enough for a change in camo colours on the Scouts from brown/green to black/green?
